  Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 33 Registered: 06-2005 |
Sounds like the Detroit schools and police got their best thugs together to quell Democracy once again. Sounds like the kids were pepper sprayed and maced for and I quote the article here,"when the kids got out of control for banging on doors and windows". This is what you do to a child when they are using their civil rights to protest? This article is so slanted it's sad, it actully blames anyone but the thugs who beat the kids. Who stole my country,WTF? http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20070503/S CHOOLS/705030409/1003/METRO | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 116 Registered: 05-2006 |
I bet the mace shut 'em up. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 945 Registered: 02-2006 |
Someone didn't read close enough. quote: | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1476 Registered: 11-2003 |
Because BAMN is mostly made up of a bunch of nutters. http://media.www.michigandaily .com/media/storage/paper851/ne ws/2005/11/02/News/Groups.Clas h.At.Student.Govt.Meeting-1432 641.shtml (Message edited by susanarosa on May 03, 2007) | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 5455 Registered: 10-2003 |
It doesn't matter who they did this too, as if it excuses their actions because you may not like BAMN. Focus, thanks for putting that into focus, pun unintended. Looks like the public safety officers need some more training, huh? | ||
Southwestmap Member Username: Southwestmap Post Number: 805 Registered: 01-2005 |
BAMN is a self-proclaimed anarchist group. They infiltrate peaceable protests and really start things. Things get out of hand quickly when BAMN steps in. I'm sure that the kids they recruited were encouraged to anarchy. BAMN loves the publicity that makes the other side look very bad. Rogerjab fell right into it. | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1477 Registered: 11-2003 |
When the offending party has a history of escalating violent behavior, then yes LMichigan, it does matter. It's a shame those kids were involved. I hope the woman mentioned is successful in suing the pants of that phony organization for brining her children into a dangerous situation. I'd love to get my hands on that permission slip and see what it says. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 1175 Registered: 11-2004 |
quote: quote: So true on all accounts. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 34 Registered: 06-2005 |
Are you people nuts, who ever beat up these kids did it because they were knocking on doors and windows. How in the world is that justified? Oh and I always believe the police they never lie do they?...what a bunch of Nazi's you still do have the right to protest in this country, don't you? (Message edited by Rogerjab on May 03, 2007) | ||
Rrl Member Username: Rrl Post Number: 797 Registered: 12-2003 |
Hmmm, seems to me the only ones to blame here are the leaders of BAMN. Nicole Greene got it right, she should be suing them. Why the fukk are they taking kids out of school to participate in protests. It's no wonder these kids are lagging behind in MEAP scores. What ever happened to the field trips to the science center or the zoo. Now it's field trips to DPS to protest closings. Who stole MY country? | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 539 Registered: 07-2005 |
BAMN is a loving Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action, Integration & Immigrant Rights, and Fight for Equality By Any Means Necessary (only through a peaceful means) Call to Action for Young Leaders of the New Civil Rights Movement * Full and Equal Rights for Immigrants * No More Second-Class Treatment * No Jim Crow / Anti-Immigrant Laws * Stop the Racist Attacks on Immigrants and Minorities * Defend Affirmative Action & Integration * No More Separate and Unequal Educational Opportunities The struggle of Latina/o communities across the nation for immigrant rights has given birth to a new civil rights movement. This powerful new movement opens the way to defeat racist attacks against immigrants and the Latina/o, black and other minority communities. The right-wing racist attack against the gains of the old civil rights movement, including the national attack on affirmative action and integration, can now be reversed. Standing proud, up on our feet, no longer invisible, we can win the respect and dignity we more than deserve. The aim of anyone who believes in equality and justice must be to strengthen and build the power of our new civil rights movement. To achieve this aim, we must build a new youth leadership. | ||
Ed_golick Member Username: Ed_golick Post Number: 620 Registered: 10-2003 |
I had a bird's eye view of the whole incident at Northern. It was the adults who were banging on the doors and windows, yelling and cursing at Northern's students to join the protest. Only a few Northern students participated in the protest. One Northern student threw a bottle of water at DPS security, which is when things got out of control. In my opinion, DPS security handled the situation professionally. Don't believe everything you read in the newspapers. | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 328 Registered: 10-2003 |
The group took these children without their parents' permission - a form of kidnapping - and used them to further their agenda. They encouraged children not to engage in peaceful, intelligent, civil protest, but to act like an out-of-control mob. I don't recall a constitutional right to bang on windows and doors and be disruptive. There's also no mention of "beating up" kids; they got pepper sprayed, which is a relatively benign option considering the melee that needed to be stopped. BAMN is a destructive group that tries to promote its agenda not through logic, but through shouting and bullying. They have a difficult time winning arguments on their merits, so they have to resort to violent tactics to get attention. It is absolutely abhorrent and despicable to use little kids to further their agenda, and put them into harm's way while doing so. None of that outrages you? | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 541 Registered: 07-2005 |
Let Donna Stern know how you feel about BAMN: BAMN P.O. Box 24834 Detroit, MI 48224 For more information, please contact: Donna Stern 313-438-3748 - donnastern@bamn.com | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1478 Registered: 11-2003 |
Taken from the link I posted above, since I know some folks are too lazy to read things themselves... quote: | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 329 Registered: 10-2003 |
But that's the standard behavior of BAMN - at every event they are belligerent and obnoxious and combative. I'd bet they've done more to hurt their own cause than their so-called enemies. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 35 Registered: 06-2005 |
Here is an interview from yesterday's "Democracy Now" from one of the student protesters. AMY GOODMAN:And joining me from Detroit is Jevon Cochran, a junior at Lewis Cass Technical High School in Detroit, an organizer with the Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action, Integration, and Immigrant Rights, & Fight for Equality By Any Means Necessary, known as BAMN. Jevon, talk about what happened in Detroit yesterday. JEVON COCHRAN: Well, yesterday in Detroit there were student walkouts from several schools against the school closings. You know, students also walked out against the ban on affirmative action, against like the restrictive dress codes in DPS that students get suspended over every day, and also in support of and in solidarity with the movement for immigrant rights. And, you know, at the schools -- at one of the schools, Northern High School, you know, students marched down to the schools who had walked out from several high schools, and we were having like a really peaceful protest. You know, Northern High School in Detroit is one of the schools that's slated to close, and once we got there, you know, the students really wanted -- the students that had walked out from the other schools wanted the Northern students to come out and, you know, fight to keep their school open, to keep -- you know, because if Northern stays open, that's just -- you know, Northern is the key school that we need to keep open, a fight for the rest of the schools in Detroit. And the students went there, and they started chanting, you know, "Keep Northern open! Walk out now!" It was a really peaceful protest. But what happened was the security guards and the administration at the school basically just terrorized the students and told them that they were powerless and that they couldn't fight to keep their school open, that they couldn't fight for their city. They blocked all the doors, and they tried to chain the students in, and they called the cops. And, you know, the cops like started just attacking the students, the students who had come from the other schools, like Cass, the high school that I go to. And there were -- like, we were just standing around, peacefully protesting, you know, trying to support the Northern students. And, you know, cops, just out of nowhere, totally unprovoked, started macing like elementary and middle school students. They grabbed one of the students who had led like walkouts at Northern High School almost two weeks ago, and they like beat him. They beat him. They maced him. They slammed him onto a police car. They arrested him. They arrested students from Osborn High School, which is a high school that over 200 students walked out from yesterday. They grabbed him by his hair. And it was just, you know, several incidents happening, you know, like this yesterday, where the police just attacked students and tried to terrorize the students who were fighting for their right to a decent education in our city. http://www.democracynow.org/ar ticle.pl?sid=07/05/02/1427210 | ||
