  Benjo Member Username: Benjo Post Number: 3 Registered: 02-2007 |
Ever since my job left the state, I've taken up delivering pizza to finish putting myself through college. On 2/23, while coming back from a delivery at 7 Mile and Hoover, I was pulled over by a Detroit cop for a small crack on the passenger side of my windshield and issued a citation. This put us behind all night, and nobody believed that it was a Detroit cop until I showed them the ticket. I got it fixed on Monday, and went to the Eastern District at Gunston and Gratiot to have the ticket signed. I was told that they didn't do this there anymore, and I would have to go to 36th district court (pain in the butt). For the heck of it, I called the district on Hancock and Woodward and was told that the Eastern District was giving me a line of BS, and I went there and had it fixed. For the first time in my life, I was treated with respect and dignity by the DPD. I used to wonder why insurance rates were so high, but as the years went by I came to realize that it's because most (not all) DPD officers are about as useful as a raincoat in the desert. When my brother's girlfriend's house by Balduck Park was broken into and the perpetrator tried to rape her they acted like it was her fault for living there, even when we told them the stores who had videotape of the man using her credit cards. When my tailgate was stolen from my truck two years ago, I had the sense to not even waste my time filing a report. I understand that the budget is stretched thin, but it would be more beneficial for the city in the long run to go after criminals rather than use the police to collect money from those who can't afford it. | ||
Barnesfoto Member Username: Barnesfoto Post Number: 3114 Registered: 10-2003 |
It would also be more beneficial the city to employ people who live in the city; it might make them a bit more sympathetic to the plight of people like your brother's girlfriend...(thank the repugnikans for helping eliminate those unjust residency requirements). What we have now seem to be an overstretched pool of mercenaries devoted to revenue generation. Be careful out there, Benjo. | ||
Ordinary Member Username: Ordinary Post Number: 150 Registered: 06-2006 |
Barnesfoto, That is totally ridiculous. What does living in the city have to do with being sympathetic? I got pulled over by Tiger Stadium a few years back during my lunch hour and the cop who pulled me over was being exceptionally rude. I'm pretty sure he was seeing how far he could push me before I told him to f--- off. I had to go to 36th District Court and somehow he wrote my information down wrong and the magistrate threw the whole thing out. Poetic justice. I never even thought about if he lived in the city or not. He was an a--hole no matter where he was from! | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 8457 Registered: 10-2003 |
Not sympathetic but caring about the neighborhoods. Here is something to consider. I know a couple cops that live outside the city. They have made it abundantly clear that they are not willing to risk themselves for the job and do not bother with smaller crime. They live in the suburbs. I also know a couple cops in my community who have told myself and the neighbors, "If you see anyone suspicious call me anytime and I will check it out" Maybe they are all unsympathetic but I can assure you that the DPD people that live in the city care much, much more about the city and the residents than the DPD officers that I know that live elsewhere. Not too hard to figure out. | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 337 Registered: 11-2006 |
I agree completely. I know a retired DPD cop, who could care less. He said he and his buddies faked their residency and didnt pay their taxes because the city "never checked". Now he is collecting his lovely pension from the CoD. Shame on the officers, shame on the city | ||
Barnesfoto Member Username: Barnesfoto Post Number: 3120 Registered: 10-2003 |
What does living in the city have to do with being sympathetic? LOTS. If you are living in the same city as the people you serve, you MIGHT just see them as your neighbors rather than your targets... And a cop who lives on your block may be less inclined to blame you being a crime victim b/c of where you live, Just an idea. | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 38 Registered: 05-2006 |
what about monsoon season? | ||
Southwestmap Member Username: Southwestmap Post Number: 724 Registered: 01-2005 |
I had a cop who lived across the street from me. He absolutely did not want to be called or contacted about most police stuff. He was "off-duty" and had issues with taking action of any kind. His bosses warned against it, i think. Most of the time he would be asked to intervene in domestic violence situations. He would not - too dangerous to get involved with neighbors in that way. The cops see the very worst of the city, day in and day out. They see the raped babies and beaten women, the prostitutes who cut their johns and the children who beat their grandmothers. Maybe we can cut them a little slack and let them have their time off in more peaceful situations than getting involved in more neighborhood problems | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 8460 Registered: 10-2003 |
