  Jerome81 Member Username: Jerome81 Post Number: 1198 Registered: 11-2003 |
Does such a thing exist? If not, would having one prove helpful in trying to combat the crime? If residents and police are aware of trends they can better work to stop them. I don't think it would be a tool for fear, but rather a useful crime reduction tool. I couldn't find anything searching on google. Oh, and BTW, every time I visit the COD website, I'm amazed by the depth of its suckiness. | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1252 Registered: 11-2003 |
Yes, it's called Compstat, and I don't think it's public record at this time. | ||
Yvette248 Member Username: Yvette248 Post Number: 181 Registered: 10-2006 |
Compstat isn't public, but there is a map of crime areas that are released publicly. The newspapers usually print one periodically. The chamber of commerce "may" have something like that also. I know I've seen it a couple of times - I just can't remember where. But I was impressed by the number of "safe" neighborhoods in Detroit that doesn't make the daily news. | ||
Haydenth Member Username: Haydenth Post Number: 197 Registered: 05-2005 |
There is nothing. I've attempted to start a site like chicagocrime.org, but had no luck. I contacted a guy at WSU who was very helpful, but he told me I'd have a hard time getting anything from the DPD. They are reluctant to release any kind of raw data to the public because of the bad press they often get from the local media outlets. The idea of spending hours/days/weeks working through the city bureaucracy just wasn't worth it. Other cities, like Chicago and Seattle release the raw data out to the public (or at least put it in a screen-scrapeable format). The DPD does no such thing and does not intend to in the near future. May, I add, if anyone *can* get ahold of raw crime data and regular updates from the city, I would be more than happy to help design a dynamic database-driven map/reporting site (like chicagocrime.org). (Message edited by haydenth on November 22, 2006) | ||
Izzadore Member Username: Izzadore Post Number: 10 Registered: 11-2006 |
Releasing this information is a good thing. When Chicago first released crime statistics everyone was shook up. But now people can see progress in the bad areas. This information gives the police and the community no excuse to turn the other cheek. I'm sure Detroit's statistics are bad but the police have to start somewhere and it may as well be the bottom. | ||
Haydenth Member Username: Haydenth Post Number: 198 Registered: 05-2005 |
Unfortunately, in many parts of Detroit, the city does "turn the other cheek" and the DPD is not a very forward-looking organization. I know our officers out there are doing the best they can, however the folks in city hall are leaving them high-and-dry. | ||
Izzadore Member Username: Izzadore Post Number: 11 Registered: 11-2006 |
Competition between communities may help lower crime rates on the worst police beats. The neighborhood that has the worst crime rate will instantly try to change that. They'll call the police when they see suspect actions or when they witness a crime. And, the information should be posted by the City not a third party. | ||
Brandon48202 Member Username: Brandon48202 Post Number: 122 Registered: 12-2004 |
A while back the News/Free Press published some maps. Crime was clustered in certain areas- there were huge differenced in different parts of the city. | ||
Jerome81 Member Username: Jerome81 Post Number: 1200 Registered: 11-2003 |
Yes, I am thinking city released data with maps and an incident list. Having the knowledge is a place to start. Otherwise people run around blind. I guess it sorta came up because I remembered in Chicago there was something, and any time there was a mugger/rapist or something, there were notices about it and instructions on how to better protect yourself. Sure it is scary to think about, but would you rather know and be able to take action or get caught by surprise one night? Also, here in PA they post incidents in the local paper. I laugh cause many of them are "suspicious dog" or "someone lost a wallet", but they do keep track of bulgaries and assaults and such. We had a problem with eggings a couple months back (my car got hit twice....grrrrr...), and the police put out a bulletin warning people and reminding the perps that this was vandalism and not a harmless prank. Hasn't happened in months. I'd think that extending that to Detroit would allow the police and residents to do the same thing. And if criminals know people are following them and watching out and possibly taking actions to protect themselves and their property, they might stop doing it. | ||
Izzadore Member Username: Izzadore Post Number: 12 Registered: 11-2006 |
Right. I have lived in the worst neighborhood for crime in Chicago (of course I didn't know that when I moved to Chicago.) When we saw ourselves against other communities it was a wake up call. We, not the police, stopped the loitering, watched the streets, called the city when lights were out, called the police when we saw cars that sat too long and looked suspicious (i.e. no city sticker.) And we did this when we realized that calling 911 was not enough. Every resident did not want to live in a neighborhood on the bottom of the list. I have not been to midtown for a few years. Maybe dialing 911 is adequate there because WSU "may" patrol the area too but as for the rest of the city... Crime statistics help everyone. Also, everyone should know that there are other ways to combat crime than a call to 911. Every big city's police department needs help. Especially now, when it seems Detroit is NOt in a hurry to rehire them. | ||