Southwestmap Member Username: Southwestmap Post Number: 806 Registered: 01-2005 |
BAMN has a script and that student was talking the script. | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 330 Registered: 10-2003 |
Sounds like they typical hyperbole (read: exaggerations and lies) from BAMN members. The police "just out of nowhere, totally unprovoked" started macing them? Just for "standing around, peacefully protesting." Funny how they're always doing nothing and the police come out of nowhere to attack them. The administration told them "they couldn't fight for their city?" Who in real life, besides overwrought left-wing students, actually speaks this way. This would be hilarious if a couple people here and there didn't actually believe this nonsense. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 542 Registered: 07-2005 |
They look kinda peaceful to me...   | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 331 Registered: 10-2003 |
Two pictures - that must show everything that happened. Case closed! | ||
Southwestmap Member Username: Southwestmap Post Number: 807 Registered: 01-2005 |
BAMN attends and creates chaos at Detroit School Board meetings. In general, when noise, chaos and provocative shocking behavior attend civic functions, you will find BAMN hiding behind kids or mothers or legal strikers, etc. | ||
Rrl Member Username: Rrl Post Number: 798 Registered: 12-2003 |
Sounds to me like Mr.Cochran ought to spend a little more time in the classroom and less at the protests; you know. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9070 Registered: 12-2003 |
Hurrah for eye witnesses. Thanks, Ed. | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 880 Registered: 07-2004 |
Boy, you guys don't protest much, do you? You hold a sign. The police grab it, grab you, put you in painful positions, arrest you, throw you in a shit- and vomit-stained cell, and then you're found not guilty. But you already got your punishment. Get it? I hope some of you guys protest someday. You will be surprised how little it takes to bear the brunt of the law. | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 711 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: Yeah, I've seen some examples of their prior "peaceful" protests on youtube. BAMN members flipping over tables, young students shouting profanity in people's faces (encouraged and condoned by BAMN adults), etc. Just because you cherry-picked a few photos of some BAMN members at one moment in time not acting violent doesn't mean that some BAMN members weren't getting violent and out-of-control during those protests. If they weren't doing anything wrong, then why did the NAACP denounce their tactics? | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 36 Registered: 06-2005 |
Just a question why is Ed a credible eyewitness and Jevon should only spend time and class, and away from protests? You mean his account means nothing to you? (Message edited by rogerjab on May 03, 2007) | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 332 Registered: 10-2003 |
Rehearsed accounts with ridiculous statements are hard to take seriously. Are you really this gullible? | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 712 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: Because Jevon is a member of BAMN and therefore isn't exactly in a position to offer an unbiased neutral account of what occured. Of course he's going to paint the police as the bad guys, because that makes his side look good. Do you really think that he would admit it if there WERE BAMN members acting like fools? Ed was an independent observer and can offer an unbiased opinion since he was not involved in the protest. | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 881 Registered: 07-2004 |
Forget it, Roger. These guys are horrified that anybody would use direct action. But if white men dress up like injuns and throw British tea in the water, somehow, that's different. (I hope they never see footage of old striking white workers in Flint and Dearborn. Sheesh! Yeah, those hunger marchers were just asking for it. Harry Bennett is a great American.) | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 333 Registered: 10-2003 |
"Direct action" has worked wonders. BAMN's protests worked so well they got affirmative action permanently banned in this state. Great work there. Very effective. Again, they do more harm to their cause than those they claim are their enemies do. | ||
Rrl Member Username: Rrl Post Number: 799 Registered: 12-2003 |
If direct action means taking kids out of school and using them to be the protestors, then yes, I'm against it. Surprised they didn't arm them with grapes and other fruit projectiles. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 37 Registered: 06-2005 |
There's no way that Ed is a white guy and Jevon is a black kid, there's no way that swayed your oppinion did it? I'm already quite certain what this whole thing is all about to some people, anyone ever hear that Randy Newman song, "Rednecks"? It starts out: Last night I saw Lester Maddox on a TV show, with some smart ass New York Jew the jew laughed at Lester Maddox and audience laughed at Lester Maddox too. Anyone care to finish the lyrics? | ||
Leland_palmer Member Username: Leland_palmer Post Number: 307 Registered: 08-2004 |
Soooooo, you'd be perfectly happy with someone taking your kids out of school to some location that you didn't approve? (Message edited by leland_palmer on May 03, 2007) | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 544 Registered: 07-2005 |
Don't you know that BAMN is a peaceful organization with Principles: 1. BAMN is a mass, democratic, integrated, national organization dedicated to building a new mass civil rights movement to defend affirmative action, integration, and the other gains of the civil rights movement of the 1960s and to advance the struggle for equality in American society by any means necessary. 2. BAMN will consist of local BAMN groups, other independent organizations that choose to affiliate or otherwise associate themselves with BAMN, and individuals who declare their support for BAMN's principles and express this support in action consistent with these principles. BAMN groups will include independent community, labor, campus, high-school, middle-school, youth, and other political and activist organizations that endorse the principles of BAMN, conduct their internal business democratically, and commit themselves in action to the achievement of BAMN's aims. 3. BAMN is committed to making real America's founding declaration that "all men are created equal." Real equality of rights and opportunities for women and for disadvantaged black, Latina/o, Native American, Asian Pacific American, Arab American, and other minorities requires active, positive measures, a national policy of affirmative action. American society can overcome its fundamental inequalities only if positive measures are taken to transform it into what it should be. 4. BAMN is committed to making real the ideal of "government of the people, by the people, for the people." But democracy, too, must be a sham as long as the fundamental inequalities of poverty, racism, and sexism deform the relations of political power along with access to educational and economic opportunities. Here again, America can only become what it should be through a national policy of affirmative action. 5. BAMN recognizes that history has made clear that the positive measures, the affirmative action necessary to achieve genuine equality and real democracy will require the victory of the struggles of a new, independent integrated civil rights movement committed to fight for these aims by any means necessary. As Americans committed to saving our society from the evils of racism and sexism, we understand that racism and sexism are so deeply a part of the structure and institutions of American society that only the growing power of a new mass movement can uproot them. 6. BAMN defends the integration plans that were the decisive first fruit of the previous generation of civil rights struggles. We recognize that the attack on affirmative action has been accompanied by a less well publicized but even more dangerous series of right-wing attacks on integration plans in American public schools, even where these plans have been most successful and have had the widespread support of minority and white parents and students alike. 