SW - I don't blame the officer for wanting his free time to be his free time. But you also have to consider the care given to the community when he is on his shift. The few cops I know from the suburbs (and it may not represent the norm) have complete and utter contempt for anyone that lives in the city. In their minds only criminals and idiots live here. At least the officers that live here will be protecting their fellow citizens. They may not be the best officers but I can assure you that the officers that live here don't have the contempt for the decent citizens that some of their suburban counterparts have. | ||
Angry_dad Member Username: Angry_dad Post Number: 144 Registered: 02-2006 |
I don't live in the city but I can understand why a law man should. What I don't understand about Detroit is that the city council is voted on by at large instead of by districts. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 8461 Registered: 10-2003 |
None of us understand that. | ||
Detroitteacher Member Username: Detroitteacher Post Number: 950 Registered: 06-2006 |
Cops and Firemen used to have to live in city until about 10 yrs or so ago (if it was that long). I lived in a neighborhood with all cops and firemen and NOTHING exciting ever happened! We were safe, could leave our doors open all night, and we left bikes and toys all over the front yards. I guess would be bad apples weren't willing to risk breaking into, stealing from or otherwise causing trouble because they would have been shot. Having civil servants in the neighborhoods is a great idea. Maybe that way they would care a bit more about the community they serve. | ||
Ffdfd Member Username: Ffdfd Post Number: 44 Registered: 09-2006 |
So do you live in the city, DT, if it's such a great idea? Maybe if more teachers lived in the neighborhoods, kids would learn more. (I'm just razzin' ya.) Listen, I understand that it seems logical that cops would do a better job if they lived in the city. But it doesn't hold up in the real world. If we still had residency, those a-hole cops Jt1 knows would just live in one of the neighborhoods DT grew up in, and they would have that same contempt for the rest of the city that they have now. It all comes down to hiring good workers. It doesn't matter where those workers live, if they're conscientious they'll do a good job. Think about your own job and your approach to it. I know a lot of city workers who have moved to the suburbs in the last five years, and the ones who took their jobs seriously then take it just as seriously now. And the slugs, duckers and guys scamming the system -- who get my blood pressure up -- have both city and suburban addresses. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 26 Registered: 02-2007 |
All - my father and uncles were children of a Detroit cop, living in the City. They were required to live in the City. My grandparents' neighborhood was one that really went down hill, and I've heard lots of stories about how they and their property were singled out because neighbors knew that they were "cops." I've also heard stories about how my grandfather helped out his neighbors by calling in about abandoned cars and a drug house, and how he helped a lost senile woman get home. And I heard about how "drunk Reggie" would stand on their porch and yell about how he got tickets. Where I'm going with this is that home life was rough for the cop and his family. My dad and uncles left Detroit when they could, and my grandparents moved on a few years after he retired. The requirement for residency didn't accomplish anything except hold my family hostage in a city that didn't really want them. Anyone can agree (me too) with the principle that City workers live where they work, but is it ethical to put families in harm's way? Another issue (so my uncle told me) was that in th 70s and 80s suburbs were not allowed to require their police and fire to live in their communities because this would have chased off minority workers. If this was true then there was a big contradiction. | ||
Enduro Member Username: Enduro Post Number: 63 Registered: 11-2006 |
My parents street in Warrendale (as well as the neighborhood in general, I drive down some streets where I used to play occasionally) has gotten much worse since the residency change. I can't prove the connection but I know it made people feel better about the police, even if they kept a secondary address. | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 195 Registered: 11-2006 |