Haydenth Member Username: Haydenth Post Number: 200 Registered: 05-2005 |
I deleted my original post because I was going too far off topic and didn't feel like debating this. I'd like to see the DPD release the raw data, however I doubt it will ever happen for a multitude of reasons. | ||
Nainrouge Member Username: Nainrouge Post Number: 103 Registered: 05-2006 |
Haydenth, I have also had the same experience with the DPD. I was working with a group that filed a Freedom of Information request with the DPD for just basic crime data by census tract and just got a copy the DPD web site in response. I believe this is VERY short sighted. First of all, I believe that by paying taxes, we are entitled to know what is going on. I don't believe that the DPD has the right to keep the data from the public. Also, it doesn't do any good to try to hide it. The image of crime in Detroit is about as bad as it gets and I believe that the impression that most folks have of crime in Detroit is MUCH worse than the reality. Making crime stats public would probably help to reduce the bad impression that many people have. This was true of a report that Wayne State did that shows that the crime downtown is much less than people thought. I think that it might take a law suit to get some action. However, it has to be from a group that can kiss friendly relations with DPD goodbye forever. | ||
Udmphikapbob Member Username: Udmphikapbob Post Number: 212 Registered: 07-2004 |
WSU has info from 2004 mapped by census tract: http://gis.culma.wayne.edu/web site/crime/viewer.htm | ||
Izzadore Member Username: Izzadore Post Number: 13 Registered: 11-2006 |
You'll get no debate here. Everyone agrees that this is important data to make available for many reasons. It would be interesting to find out how often DPD calculates totals and if they can, without Federal help, put statistics in a readable format - on a map that has beat overlays. And the statistics should be recent. If the statistics get to the public 8 to 10 months after data collection the affected communities may not care. | ||
Jerome81 Member Username: Jerome81 Post Number: 1201 Registered: 11-2003 |
I was thinking a 1x/week type of thing. Hell, maybe even day to day. | ||
Haydenth Member Username: Haydenth Post Number: 201 Registered: 05-2005 |
I spoke with the creator of chicagocrime.org. Chicago runs this site called Citizen ICAM where they post the aggregate data on a weekly basis. His information just comes from there (it's a public repository). http://12.17.79.6/ctznicam/ctz nicam.asp These types of things give citizens the power to hold those in elected office *responsible*, something the politicians and administrators of this town fear. | ||
Izzadore Member Username: Izzadore Post Number: 14 Registered: 11-2006 |
You may have to dig a bit but you can find a beat map on CPD's site. This helps citizens know why squad cars always turn away from or into your block while they cruise. [then the lightbulb comes on.] Detroit WILL get all of this one day. The sooner the better. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 1931 Registered: 10-2003 |
We have something pretty neat in the District: http://crimemap.dc.gov I tried to post an image, but there's so much detail, it was impossible to get it below 50kB. You'll just have to check it out yourself. If the once-dysfunctional DC government can put something like this together, there's no reason they can't do it in Detroit--with a little motivated leadership, of course. | ||
Erikd Member Username: Erikd Post Number: 766 Registered: 10-2003 |
I would like to see better crime reporting for the entire country. The major newspapers and TV news programs should give us regular updates about crime in America. Check out these numbers... http://www.disastercenter.com/ crime/uscrime.htm Over SIX HUNDRED THOUSAND people have been MURDERED in America during the last 30 years. Why isn't this on the front page of the NY Times and the lead story on NBC Nightly News? | ||
Futurecity Member Username: Futurecity Post Number: 386 Registered: 05-2005 |
^^Over SIX HUNDRED THOUSAND people have been KILLED in America by AUTOMOBILES in the last 15 YEARS (only 1/2 the time for the equivalent number of murders). Why isn't this on the front page of the NY Times and the lead story on NBC Nightly News?^^ Get a clue brother, get a clue. (Message edited by Futurecity on November 23, 2006) | ||
220hendrie1910 Member Username: 220hendrie1910 Post Number: 50 Registered: 02-2006 |
To the person who requested detailed info about Detroit crime stats: I posted an interactive overlay for Google Earth here some months back, based on a Detroit News story of 2004. (It includes CoD shootings only, excluding HP and Hamtramck.) Have at it: https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/76017/82019.html?1158184 922 Map-happy in Ottawa. | ||