7. BAMN sees the attack on affirmative action and integration-policies that in practice have benefited people of both sexes and all races-as a fundamental attack on the democratic character of American society itself. This is true, in the first place, because of the intrinsic importance of the actual policies under attack as very modest steps in the direction of equality of opportunities for women and disadvantaged minorities. But it is also true because the victory of the opponents of affirmative action and integration will set the stage for a broader and deeper attack not only on the gains of the past civil rights movement but on the democratic rights won through the mass struggles of the labor movement of the 1930s and the youth, women's, and lesbian/gay movements of the 1960s and 1970s. 8. BAMN will employ whatever means are necessary to oppose and defeat these attacks on the democratic and egalitarian aspirations and struggles of our people. Specifically, BAMN will employ the methods of independent mass organizing and struggle, of mass education and action, of democratic discussion and decision-making, of telling the truth and only the truth, of rooting our fights in the courts or in elections in the growing movement on the streets, of building the leadership of the disenfranchised and oppressed. 9. BAMN will be independent of the Democrats and Republicans and of governments and school and university administrations. In any elections, BAMN will consider supporting only those candidates, slates, and parties whose support for affirmative action and the struggle of the new movement for equality is explicit and unequivocal. 10. Confident in the capacity of a new movement to learn, grow, fight, and win, BAMN rejects cynicism and despair. 11. BAMN rejects the principle of "separate but equal" as one of the great lies of American history. We will oppose every measure aimed at the resegregation of American society. 12. BAMN rejects biological determinism and its pseudoscientific ideological explanations of the inequalities of modern society. 13. BAMN rejects all claims that the inequalities of race and gender and the oppression of racism and sexism can be adequately explained as natural or inevitable consequences of human nature, original sin, biological destiny, or the supposed deficiencies of various ethnic cultures. The inequalities of race and gender in American society are a result of the actual history of that society. Racism and sexism are expressions of the actual inequalities of wealth, power, and status that characterize the society that have developed through that history. Our aim should be to understand that history in order to end those unequal relations of power and privilege, not to invent theories to rationalize passive submission. 14. BAMN will expose the falsehoods of the baseless and arrogant attempts to use standardized tests to define merit or intelligence or human dignity. We recognize that such inevitably biased tests correlate most strongly, not with any question of merit, but with the relative privileges or disadvantages of race and socioeconomic status and amount to a means of rationalizing preferences for certain racial and class privileges. 15. BAMN stands proudly in the tradition of the great abolitionist, civil rights, and antiracist movements of the past, critically studying, learning from, and developing the lessons of the struggles of our heroic forebears. We look especially to the towering figure of Frederick Douglass ("If there is no struggle there is no progress"), and, as representative leaders of the 1960s, Martin Luther King ("The whirlwinds of revolt will continue to shake the foundations of our nation until the bright day of justice emerges"), and Malcolm X ("action on all fronts by whatever means necessary"). 16. BAMN will base itself on the new movement as it develops, viewing its tasks from the standpoint of the oppressed and the poor, not the privileged elite. While maintaining its independence and not shirking the duty of leadership or yielding the right of criticism and the obligation to tell the truth, BAMN will work hard to build any alliance that can help make the new, independent movement broader and more powerful. 17. BAMN defends the rights and dignity of immigrants against the divisive, racist, and chauvinist attacks that have deformed American political life over and over again throughout our nation's history. 18. BAMN sees itself as part of a reawakening international mass movement against racism and fascism and for equal rights and opportunities. We will develop links with antiracist and proequality movements outside the US in order to help where we can and in order to learn from the struggles of our sisters and brothers in other nations. 19. BAMN will fight for the democratic election of leaders of movement bodies; for the direct accountability of all leaders to the new movement; and for democratic discussion and decision-making in all the meetings and bodies of the new movement. 20. BAMN will be an organization in which strong women leaders play a fully equal role in all its work. BAMN will be built by women and male leaders inspired by the examples of the heroic women leaders of the abolitionist and civil rights movements-courageous fighters like Harriet Tubman and Sojourner Truth, Rosa Parks, Ella Baker and Fanny Lou Hamer. BAMN will fight for the equal leadership role of women in the new mass movement. 21. BAMN will be an organization in which black, Latina/o, Native American, Asian Pacific American, Arab American, and other minority leaders play a full and prominent role. We will fight for full integration of the leadership of the new movement. 22. In any new movement, youth must play a decisive role. BAMN will be an organization of idealistic and brave youth, fighting for a future of genuine equality and justice for all. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 545 Registered: 07-2005 |
Heck, they even have a "Youth Declaration for a NEW Civil Rights Movement": 1. We call for a new, mass, independent, integrated civil rights movement to fight for equal, quality education for all, including the defense of affirmative action and integration. 2. The history of the past struggle for equality is a history of brave struggles by youth for their own futures. In the spring of 1963, the defiant courage of black teenage youth in Birmingham, Alabama made victory possible in the campaign led by Martin Luther King that set the stage for the great August 1963 March on Washington. Over and over throughout the 1960s, black and other antiracist teenage and younger youth were the often unsung heroes of the movements for equality and justice. 3. Despite the decisive role youth played in making it possible for the past movements to win victories, senior movement leaders did not usually recognize youth as leaders in their own right. Youth were usually not included when leaders met to make key decisions. This failure inevitably contributed to the limitation of the gains won by these movements and the fact that now so many of those gains have been reversed or are under attack. 4. As the people whose future is most at stake, high-school and middle-school youth will be at the forefront of any new movement for equal educational opportunities. 5. For this new civil rights movement to win, youth will also have to be recognized and respected as part of the leadership of the movement and be included in democratic discussion of the development of the movement's policies, tactics, and strategy. 6. For victory to be possible, the character of the new civil rights movement will have to be determined by the boldness and idealism of the youth, not the cynicism and despair of a tired-out older generation. 7. In our schools, we are victims of all the inequalities and discrimination of American society as well as overcrowded classes, under funded programs, and inadequate facilities. Middle-school and high-school students also have to deal with the problems of being disrespected by adults and fears of the curiosity, creativity, and sexuality of young women and men. As part of the new movement, youth will lead struggles in their schools for equal, quality education for all; for student rights; and for the dignity of youth. 8. Children and youth are the most vulnerable victims of poverty, inequality, and discrimination. Teenagers and older youth are the main victims of police profiling, harassment, and brutality. Youth fighting for their rights in schools will also become leaders of struggles for justice in their communities. 9. Young women and men will be fully equal, mutually respected partners in building the new movement. 10. In the new movement black, Latina/o, Arab, Asian, other-minority, and white youth will unite in an integrated, intransigent fight against racism and all forms of bigotry and discrimination. The new movement will also break down the divisions between inner-city and suburban and rural schools in a common struggle for improved education for all. 11. With a relentless desire to stand on the truth, the youth activists of the new civil rights movement will reject the lies and hypocrisy of an older generation of politicians and sellout leaders. 12. We declare our commitment to build and lead the fight for our own futures by whatever methods are necessary in order to win. We will not sell out, and we will not give up. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 5456 Registered: 10-2003 |