Ordinary if you would have told the antagonistic childish cop to f off or asked for i.d. you would have ended up handcuffed and jailed for disorderly conduct or some other bogus charge. In my case back in 98 to make a long story short some plainclothes cops in an unmarked car stopped me as I walked Woodward heading south toward 6 mile, and after listening to ignorant rude comments, with them asking disrespectful redundant questions I honestly believed they were rogue cops who thought I was gay; or drug addicts posing as cops. Next thing I know, after some protesting and asking for I.D. the cop on passenger side said no we aregoing to rob you! Next thing I know Im on the ground handcuffed as he casually walked over to my glasses and stepped on them hard enough to bend them out of shape. Once we got to the station I questioned their behaviour and their tone changed, the cop said show up for court and we will drop this.The cop that had asked me if I was "going to mess with the cross dressing faggots" said he didn't mean too lump them all in one group. Some of the guards seemed sympathetic and the head guard, when I inquired about filing a complaint lowered my bond to $37 which was refunded after I went through the inconvenience of going to court. They initially wrote me for disorderly conduct and flagging. | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 197 Registered: 11-2006 |
I strongly reccomend you all read the book Who Killed Detroit! by former Detroit chief of police Johannes Spreen. He very objectively lays some of the blame on law enforcemnt behaviours and attitudes. The decay of cities and social problems in the inner city are far more complex than they appear on the surface. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 28 Registered: 02-2007 |
TerryH, I have to ask: what in the hell were you doing on foot on Woodward at Six? | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 198 Registered: 11-2006 |
Craig I was an American in another part OF MY COUNTRY. Actually, I was without a vehicle and on a tight budget, so I used to take the bus to 7 mile where I would walk to a middle eastern restaurant that had great food for a great price. Then I would walk to Numbers after hours (the doors opened a little before 10 pm if I remember correctly. Numbers was mostly gay at that time but I liked the atmosphere and actually had some luck with the ladies. Bi and straight.Anyways, that is neither here nor there, too many Americans excuse police abuse and misconduct BECAUSE THEY DONT EXPERIENCE IT! Antagonistic cops make angry anti social citizens angrier and more anti social. I talked to one attorney but he wanted $800 up front to sue. If I could do it again or if I experience that behaviour again I will not let it slide. That behaviour on the part of those officers was ignorant and they deserve a taste of their own medicine. You should have seen officer Quassems ignorant childish behaviour in court. 11TH precint. | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 538 Registered: 12-2006 |
https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/62684/89637.html That lovely thread about how the Detroit Police were totally useless. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 31 Registered: 02-2007 |
I didn't live in Detroit for as long as most of you, but I did see some stuff. My grandfather, the cop, used to point people out and say: "he dosn't belong here." Funny thing is that the "he" was usually someone white coming into his neighborhood (drugs, stolen stuff, prostitution). Terry - maybe those cops were paying you a compliment, thinking that you didn't fit the profile for that 'hood. I'm no chicken, but if my car broke down over there I'd just start running. | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 200 Registered: 11-2006 |
There is nowhere in our country we dont belong. There are myriad legit reasons for a white person to be in 'the hood'. Picking up coworker; significant other; visiting relatives who didn;t take part in white flight; college students looking to save money e.g. New Center-Midtown; wrong turn; restaurant. Its dissapointing that youre grandfather assumed that about all Americans in their country Craig. Now,if residents are complaining about open air drug markets with a steady stream of customers, many of them who happen to be white thats one thing, other than that we shouldn't have to feel anxious of being mistreated by the police. Our country, compared to many other democracies is way too socially rigid and restrictive already. | ||
Makeer Member Username: Makeer Post Number: 2 Registered: 01-2007 |
There was a time when the criminals were all in Detroit and the berbs were afraid they were going to spread out to their communities. Now the criminals live in the berbs and put on uniforms to come back to Detroit. Same problem only different side of the badge. Seems like law enforcement is a game in Detroit. If you have not been screwed over yet you will be. If a honest review was ever done here over half of the force would be in jail them selves. That starts right at the top and goes right to the street cop. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 32 Registered: 02-2007 |
