Discuss Detroit » Archives - Beginning January 2007 » "Detroit: Ruin of a City" Documentary to be Shown January 7th « Previous Next »
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1840
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 6:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The 2005 documentary "Detroit: Ruin of a City" will be shown on Sunday, January 7, 1pm at the Detroit Historical Museum. One of the filmmakers George Steinmetz will be hand for discussion following. Free with admission to the Museum (Adults $6; Seniors and students (ages 5-17) $4; Children under age 4 Free; Detroit Historical Society members Free).

Our very own DetroitYes! founder Lowell Boileau participated in this project.

I remember much discussion on this documentary when it was showed at the U-M Ruins of Modernity Conference in March 2005, so I thought it might be of interest to those who missed seeing it then.

For more info: http://sociology.berkeley.edu/ faculty/wacquant/movies/detroi t/index.php
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 4730
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 6:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Congratulations to Lowell and his colleagues. The description of the film sounds incredible.
jjaba.
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Ray1936
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Username: Ray1936

Post Number: 1030
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 7:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What Jjaba said.
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 4734
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 7:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ray1936 posts 1030 and 1025 of them are "What jjaba said." You'd think jjaba and he delivered papers together or somethin'.

Ray1936 is everything jjaba. Tigers, Lions, Red Wings, Vernors, Strohs, Coneys, pimping in Big 4, Grand River feeder buses, Detroit Times, Olympia, Shubert, Cass Theater, Masonic Temple, streetcars, Crowleys, Hudsons, Kerns, Twin Pines, and Soupy Sales. Penny ante poker on the back porch. Steps baseball. No wonder.

jjaba, Proudly Westside.
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Ray1936
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Username: Ray1936

Post Number: 1032
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 9:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You forgot the Music Hall. I think the last concert I saw there was Ferrante and Teischer, and shortly before that, Victor Borge. Borge invited the audience to come upstage after the show and play his Bosendorfer. I was so sorely tempted, but I couldn't bring myself (a comparative butcher) to disgrace that beautiful instrument.

I think Ferrante and Teischer used Steinways.
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Karl
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Username: Karl

Post Number: 5668
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 9:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Personal to Jjaba and Ray:

I don't hold a candle to your experiences in the great, never-to-be-matched City of Detroit but I do mourn its passing. A matchless, glorious city only to be duplicated in heaven.

Please keep sharing, the glimpses you provide are treasures.
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Karl
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Username: Karl

Post Number: 5669
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 10:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

PS -

Not only was the COD fabulous, but God sprinkled Detroit - and in all the world only Detroit - with the rare seasonings of the wonderful, new & latest jewels for our eyes - cars - and gems for our ears - music - in a way that earthly society may never see again.

Please - keep the memories coming, and kudos to Lowell for making it all come together.

(Message edited by karl on January 05, 2007)
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Yvette248
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Username: Yvette248

Post Number: 354
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Friday, January 05, 2007 - 10:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's funny, I was just reading an article that was describing all of the problems Chicago was having with urban decay. A month before that it was Cleveland...
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 4735
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 12:31 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

jjaba's favorite Music Hall story is Ray Charles with my two little sons, ages 5 and 7. They are now 37 and 39 and still remember how this opened their eyes to what a musical performance was like.
We sat in orchestra center of house and the Raylettes were stunning, with Ray in his glory. It was a black and tan evening in Detroit. We got to play dress up for Ray. When Ray came out with women on both arms, it was a sight to remember.
RIP Ray Charles.

jjaba, .
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Charlottepaul
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Username: Charlottepaul

Post Number: 188
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 8:39 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah Detroit! Just what we needed--another documentary on the ruin of Detroit. Maybe this can be shown all over the world so all can see the ruined Detroit and envision an image of what Detroit looks like today (a hint of sarcasm)! So much for trying to be optimistic about the start of an upswing.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1846
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 9:58 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I subscribe to the theory that in order to move forward, you need to understand where you came from. This documentary is not new; it was released in early 2005, and probably filmed in the year or two preceding. When it was shown in Ann Arbor at the Ruins conference, it garnered a lot of interest both here in the city (and this Forum) and outside of Detroit. I think the Forum thread on this topic, which precipitated a lot of discussion at the time, has been lost. But I can still find links to college courses that mention or use this documentary for study. And it was available for purchase at one time. This is simply another opportunity for those who missed seeing it the first time around to see it now. And given that one of the filmmakers will be there, perhaps he will comment on the change in Detroit since they did the documentary.
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Yvette248
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Username: Yvette248