Could you quit, already? | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 546 Registered: 07-2005 |
Okay. | ||
Detroitteacher Member Username: Detroitteacher Post Number: 1025 Registered: 06-2006 |
Steve Conn was also at that protest/rally. He teaches at Cass. Why wasn't he IN school teaching his students? I've seen Steve Conn use kids to his advantage with no benefit to the student. No one at my school protested and none of our students were in attendance at the protest. We are a school that is getting about 800 kids from other schools (yet some of our teachers got lay-off notices). They are sending Redford HS kids to Cooley HS. Deadly mix since Redford and Cooley have been rivals for as long as anyone can remember and there isn't a sports game between the 2 schools that doesn't end in a HUGE fight (sometimes with gunfire). If these adults used kids (and even secured permission slips from unsuspecting parents) then they should be ashamed of themselves. The kids have accepted the fact that schools are closing but not too much is being said about it except by the influence of adults such as BAMN. I don't know that any school excused kids from classes to attend this rally. The parents DID give permission for them to attend. The parents should have checked into the organization a bit better before allowing their kids to go. This wasn't a DPS sponsored event or sponsored by any teacher (other than those in BAMN...like Steve Conn) or school. This situation should have been left for the police and parents to deal with and DPS security should have stayed out of it since it is not in their job description to break up fights or protests (they can only observe and report those observations to police, according to the language in their contract...although many do break up fights to save a kid from getting hurt). | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5855 Registered: 02-2004 |
YAY!!! Way to go kids! Way to go BAMN! Tell the Detroit School Board that they are not the dictators of the educational future of students. Corruption has no place in educational politics. REVOLUTION!! Youth socialism is on the rise and its going to save DPS either you all like it or not. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 38 Registered: 06-2005 |
Wow Quozl, the facts will get em' everytime. How dare an organization in a free country peacefully protest against conditions that they feel are unjust. Won't like George Bush and his AG Alberto Gonzalez take care of the problem? | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5856 Registered: 02-2004 |
NO! Rogerjab, King George Bush is not putting American education on his agenda. He's busy trying to fix up a broken nation that he destroyed. Alberto Gonzales have other things on his mind like how to save his job from critics. Basically We Americans are on our own solving everyday problems in out lives. Sometimes we don't need the U.S. Government to assist us. We can govern ourselves. For BAMN keep fighting for solidarity. | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 800 Registered: 09-2006 |
I like their name By. Any. Means. Necessary., clever. They better do it some justice. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 39 Registered: 06-2005 |
Hey Danny I was being sarcastic...none the less we're on the same side. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 547 Registered: 07-2005 |
quote: I put no faith in the Federal Government solving any problem in the foreseeable future. Everything the government touches turns to shit. Sorry I cannot be of further assistance. | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 713 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: And everytime the KKK gets together to have one of their public rallies and hurl profanity and act like maniacs, all they do is piss people off and generate more hatred towards themselves among the general public. And that's what BAMN does when they act like out-of-control fools and use kids in thier publicity stunts, they are doing more harm than good for the causes they support. As someone said earlier, you can thank BAMN for HELPING to get Affirmative Action banned in Michigan. Their childish stunts only made the pro-AA side look bad. | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 714 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: And wasn't it a white kid in Lincoln Park who got tazered by the police for not giving up his Game Boy in class? Don't try to make this a racial thing. Aren't most DPS security officers black? So if a black officer pepper sprays a black kid, it's racism? | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 548 Registered: 07-2005 |
 | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 40 Registered: 06-2005 |
"Aren't most DPS security officers black? So if a black officer pepper sprays a black kid, it's racism?" That is really too dumb to be believed. So like when we had the "good ole days" of slavery if a black was ordered to give 40 lashes to another black that wasn't racism? I think you've exposed yourself, it's not about racism to everyone, but to you it certainly is. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5859 Registered: 02-2004 |
Quozl, you quoted that you put no faith in the Federal Government solving any problem in the foreseeable future. Everything the government touches turns to shit. Sorry I cannot be of further assistance. That's right! In the flip side of Midas touch. DON'T TRUST THE GOVERNMENT! THE GOVERNMENT IS THE COMMUNE PEOPLE OF SOLIDARITY. | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 715 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: You are too retarded to be believed. You were the one who first injected race into this. I think you've exposed how your mother drank too much when she was pregnant with you. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 41 Registered: 06-2005 |
"Aren't most DPS security officers black? So if a black officer pepper sprays a black kid, it's racism?" Ya see genius if the black guy is working for the establishment of course it's racism, you're not the sharpest knife in the drawer are you? | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 972 Registered: 12-2006 |
"Three of those parents turned out for a press conference in which the civil rights group BAMN -- the Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action, Integration and Immigration Rights and Fight for Equality By Any Means Necessary -- announced that other Detroit parents planned to file a $10 million lawsuit against Detroit Public Schools and the city of Detroit for the pepper spray incident Tuesday." And we wonder why Detroit and DPS are losing money... | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 42 Registered: 06-2005 |
Ed_golick "One Northern student threw a bottle of water at DPS security, which is when things got out of control" Is Ron Artest working for DPS security now? | ||
Bulletmagnet Member Username: Bulletmagnet Post Number: 400 Registered: 01-2007 |
I read through this mess, and I see what this country is headed when the leftist over through it: chaos, destruction, racism, hatred, and the plain coarsening of the culture, a downward out of control spin into a leftist hell that no light can escape, where the living will envy the aborted… | ||
Dabirch Member Username: Dabirch Post Number: 2274 Registered: 06-2004 |
quote: Never confuse an Anarchist for a Leftist. An anarchist is as far right as one can be -- a Libertarian without any guiding political thought or principles. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9073 Registered: 12-2003 |
It gets blurry on the flipside of the Mobius. Rogerjab, you have taken my simple kudos to a forumer and spun it completely out of control. For that leap of illogic, you look quite like the fool. I merely thanked a forumer for an eyes-on account of the melee. That is it. There can be NO racial appearance to that statement for anyone who ISN'T a full-blown racist idiot themselves. You volunteered for that post, but can quit it at any time. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 43 Registered: 06-2005 |
Right, there's no racism on this board. Although the comment wasn't directed at you, why would you be hurrahing only one eyewitness account, while two eyewitness accounts were given directly above your post? Oh yea because Golic posts on the forum regularly, and since there's no way a forum regular could be mistaken, well WTF are you talking about? Look it's obvious that when children are being maced and pepper sprayed for expressing opinions there's some kind suppression going on there. Maybe it isn't racial, maybe it's just the neo-nazi attitude that's been all the rage in this country since King George has taken over. Maybe you're just a Bush republican, and with all those explanations it still roots itself back into being a racist. I just calls em' like I sees em. | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 974 Registered: 12-2006 |
There is no such thing as suppression if stuff is being thrown at security and people are disrupting classes by banging on windows. That is called a protest going out of control. There is a difference between a peaceful march and what this was. Or have you forgotten what peaceful means? | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 44 Registered: 06-2005 |