Terry - point of clarification: those who "didn't belong" were up to no good. I think that cops who are good at what they do can sense when someone is out of their element. A white guy driving slowly up Stout (almost no whites, or young one when I visited) was looking for something, but someone hustling along was probably cutting from Grand River down to the Jeffries. I would bet that unless the cops you saw really were rolling you that you looked like you were out of place and probably up to no good. Those cops get paid to keep order and stop crooks before they get started. For what it's worth, I was stopped going into my grandfather's hood, "driving while white" I suppose. "I'd probably look at you close, too," said grandpa. Makeer - something I learned in CJ. If you see a crooked cop you should call the FBI, the State Police or Internal Affairs. Someone might think that cops don't bust cops, but cops go to jail too. Remember Budzyn and Nevers, and then Sheriff Hackel's father too? Guess I'm saying speak up if you see a crook. | ||
Detroitteacher Member Username: Detroitteacher Post Number: 951 Registered: 06-2006 |
Ffdfd: I did live in the city for many many years. Some of the best times I had were of my "growing up years" with my fellow firebrats. I'm not saying that residency requirements were perfect, they were far from it since MANY FF and cops lived outside and had shells of houses they used as their address (yet, they were still great people who took pride in their job). I just grew up in a great environment surrounded by the city's finest. I know our parents took great care of our neighborhood and each other (and we kids...my keister still stings from a whooping I got from a neighbor when my parents weren't home, but yes I was guilty and deserved it). Maybe it was a different time back then and things would not happen like that today but I am a dreamer. The cops I knew are not like the ones that are being described here. They were fun loving, caring, always involved individuals who would help out whenever needed. They did so with class and pride in their city. Times, they have changed! Now that I rethink it, I doubt if having cops in neighborhoods would change much that is going in the city. | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 572 Registered: 09-2006 |
So what can be done to fix this problem? Get tough with the unions? De-unionize the force? Privatize the force (OCP)? Have much...much tougher hiring standards? Increase pay in order to draw better recruits? What? There has to be something because obviously everything that has been tried to fix the force and crime in the city has failed. | ||
Nyburgher Member Username: Nyburgher Post Number: 82 Registered: 10-2006 |
I gotta guess that getting cops to live in the city would help a lot. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 33 Registered: 02-2007 |
Nyburgher said "I gotta guess that getting cops to live in the city would help a lot." Force the police & fire to live in the City and you'll only get the dregs. Reference my comments above regarding personal experience - good and capable people who would serve will not. The opposite, but same principle, applies to wealthy 'burbs. I bet that a regular cop who works for Bloomfield cannot afford to live there. Mess with where people live and you'll see a deterioration. | ||
Dougw Member Username: Dougw Post Number: 1589 Registered: 11-2003 |
quote: Yes, yes, no, maybe, yes. | ||
Nyburgher Member Username: Nyburgher Post Number: 84 Registered: 10-2006 |
I just don't see how much more of a dreg you can be than to not live in the city you serve in. It's what we call an attitude problem. I am not saying that it has to be an absolute rule but there should be some serious incentives. Sounds like a lot of people are talking about the great quality you have now. | ||
Nyburgher Member Username: Nyburgher Post Number: 85 Registered: 10-2006 |
I guess the cops know what a great job they are doing. Thats why they won't live in town. I think the majority of NY public school teachers send their kids to private schools. From what I can see, this is pretty much the major issue with Detroit. If you can't make a lot of progress the city can't come back. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 34 Registered: 02-2007 |
Nyburgher, it sounds like you are making my argument, or are we in violent agreement? NY teachers sending their kids to private seems to imply that they understand that the product is inferior. Cops who live outside of the City see that, too. It's dangerous to live there - maybe not horrible on every block, but it's harder there than in most suburbs. I love Detroit and do what I can to help it along, but I cannot live there any longer because of the crime and danger. I'm like most people: I have principles, but I'm selfish about my safety and comfort (I sound like Al Gore now, with his heated pool and personal jet!). | ||
Ffdfd Member Username: Ffdfd Post Number: 46 Registered: 09-2006 |
quote: I notice you put "yes" to de-unionize and also "yes" to increase pay to draw better recruits. If you're handing out voluntary pay raises, I don't think the union is going to be your enemy. | ||
Nyburgher Member Username: Nyburgher Post Number: 86 Registered: 10-2006 |
Craig, I think we agree. I am an outsider on this thing and from a distance I can see how most people would need serious incentives to live in Detroit and danger is the reason. You have to reward the ones that do it. It would be great to hear from some cops here about ways to get more cops to live in town. |