Post Number: 362
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 12:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think all of us who have lived in Detroit for any period of time knows where we come from. I wouldn't hold my breath for any "but there's positive aspects about Detroit also" from a filmmaker who doesn't live here.
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Lowell
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Username: Lowell

Post Number: 3511
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 1:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A note about my participation in this film. I am not a colleague as jjaba mentioned. I was hired as a location scout / guide by the film makers [FYI one of the services my information age cottage industry [AtDetroit, LLC] offers if anyone needs that service].

They asked if I minded if they included some of my comments. I said 'no problem' not realizing the extent to which they would take up the offer. [I also wouldn't have worn that dorky visor had I known. ha ha]

As I always do, I set the situation in context up by first driving them, in this case, through Rosedale Park along Bretton Drive to let them know that there are vast areas of Detroit with beautiful homes and the ruins are in the minority.

I found their choice of title for the film unfortunate, but I think that grabbed the media attention when it came out a year later and drove a film which was headed toward the oblivion of academic circles into the spotlight.
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Charlottepaul
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Username: Charlottepaul

Post Number: 191
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 1:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Exactly Yvettee. I can definitely see this happening five or more years ago, and I am sure that it is a beautiful piece in its own way, but now it just seems to me that Detroit's ruin is documented enough already; why do this again/show this now? Can't we get in our heads the idea that hopefully Detroit's bottom is behind us? We can STILL see plenty bottom remnants in our daily lives, who needs a documentary? We probably don't/didn't need one. What was the point in producing it in the first place? If it wasn't to show Detroiters what they see everyday, then it must have been for those outside the area. If my theory is true, then I don't believe we should be 'showcasing' our ruins anymore. Sure it is important to understand the history, but I would like to optimistically think that the 'here and now' of Detroit is what others will know in the near future--no need to reiterate the past. Just my opinion, not yours.
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Catman_dude
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Username: Catman_dude

Post Number: 83
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 3:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wish this documentary was made into a DVD in which I can purchase and watch here in Virginia.
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Citylover
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Username: Citylover

Post Number: 2016
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 4:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was at the 2nd showing of the piece at Rackham in A2 when it was originally shown. There is nothing new here. If you live in Detroit you have already seen this stuff in fact you see it every day.

My issue is that these french film makers make commentary as if their interpretaion of things is how things happened in Detroit.It might have been good to have differing opinions instead of the same liberal dogma.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1847
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 5:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've not yet seen the documentary, so am planning to attend. I also want to hear the filmmaker's thoughts on what has happened in the city since they filmed and made the documentary in 2003-2005. Plus I feel a need to support the Detroit Historical Society's efforts to offer a wide range of programs at the Museum.
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Supersport
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Username: Supersport

Post Number: 11095
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 5:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

My issue is that these french film makers make commentary as if their interpretaion of things is how things happened in Detroit.It might have been good to have differing opinions instead of the same liberal dogma.




You don't own any mirrors do you?
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 4737
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 6:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Citylover, you mean there wasn't any discussion about crime in Detroit? Did they only blame captains of industry and drugs for the decline of the once-great City of Detroit?

Explain your use of "liberal."

jjaba has always appreciated CL's views. CL is a rather colorful contributor to the Forum. That's why we love CL.

Great job Lowell. jjaba sure can testify that you know the spots, camera angles, and Kodak moments.
jjaba has proof of the perfect picture in the perfect weed patch at Packards for example.

jjaba, Lowell Eastside Tour Customer. (You don't go on the Eastside without a guide.)
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Citylover
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Username: Citylover

Post Number: 2017
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 11:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Any view along with what was presented would have been fine jjaba_ thanks for the comments......

What about having Lbrooks comment along with some others?