"There is nothing more American than raising your voice in protest, and there is nothing more un-American than a government that attempts to hit the mute button when it doesn't like what it hears. Witold Walczak, Legal Director of the ACLU of Greater Pittsburgh. Maybe, just maybe these permission slips were given out to these kids to let them see how to be an American, many here need permission themselves. (Message edited by rogerjab on May 03, 2007) | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 45 Registered: 06-2005 |
"There is a difference between a peaceful march and what this was" You mean "Students were knocking on windows and doors" ? Yea you're right, I'm surprised the cops didn't just shoot the kids....what's wrong with you? | ||
Mortgageking Member Username: Mortgageking Post Number: 8 Registered: 12-2006 |
Don't You know that BAMN is a peaceful organization with principals? It is evidenced right here in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =NRy74-8mtr8 | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9079 Registered: 12-2003 |
Rogerjab, There wasn't overt racism in this THREAD until it reared its ugly head in YOUR words. I understand and agree with your rage against police TOO quick to don the riot gear and go out looking to kick ass...some of that is a natural reaction to wearing any sort of armor and entering an arena where there is likely to be physical contact. These folks, mostly testosterone-fueled frustrated men, are drawn to and trained to be the authority, so when they are disobeyed or ignored they have to step it up a notch. That is wrong thinking, because that quickly makes them the enemy...rather than whom or whatever the protest is about...and allows (if not accelerates) the decent into chaos. Once adrenaline peaks in these stressed-out front liners who we are supposed to be relying on for our public safety...then again also on the side of the protestors...and anger flares or some other spark ignites...man, LOOK OUT. We are going to see this sort of thing played out time and again until people start learning from Gandhi, Martin Luther King, and Jesus (not necessarily in that order, but PROOF that Jesus' teachings work was through those men in modern history). The only successful protest is a fully peaceful one that is unyielding in its quiet stand...or sit. Better to sit, so the asshole anarchists who either want to start shit or are HIRED to do so (even by our OWN government so they can crush the apparent rebellion with excessive force, this was clear in the Seattle World Trade riots from a few years back, look up the documentaries and watch them) would stick out like sore thumbs...and not a ONE of them could do their dirty deeds sitting down. How, please, do you see the connection between MY words defending my other words and some imagination that I then said there is no racism on this board?! You're on it, so apparently the ugly beast still lives. We can all choose to keep it out of our individual experiences with EVERYONE we meet and engage...I'm calling you out on it only to help you notice that YOUR rage sets up a skewed perception that often does not even ALLOW for racism to cease to exist between two people, let alone a group. We will all always be different from one another, not a ONE of us has a choice which race we were born into...and we will always be more comfortable around those who look like that familiar person in the mirror and his/her parents, that is only natural. Plus, even though not a ONE acts like the stereotype thrust upon US, somehow it is amazingly tough to not give others the same room to be themselves. Curious. We are ALL guilty of assuming from the way someone appears that they will 'be' a certain way, it takes WORK to avoid that and be more open to letting a person prove who they are well before we form an opinion of them! My words still stand, there can be NO racial appearance to that statement for anyone who ISN'T a full-blown racist idiot themselves. How the fuck can I thank an eyewitness account from a newspaper article where the person doesn't post here?! I have NO idea what race Ed_golick is, although YOU apparently have made some grand assumption that not only is this Ed white, but we're in some collusion to keep you down. What if she's an editor of a cunnilingus fetish magazine?! (sorry Ed, I just KNOW you're going to find me at an FSC and never let me live that one down, I was just trying to prove a point!) THAT is racist thinking, and you are an idiot to jump to those illogical conclusions. You obviously have never read this board, or there is NO way in heaven or hell you would them assume I am some gung ho Republican...and I agree fully with your assessment of the current political situation in our land, if not the whole world. Please don't keep rushing and raging for that Forum Idiot spot...a few of us don't like the competition. Heh. | ||
Peter Member Username: Peter Post Number: 64 Registered: 02-2007 |
Great for city publicity... all families move to Detroit immediatly. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4241 Registered: 08-2004 |
Geese... I feel like bursting out into a song from Les Miserables.... | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9084 Registered: 12-2003 |
(cannot ever forget the old gentleman a few seats down from us at the Fisher during a run of Les Mis who gasped and shouted "NO!" when the little boy was killed while collecting bullet shells on the other side of their barricade...made EVERY head turn in the balcony, but NOBODY gave him a hard time because we all felt like crying out at the same instant) What about those Geese, Gistok...why bring THEM in here?! | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4242 Registered: 08-2004 |
... but on a more serious note... we've had several BAMN threads on this forum in the last 2 years. One involved last years death by stabbing of a BAMN member who was at a church barbeque (IIRC) in Southwest Detroit. Sad it was, but we were all speculating on what events lead up to the tragedy. Do BAMN members exhibit their aggressive attitude always? I donno... My perception is that a majority of the forumers here have a rather poor (acting like drama queens) perception of BAMN members. Just the term "BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY" sounds rather scary, almost Gestapo like. That said, I admire their passion, but not their actions. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4243 Registered: 08-2004 |
Gannon, I meant Geeze.... not Geese... not a single Gander in the musical either... | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 716 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: The establishment of the city of Detroit? Last time I checked, this city had a black mayor, a black chief of police, a black DPS Superintendent, and a black Board of Education President. White people haven't made the decisions in Detroit for over 30 years, so it's kind of hard to blame the actions of DPS workers on "whitey." What did "whitey" do, extend his evil white reach from Oakland County to force CoD employees to use excessive force? I bet you blame "whitey" when it rains too. Or when your car doesn't start in the morning. Or when you step in dog shit on the grass. | ||
Rogerjab Member Username: Rogerjab Post Number: 46 Registered: 06-2005 |
Gannon I don't know if you're a racist or not, I don't care. I know from my limited time on this board that are a lot of racists here, and don't kid yourself this is a racially loaded subject, there's no way around that if you take the time to think it through. What I am quite sure of is that you really need to go to a protest, you really don't have a clue of what you're talking about. It's like you've read about protests in some high school history book once. Really get out and make the world a better place, but your idea of protest is just precious. | ||
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_ Post Number: 1813 Registered: 12-2003 |
So let's see, you are protesting the closure of schools becuase the district says they don't have any money to keep them open. So now you are suing the school district. Just brilliant. | ||
Bumble Member Username: Bumble Post Number: 77 Registered: 11-2004 |
I'm a fan of rabble rousing, so I watched the Cass Tech BAMN protest. They marched around an empty park and stood in the middle of the empty streets. They yelled. They shook their fists and signs. The squirrels ran up the trees and the robins flew away. The pigeons stood their ground. So much for that. If they had picked up some trash in the park they might have made the world a better place. But, hey, instead of receiving an ineffectual education in a poorly rated district, they held an ineffectual protest in a poorly rated neighborhood. Good for them. | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 334 Registered: 10-2003 |
Quote: "Never confuse an Anarchist for a Leftist. An anarchist is as far right as one can be -- a Libertarian without any guiding political thought or principles." There are both far-left and far-right anarchists, both with their own sets of principles in varying degrees. From the First International to the anarcho-syndicalists and their collectivist aspirations, anarchists have a long history of association with leftist thinking. BAMN, with its insistence on strong federal government intervention to ensure specific race-based outcomes, is distinctly left wing in that regard. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9086 Registered: 12-2003 |