Gravitymachine Member Username: Gravitymachine Post Number: 1394 Registered: 05-2005 |
crimestats?! aren't those illegal 'round these parts? | ||
Erikd Member Username: Erikd Post Number: 769 Registered: 10-2003 |
Futurecity, I must be totally clueless, because I don't get your point. 600,000 murders are no big deal because twice as many people were killed in traffic accidents over the same period? Over FIVE HUNDRED THOUSAND people have been KILLED in America by CANCER in the last YEAR, so the 600,000 people killed in car accidents over the last 15 years, and the 600,000 people murdered over the last 30 years make up a small percentage of the total death toll in America. A quick look at the numbers will show that murder is not the leading cause of death in America, but a clueless person (such as myself) might suggest that the murder rate in America is horrific. | ||
Erikd Member Username: Erikd Post Number: 770 Registered: 10-2003 |
I really need to thank Futurecity for giving me a clue about how things really are... I used to get upset about the number of people murdered in America every year, but Futurecity has shown me the light. Futurecity was the first person to show me that murder is no big deal when it is compared to accidental death. People are killed by cancer, heart attacks, and accidents every day. If really you think about it, we are all going to die someday, so what is the difference between a car crash and a murder? ---------------- According to Futurecity, accidental death in a car crash is about the same as murder, so I suppose we should start treating them as such. A fatal car crash on I75 is just like a double-homicide robbery. If two people are killed, what is the difference? | ||
Futurecity Member Username: Futurecity Post Number: 387 Registered: 05-2005 |
If two people are killed needlessly, exactly what is the difference, Erikd? Tell me how one needless death is somehow more tragic than another, equally needless death. I can't wait to hear your answer. | ||
Erikd Member Username: Erikd Post Number: 773 Registered: 10-2003 |
The difference is intent. This is why we have laws against killing people on purpose, and why we don't have laws against killing people on accident. ------------ Maybe an example will help to clarify this concept... Example 1: Joe is driving home from work, and something unexpected (such as a tire blow-out, a patch of ice, or debris on the road) causes him to lose control of his vehicle. Due to this unexpected event, Joe crashes into another car, accidentally killing the driver in the other car. Example 2: Sam wants a quick and easy way to acquire a bunch of money, so he chooses to rob a store. Sam walks into the store, murders the clerk, and then he steals cash and goods. In both examples, an innocent person was tragically killed, but there is a huge difference between the two examples. Joe did not choose to kill the person driving the other car. Joe did not cause the accident on purpose. Joe never wanted to kill the driver of the other car. Unlike Joe, Sam chose to kill the store clerk so he could rob the store. Sam wanted to kill the clerk, and he did it on purpose. Joe was involved in a tragic situation that killed a person by accident. Sam chose to kill a person because he wanted to do it. Joe is not charged with a crime, because he killed a person by accident. Sam is convicted of murder, and sent to prison because he killed a person on purpose. ------------------ Does this help explain the difference between accidental death and intentional murder? | ||
Futurecity Member Username: Futurecity Post Number: 389 Registered: 05-2005 |
In your example, it sounds like they both died violently, tragically and needlessly. According to your logic, the family of the person that Joe killed would be be very pleased to know that the person died "accidentally" ("Whew! We're all so relieved!"). However, Was Joe drunk?, was Joe driving fast? Was Joe in control of his vehicle at all times - probably not. However, luckily for Joe, the "system" is designed for fools like him. The "system" is designed to keep him driving and driving and driving, for even the most basic of life's needs. And if he kills someone, so be it, it was just an "accident", and he will be allowed to drive (kill?) again. (Message edited by Futurecity on December 04, 2006) | ||
Detroitduo Member Username: Detroitduo Post Number: 769 Registered: 06-2005 |
Wow... you guys have really managed to kill a really good thread. I hope your ridiculous argument does not discourage the earlier contributers from creating such a useful website with useful information. I think making the regions of the City responsible and "competitive" would be very helpful. Also, I would be VERY interested to know of all the goings-on in and around my neighborhood, because one only hears rumours and those can be distorted facts. If there is anyone out there who can make this happen, I commend you and hope you can be successful. This sort of information can be a catalyst to change the City! | ||
Goat Member Username: Goat Post Number: 9025 Registered: 10-2003 |
jt1 used to be oustanding in compiling and providing these sort of stats. Sadly, he will be missed. |