I do think it is interesting that SS belittles my criicism of the film when in fact he is the republican here and should welcome something other than the usual dogma.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1853
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 11:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For those who missed the discussion upon release and want to read more about this documentary:

http://www.mchanan.dial.pipex. com/detroit/detroit%20backgrou nd.html
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Enduro
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Username: Enduro

Post Number: 42
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 11:25 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Anyone here still going? I called the Museum and got nothing. I'm almost motivated enough to brave this *gasp!* cold day.
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Charlottepaul
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Username: Charlottepaul

Post Number: 205
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 1:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hmmmm, Kathleen, some of Michael Chanan's points are well made in that it is cruel to critique a film which you haven't seen, but I am not critiquing the content of the film yet as I have not seen it. I find it somewhat difficult to believe that he couldn't have seen the negative response that would come from Detroiters.

Those outside Detroit will never understand, whether simply from its suburbs or much less likely the foreign country of a filmmaker. Chanon states, that "Behind this rejection is the fear that what others say may turn out to be true." I would argue that Detroiters themselves do know what is 'true' regardless; outsiders may know as well, but that doesn't make it the most appropriate thing to do. I would certainly agree that what he would be portraying would be true and therefore a documentary, but I still feel that it would be like a person from the suburbs going into a Detroit neighborhood and showing them what is wrong with it, as though those would not already know quite well. I don’t know that he properly argues that an outsider is the most appropriate person to be conducting the film. It is a project funded by the University of Michigan. Being that that is far enough separated from Detroit, why retrieve a videographer from overseas?

In the case of Detroit not only do those in the city know what is wrong solely by viewing it everyday, but those outside of it have a vision of it as well. I see the issues surrounding this documentary not as an issue of race as may have been the case in its original premiere or on the original DetroitYES! discussions, but as one of public relations. Perhaps I am confused as to why Detroit's current/recent past situation was necessary to document and showcase in the first place. Just when I was thinking Detroit was coming up from the very bottoms of the bottom, here comes another instance reminding us of where we were—from an outsider nonetheless. Many of us have hardly forgotten; many outside of Detroit have the old image as well. This documentary would be much more interesting to play years down the road. Film it now; show it in fifty years.

Chanan discusses many topics in his rebuttal among them free speech. I am not suggesting that he isn't allowed to do whatever documentary he wants, but Detroiters have a right to be critical of ANY portrayal of the city. The creators need not be defensive of their film--it is what it is. Just as he can film whatever he sees fit, we can criticize anything with which we do not agree, be it the content of his film, the title, or the connotation of the documentary.

Don’t be surprised by the critiques of Detroiters when making a film about our city!

P.S. I am a white recent college graduate...

Quotation taken from: Chanan, M. (2005). "Detroit: Ruin of a City--a reception diary," Journal of Media Practice 6: 3. pp. 135-144, doi: 10.1386/jmpr.6.3.135/1
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1854
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 2:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, I still can't comment on the documentary...as its showing at the Detroit Historical Museum was cancelled because the staff was unaware of the program and nobody showed up to present the program! There definitely was interest, with some 25-30 people there to see the documentary!!! Nice to see Vic_doucette and Lilpup there!! Nice to meet Lawnmowerman and his wife!! Nice to meet a couple other DetroitYES lurkers as well!!!

In addition to the info being posted on the Detroit Historical Museum's website, which is where I got the information from, the event was also listed in The Monitor.

I will try to follow up with my DHM contact tomorrow, and if I learn what happened, or if this will be rescheduled, I'll let you know.

It was nice to see that the Museum had a good number of visitors today, as did the Detroit Institute of Art, with today being the last day for the Annie Leibowitz exhibition. Looked like the Science Center was also busy today!
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Southen
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Username: Southen

Post Number: 73
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 3:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was disappointed to walk in and find out it was cancelled. I was planning on viewing this and then taking in the Leibovitz exhibit but neither came to fruition. One due to cancellation and the other because of a three hour wait.

Please let us know if the showing is rescheduled. Id gladly make the trek back to view it.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1857
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 6:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My contact at the Historical Museum told me that the documentary viewing had actually been cancelled about 2 weeks ago when they learned that Mr. Steinmetz wouldn't be available. Unfortunately, the posting wasn't fully removed from their website. Actually it should have just been marked "CANCELLED" or "POSTPONED". They apologized for the mixup and hope to reschedule the program. If and when that happens, I will post the information.
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Jams
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Username: Jams

Post Number: 4522
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 7:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks, Kathleen. I'm curious to see it and was disappointed I had made other plans prior to your posting.

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