Funny that, Rogerjab, I care if YOU'RE a racist. (and yes I know that there is both covert and overt racism in ANY group...for you to focus on it here merely gives racism strength, that is a spiritual concern that should be learned by all) I care if ANYONE in any community I'm in is a divisive, exclusive, Proud, judgemental, superiority-complexed racist (or classist or sexist or religionist or intellectual 'ninja'). No problems with anyone having pride in themselves and their heritage, but as soon as it escalates into Pride of their group OVER and at the expense of others...they are FAR gone from the path of truth and right living. My peaceful stand HERE against all of that IS part of my protest...which I DO hope is precious to others, because it is way more than precious to me. THIS community deserves the same love energy and attention to the fringe elements as any, even moreso because of the 'echo' we make in the tangible world. My language can often sound harsh and judgemental itself, I am well aware of that. It is my communication style when trying to make a point. I think I only step up the tone when necessary, MOST times if not all I'm talking in a conciliatory, INclusive, educational way based upon philosophical trends that WORK (in my perceptional experience) versus those that do not. Physical, angry mob-like protests DON'T work. Never have, never will. They always devolve into battles where WAY more people are injured and killed than need be. Some even CRAVE this chaos, perhaps because it enables their evil ends. What say you of MLK and Gandhi?! The teachings of Jesus?! THOSE dudes knew how to protest a thing. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 549 Registered: 07-2005 |
quote: I don't know about that Gannon. The '67 Riots protested police abuse, economic inequality and a lack of affordable housing for blacks. It would seem that police abuse was curtailed, the majority of residents now have affordable housing, etc. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9090 Registered: 12-2003 |
Oh BULLSHIT. The protesting that made that difference was the work done in the decade BEFORE 1967. The riots caused 'the man' to start throwing money AT the ghetto, further exacerbating our troubles. Made it so that entire GENERATIONS of folk would be placated enough to not protest. It has worked. They are now opiated enough to not even know how to live on their own, without government help! The riots were NOT a protest, they were riots. If you cannot see the difference, then you are as far gone as any seeking death and destruction...only your target are the ones who have been aiming the same at you. Tit for tat. Eye for eye. That is assinine OLD SCHOOL, pre-Jesus/Yeshua/Yoshua. Things changed MAJORLY after that spiritual door was opened, luckily it is still propped enough for goodness to flow our way. If you continue to play that silly game, you will always bear the same results...if you survive. | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 335 Registered: 10-2003 |
Quote: "I don't know about that Gannon. The '67 Riots protested police abuse, economic inequality and a lack of affordable housing for blacks. It would seem that police abuse was curtailed, the majority of residents now have affordable housing, etc." It's affordable because it's crumbling and worthless in many parts of the city. It's affordable in the same way a pile of garbage is "affordable." This forum has finally descended to a new depth of madness - we have someone claiming the 1967 riots were actually good for the city. It's a banner day for intelligence here. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 550 Registered: 07-2005 |
Okay, thanks for the clarification. | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 11549 Registered: 10-2003 |
Somebody needs to "call'em out" and throw grapes at these BAMN members! | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 551 Registered: 07-2005 |
Wow hockey puck for brains, that is a profound post. Gannon stated that: "Physical, angry mob-like protests DON'T work." The way I viewed the riots, they were an angry mob-like protest. I define a riot as a public act of violence by an unruly mob. How was I to know a RIOT is a riot? I never wrote that the riot was good for the city, quite the contrary. I simply stated that Black Detroiter's INDEED achieved what they were protesting. Try Sylvan Learning Center for their Reading Comprehension 101 class on Monday nights, it will be well worth the investment. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9092 Registered: 12-2003 |
Hockey_player, Quozl outlined the driving principles of BAMN above, at least you shouldn't be too surprised where it came from. Quozl, That said, I actually approve of anyone joining together with others to actually protest against injustice and inequality...I just think you got a wee confused at how long true change takes, and what an actual cause/effect cycle is. Just because the GOOD changes (better policing, at least on the surface...housing and jobs programs, at least BEFORE poor-people-hating policies reduced their funding) followed the BAD actions does NOT EVER mean the bad actions CAUSED the GOOD results. It also does NOT eliminate the bad actions as a partial stimulant or instigant to change, but I digress...just needed to clarify that for logic sake. We live in an instantaneous society...fast food when we want it, nearly everyone at our beck and call from merely dialing a number or clicking out an e-mail or text. We push a button and expect results that WE want usually without regards to the society at large, let alone anyone else outside our skin. That is merely human nature, which we MUST struggle against IF we are to make any true gains against this creeping tyranny that seems to seek to take us OUT of the game. Better to remember your agriculture, if you ever learned it...sew seeds. Water. Watch diligently against pests and disease. IF it is meant to be, what you've sewn WILL certainly come to fruit...enough to feed more than just you. THAT is the time-honored way to effect growth and change (and full spiritual nutrition!) in our world. That should be our protest, to do things FOR those who wish to join us...and guaranteed MORE and MORE will join and momentum will build. Violence, destruction, and death ALL play into our opponents hands...once we CHOOSE any of this we have already lost. We've been losing for too long. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 552 Registered: 07-2005 |
Gannon, I hope you know I appreciate the time you spent to write out such a thoughtful, well-written post. Yes, I remember my agriculture and horticulture classes in HS and college, a fantastic analogy was provided IMO. And whether you know this or not, we are in full agreement. I was simply taking the side of BAMN for discussion purposes. On the surface they look like they have well thought out Principles and Youth Declaration's. A closer look reveals that they may very well promote a violent form of protest that is totally unacceptable and needs to change. My humble apologies if I upset you, that was not my intent. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1084 Registered: 02-2007 |
I do have connection about this, as I do know the student that was interviewed. I'm almost 100% sure it was not scripted. Not saying that it wasn't sabataged, but definitely unscripted. (Message edited by Urbanize on May 04, 2007) | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1086 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Are you people nuts, who ever beat up these kids did it because they were knocking on doors and windows." bring a large group of people to my house unexpectedly and start banging on my doors and windows...you'd be lucky if you only got pepper sprayed... | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1087 Registered: 06-2006 |
"BAMN -- the Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action, Integration and Immigration Rights and Fight for Equality By Any Means Necessary -- announced that other Detroit parents planned to file a $10 million lawsuit against Detroit Public Schools and the city of Detroit for the pepper spray incident Tuesday." Are the students of DPS going to benefit more if BAMN and these parents get $10 million, or if DPS gets to keep it? | ||
Hockey_player Member Username: Hockey_player Post Number: 336 Registered: 10-2003 |
Quozl you genius, you claimed the riot led to affordable housing ("the majority of residents now have affordable housing"). That is simply moronic. Try walking through some of the neighborhoods affected by the riot and cheerfully tell the impoverished residents that they're lucky to have "affordable housing." See how they react to you and your assessment. Backpedaling or making excuses for being dumb doesn't erase your original absurdity. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 553 Registered: 07-2005 |
Hockey puck for brains, are you telling me that blacks do not have affordable housing within the City Limits of Detroit after all? I guess my eyes were deceiving me when I drove through Grandmont, Grandmont 1 & 2, Rosedale last year. Saw the same phenomenon up on Outer Drive and Greenfield, 7 mile and Lahser. I could have sworn I saw BLOCK after BLOCK of neighborhoods that had proud, respectable black residents living in pretty damn good looking houses. Now why would I drive down to 12th Street and Rosa Parks (Clairmont) and make the vocal proclamation you suggest? To mock the unfortunate souls that live in that neighborhood? You must be a bigot to even suggest such hockey puck! Shame on you! | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1089 Registered: 06-2006 |
At what point did this thread turn into a white/black racial debate? I thought this incident was about black protesters who attacked a black school and got maced by black security guards and are now suing the black taxpayers of Detroit and taking money away from the city's black school children... exactly what role did "whitey" play in all of this? | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1090 Registered: 06-2006 |
Quozl, so all the vandalism, garbage and graffiti must be part of some carefully crafted scheme by the residents to keep the property values affordable.. ::rolls eyes into back of head:: | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 554 Registered: 07-2005 |
Blame the vandalism, garbage and graffiti on "Whitey", DPS, The Big 3 and BAMN. It is all their fault doncha know. As for it being a "carefully crafted scheme by the residents to keep the property values affordable", I think it is to ensure that "Whitey" never comes back to live and invest in the city. Sorry Thejesus, stupid question deserves stupid reply. (Message edited by quozl on May 04, 2007) | ||
Southwestmap Member Username: Southwestmap Post Number: 808 Registered: 01-2005 |
RE: "positive" affects of the Detroit Riot of 1967: there is starting to be some serious scholarship about the Riots. Forty years has provided some long-term effects on which to make judgements. This is a summary of the recent study published by Vanderbilt University: The Labor Market Effects of the 1960s Riots Working Paper No. 03-W24 William J. Collins and Robert A. Margo "Between 1964 and 1971, hundreds of riots erupted in American cities, resulting in large numbers of injuries, deaths, and arrests, as well as in considerable property damage that was concentrated in predominantly black neighborhoods. There have been few studies of a systematic, econometric nature that examine the impact of the riots on the relative economic status of African Americans, or on the cities and neighborhoods in which the riots took. We present two complementary empirical analyses. The first uses aggregate, city-level data on income, employment, unemployment, and the area's racial composition from the published volumes of the federal censuses. We estimate the "riot effect" by both ordinary least squares and two-stage least squares. The second empirical approach uses individual-level census data from the Integrated Public Use Microdata Series for 1950, 1970, and 1980. The findings suggest that the riots had negative effects on blacks' income and employment that were economically significant and that may have been larger in the long run (1960-1980) than in the short run (1960-1970). We view these findings as suggestive rather than definitive for two reasons. First, the data are not detailed enough to identify the precise mechanisms at work. Second, the wave of riots may have had negative spillover effects to cities that did not experience severe riots; if so, we would tend to underestimate the riots' overall effect." The Detroit Riot of 1967 is heavily profiled, as are its effects. Bottom line: the Riot of 1967 caused greater harm to blacks in Detroit than good. Many individuals are better off (but we question whether the Riot is the catalyst) but the City, its neighborhoods, its image, its future are still very damaged. The people who left weren't hurt - except with the bitterness that they still carry when they see the City. The people who stayed are. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5862 Registered: 02-2004 |
Good research Southwestmap, The conclusion from the argument is most riots in American Cities are not RACE RELATED just like the 1967 riots in Detroit. But white folks address the riots as it started by black-folks. Added to the fear that the context of media biased news quoting: " Hundreds of Colored people stored through the streets, looting homes and businesses..." would be next scare tactic sowing the seeds of white flight to greener pastures. Institutional segregation and xenophobia in America is also fuel by the power of words and codespeaks and it will be branded is history forever. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9096 Registered: 12-2003 |
quote: Honored and accepted, but not necessary. I am not upset, just aware and thankful you gave me reason to consider this fully. MOST times when I'm posting, I'm thinking THROUGH a thing...that is one reason why they can sound so convoluted sometimes, appearing to take many sides of an issue simultaneously. I understand what you see about REAL housing, while some think affordable simply means government row housing ghettos. Laughing at the split between you and thejesus...cannot picture the one I know rolling his eyes into the back of his head over something as simple as this...but can also see where he's at in a way. When I say the money has not done generations well, I specifically mean that the money isn't the answer. Attention to people, treating them with the honor and respect each and everyone deserves (UNTIL they abdicate such with their attitudes and behavior, of course), and moving in love to help them learn the basics of living WELL for themselves AND society in general...THAT seems more the answer for me. I need to search out MORE of the foundational stuff that headed up the EARLY New Society programs of the sixties, my old mentor Haskell Stone used to work with them...I'll have to finally overcome the pain of his death and approach his widow with questions of his involvement. Hurts my heart just to consider this, but I must. Cheers on my way out to lunch...think it'll be Union Street today. | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 975 Registered: 12-2006 |
"At what point did this thread turn into a white/black racial debate?" My best guess is when Rogerjab turned up. | ||
Kimistree Member Username: Kimistree Post Number: 51 Registered: 01-2004 |
Rogerjab started the thread. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5863 Registered: 02-2004 |
Quozl you quote that blame the vandalism, garbage and graffiti on "Whitey", DPS, The Big 3 and BAMN. It is all their fault doncha know. Yes! like King Kwame said BLAME THE ADULTS for the exploitation of our children. | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 890 Registered: 10-2003 |
The earlier edit of the article was incorrect. It has been fixed below: Rob Widdis / Special to The Detroit News Child Abductor Shanta Driver is the national co-chair of BAMN. Her group is being sued by the parents of local children that she kidnapped. Pepper-sprayed students alleged; suits planned Jennifer Mrozowski / The Detroit News DETROIT -- Detroit Public Schools parents expressed outrage Wednesday, saying their children were pepper-sprayed by police after a purported civil rights group took them to a protest at several schools without their permission. Three of those parents turned out for a press conference in which the purported civil rights group BAMN -- the Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action, Integration and Immigration Rights and Fight for Equality By Any Means Necessary -- announced that unnamed Detroit parents planned to file a $10 million lawsuit against Detroit Public Schools and the city of Detroit for the pepper spray incident Tuesday. The fact that Detroit parents planned to file a $30 million lawsuit against BAMN appeared to be unknown by Ms. Driver. BAMN led the protest against the district's planned school closures, which turned confrontational at Northern High School. Some parents say the organization put their children in jeopardy. "You exploited my kids to fight your fight," Detroit resident Monique Greene said of the protest organizers. Greene said her 14-year-old son, who attends Malcolm X Academy, got sprayed with a chemical agent during the protest. She said she signed a permission slip to allow the eighth-grader to attend a demonstration against the planned school closings, but the march was supposed to be at the Coleman A. Young Municipal Center -- not Northern High or other schools. She said she plans to file a lawsuit against BAMN. No explanation was provided by BAMN as to why they took children on this cross-city journey apparently risking their well-being without consent of their parents or even notification of the true itinerary of their day. George Washington, a Detroit attorney apparently representing the parents suing the city and district, said both city and school police were involved in the melee in which children were said to have been pepper-sprayed. No evidence to date would indicate that this is true. The district won't comment on the lawsuit, expected to be filed this week, said spokesman Lekan Oguntoyinbo. The protest resulted in eight people being arrested, including one student, school district spokeswoman Mattie Majors said Tuesday. Seven other students were detained at the march, she said. Protest organizers said the police reaction was unnecessarily brutal, but district officials have said students were out of control, banging on doors and windows of the school. Police questioned the sincerity of statements from an organization that kidnaps children and places them in harms way to address grievances that the protesters are apparently unable to address effectively as adults. Defending the organization’s position against the upcoming lawsuits, Shanta Driver, national co-chair of BAMN said "We think this was Rodney King-style violence being used against a peaceful protest of students and teachers and other adults," This apparent comparison between a known felon and the children kidnapped by BAMN did not sit well with the parents of the kidnapped children who were not impressed by the deflection of blame upon their here-to-fore innocent children. The Detroit Police Department was not the arresting agency and did not use pepper spray, said spokesman James Tate. "All we did was process the arrestees that Detroit Public Schools officers brought into our department," he said. | ||
Ray Member Username: Ray Post Number: 880 Registered: 06-2004 |
Boy, I sure hope the FBI has infiltrated this organization. Irresponsible, manipulative, dangerous, counterproductive. | ||
Wally2times Member Username: Wally2times Post Number: 35 Registered: 03-2007 |
Maybe I'm interputing this wrong but from what I read in "their" mission statement , it seems to me that this group is not interested in equality at all. At least not for white people. It seems to me that these people always taking to the streets in protest of "racism" are poor and disgruntled because their lives are shitty. Well minorities, join the group. Plenty of us poor underprivlaged white people too. Who can we blame? Affirmitive Action has played itself out. Please thi is utterly ridiculous in this day and age. I can't imagine whats going to happen when a depression hits. Seems like everyone is against white people and it really disheartens me the way minorities cry foul over racism but yet they are the most vocal to practice it. tsk tsk tsk oh and one last thing, being a "LEGAL IMMIGRANT" myself I detest the fact that morons are trying to legalize all these criminals in our country when all they do is drain our system and its unfortunate that american minorty groups are siding with them especially since they suffer financially in large part due to the drain on the system illegals have caused. tsk tsk tsk Seems like only tax paying individuals like me are the ones really discriminated against. | ||
Janesback Member Username: Janesback Post Number: 321 Registered: 08-2006 |
Wally2, I just got my tax appraisal for my home. Needless to say, we the tax payer continue to pay for services that are used by illegals. Im in Texas, and 50 % of my tax money go to public schools where the kids hit 11th grade and drop out. Normally, its because they cant attend school and take care of their babies at the same time. Grandma helps out, she is paid from the state to babysit her grandchildren with tax payers money The health care is a joke . The county hospital is full , doctors are stressed handeling appointments of people who have the flu, colds, fevers, not a life threatening illness. Hospitals cant refuse anyone who comes to the emergency I have had a few minorities tell me this country was built on immigrants. I say, right, mine came thru Ellis Island and Galveston. There is documentation on these events. The ones now are "in your face" that they are here and refuse to learn the common language . My response to that is Corporate America does not speak Spanish, learn English, or get used to scrubbing toilets of cutting grass. Eventually, taxpayers will move out of this county because of high tax assessments and high appraisals, the city loses its tax base and guess what? Slums appear, and the neighborhood goes to shit....... Seems people should focus on education to rid themselves of problems they encounter. We all have choices, so instead of having 3 or 4 kids by the age of 19, stay in school and get educated....Instead of finding excuses to fail, they need to find reasons to succeed... Jane | ||
Wally2times Member Username: Wally2times Post Number: 40 Registered: 03-2007 |
In Hazelton PA they placed a law on the books and are enforcing it to its fullest. Anyone harboring illegals, answers to the court. Anyone hiring illegals answers to the court. Any illegals arrested go straight to immigration and proceedings for deportation are started immediately. Needles to say the towns residents were more than accomidating to the illegals and gave notice. The day the laws were put into effect, 1000's of people were seen leaving Hazelton in the middle of the night. Hazelton's population doubled in the last few years but its tax intake remained the same. And you morons want to allow these leeches to stay in America? Are you kidding me? Whats more is that the minorities here are siding with them and don't even realize that they are getting it right in the ass without the vaseline from illegals but still want to blame "whitey"/ go figure. and just for the record, whenever someone , anyone tells me they are here illegally or "without papers" I go out of my way to make sure I report them to immigration. (Message edited by wally2times on May 05, 2007) | ||
Eric_w Member Username: Eric_w Post Number: 159 Registered: 02-2007 |
A great reason to keep kids away from Detroit schools and another great reason not to live there | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1093 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Well minorities, join the group. Plenty of us poor underprivlaged white people too. Who can we blame?" That doesn't matter... The philosophy of BAMN and EVERY other pro-affirmative action group is that poor white people shouldn't mind being bumped to the back of the line since there are already plenty of privileged white people at the front of the line to make up for this... i.e., a poor white person who got a better score on the test or is more qualified for the job than a black person still has to stay poor and let the black person ahead of him, even if that black person in privileged...and if the white person complains and calls the practice unfair, he's a racist... Well, that completes Affirmative Action 101...are there any questions? | ||
Wally2times Member Username: Wally2times Post Number: 43 Registered: 03-2007 |
Jesus, the "who can we blame " remark was meant to be sarcastic. Im sorry, maybe I should be more clear when writing. My Bad. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1094 Registered: 06-2006 |
WTT: I was aware of that...I was actually responding to what you said before "who can we blame", more or less agreeing with you... | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 979 Registered: 12-2006 |
It's not really your fault. It's just hard to convey sarcasm over a forum. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 9108 Registered: 12-2003 |
Southwestmap, I'd love to read that whole study, and see where their definitions loophole or truncate. If they are only defining the geographic area of Detroit...saying the civil unrest/riots lowered value and potential, limited jobs and income...then there might be room for argument against their conclusions. What of the Black population who advanced, by any means necessary, and are now living in...say...Farmington Hills, the Bloomfields, Birmingham, yanno where it is not so much a black/white thing as a fresh GREEN one. I'd say if we're open to a potential positive effect of the riots, it might be on families who saw that they needed to insure the next generation be more prepared than they and well able to take advantage of the assistance and opportunities advanced through the New Society and even military service in peacetime. (I'd guess that both increased advanced and professional degree acquisition more than about anything outside the NAACP, but I have no idea on specifics) So, tracking the entire black population at large, not simply those who stayed behind in the city, might show a different economic value to the populous percolator boiling over...let alone perhaps a more accurate conclusion. But I'm guessing...heh. If this study is available for public access, I'd take the time to check it out. Cheers. | ||
Eric_w Member Username: Eric_w Post Number: 163 Registered: 02-2007 |
"Bottom line: the Riot of 1967 caused greater harm to blacks in Detroit than good. Many individuals are better off (but we question whether the Riot is the catalyst) but the City, its neighborhoods, its image, its future are still very damaged. The people who left weren't hurt - except with the bitterness that they still carry when they see the City. The people who stayed are." One of the most accurate observations I've seen on this forum! | ||
Eastside_charlie Member Username: Eastside_charlie Post Number: 48 Registered: 02-2007 |
Sounds like all these kids needed was a little corrective discipline |
