Discuss Detroit » Archives - Beginning July 2006 » YAY Detroit! « Previous Next »
Shootings on the West sideCman71011-16-06  4:26 pm
Shootings on the West sideDhugger11-16-06  9:01 pm
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 1475
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 10:32 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://news.yahoo.com

*sigh*
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Miss_cleo
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Username: Miss_cleo

Post Number: 359
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 10:48 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yes, a GREAT place to raise a family. Why oh why was I so foolish as to leave?
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Lilpup
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Post Number: 1476
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 10:55 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hope they catch this guy just to find out what his motivation was - gang initiation? purely anti-social? hoping for suicide by cop (or other)?

wonder what the age range of the other three victims is - maybe the kid has something against adults
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Danny
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Post Number: 5206
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 10:57 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

YAY! Detroit. Where Murder is the law! WE HOPE YOU SURVIVE!
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Hit24sqft
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Username: Hit24sqft

Post Number: 31
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 12:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am shocked, shocked !

This is Detroit - not St Louis or some place !
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Saintme
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Username: Saintme

Post Number: 9
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 12:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Perhaps they are copy-catting the serial shootings in the DC area and later in Ohio a few years back?

This story really chills me to the bone.
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Ericdfan
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Username: Ericdfan

Post Number: 173
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 12:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

so thats what all those damn sirens were last night that woke me up
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Lowell
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 1:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

YAY New York City!

YAY Chicago!
http://www.suntimes.com/news/m etro/138491,CST-NWS-anamateo16 .articleprint

YAY Miami!

YAY San Francisco!

YAY Dallas!

YAY Philadelphia!

YAY Elkhart, Indiana??

YAY Washington, DC!

YAY Iraq!
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Dds
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Post Number: 25
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 1:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

YAY Saskatchewan!
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Cman710
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Post Number: 13
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 1:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Some 2005 statistics for perspective:

New York City, population 8 million +, had 540 murders.

Detroit, population a bit under 1 million, had 359 murders.

Having grown up in NY during the worst of the crime peak in 1990-1991 and then through the great drop in crime that followed, I can definitely attest that the drop in crime rate had to do with both changes in social factors (like the decline of the crack epidemic) and also much more effective policing.

Not being from Detroit, but wanting to see the city succeed very badly, I do not know where to place the blame. Are poverty and drug use and other factors so strong that even effective policing could not improve this situation? It does not seem like Detroit's police are doing a very effective job, but perhaps they are making the best of an awful situation.
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Lilpup
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Post Number: 1477
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 2:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, poverty is that strong here.
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Dds
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 2:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Excellent point, Cman. The media can make murders look bad anywhere (hence the YAY Saskatchewan post). The reality of the matter here in Detroit, in contrast to the number of bars and restaurants opening downtown, the socio-economic environment of the city as a whole is mostly stagnant... As is the State of Michigan's. The number of murders not reported, or reported as "accidental deaths" is very high, according to the 10-20 police officers I come into contact with every month.
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Charlottepaul
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Post Number: 41
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 2:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Also, the media over report violent crime. In general it has been going down in the US, but stories in the local evening newscasts are increasingly reporting violent crimes because the channels want higher viewer ratings. Therefore, people perceive that they are more likely to be the victim of a crime in Detroit, for example, than they otherwise truly are.

See Myron Orfield's "Metropolitics" book
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Jerome81
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Post Number: 1185
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detnews has an update that the woman in the Impala was a neighborhood patrol person and that apparently the suspect said something to one of the victims, but they aren't saying what.

If this was a deliberate hit on this woman because of the neighborhood patrol, well, I don't know what to say. Its bad enough as it is, but if criminals are becoming so brash as to believe they can put a hit on a family woman working for the betterment of her neighborhood, and get away with it, well I guess that puts this at a whole new level of seriousness.

Criminals in Detroit are NOT afraid of getting caught, because most of them aren't. And I think it is making them bolder and more ruthless. That is a trend that MUST stop immediately. We don't want a 1930's Chicago situation to erupt here with gangs putting out hits, and especially not on innocent people working to protect their neighborhoods.

All speculation on my part, of course....

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20061116/U PDATE/611160442

I guess the only good that may come out of this is that people are so repulsed that they decide to take an incredibly aggressive stand, much like Chicago and the feds did after the St. Valentine's Day Massacre in Chicago way back when. Unfortunately instead I believe people would rather cut and run, which is probably what will end up happening to this neighborhood.
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Jerome81
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh, and can we change the title of this thread? "YAY Detroit" doesn't really do anything to describe what is being discussed here. And particularly for a discussion that is important to have.
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Eric
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cman I think blame can easily be place on both factors. Detroit has huge problems with poverty/drugs add to that a police force stretched too thin and you have recipe for most of Detroit's crime problems. Though this crime in particular seems more the act of random sociopaths, usually there isn't that much can be done to stop those type of crimes.
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Warriorfan
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

YAY New York City!

YAY Chicago!
http://www.suntimes.com/news/m etro/138491,CST-NWS-anamateo16 .articleprint

YAY Miami!

YAY San Francisco!

YAY Dallas!

YAY Philadelphia!

YAY Elkhart, Indiana??

YAY Washington, DC!

YAY Iraq!





1) With the exception of Washington DC and Iraq, I think you will find that Detroit's murder rate per capita is significantly higher than any of those other large American cities you mentioned. Yes, murders happen everywhere, but they seem to happen FAR MORE OFTEN in Detroit.

2) I really don't think comparisons to Iraq are helping your argument any. Being less violent than Iraq is not really a point of pride. I can see the advertising now..."Come visit Detroit, now less violent than Baghdad!"
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Hysteria
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Username: Hysteria

Post Number: 1664
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

2) I really don't think comparisons to Iraq are helping your argument any. Being less violent than Iraq is not really a point of pride.




How true.

(Message edited by hysteria on November 16, 2006)
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Udmphikapbob
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

seem to happen FAR MORE OFTEN




see CharlottePaul's post inre: media coverage.

murders happen at a far lower rate than we're led to believe by watching the news. not making excuses for Detroit, btw, just saying.
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Susanarosa
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Username: Susanarosa

Post Number: 1238
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 3:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ahem...

IT DOESN'T MATTER THAT MURDERS HAPPEN AT A FAR LOWER RATE THAT WE'RE LED TO BELIEVE BY WATCHING THE NEWS!

What matters is that we live in a city where there is currently a manhunt going on for two people who shot 5 people last night! No posts or books or comparisons to Elkhart, Indiana is going to change that.
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Hockey_player
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Post Number: 259
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 4:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

QUote:
"see CharlottePaul's post inre: media coverage.

murders happen at a far lower rate than we're led to believe by watching the news. not making excuses for Detroit, btw, just saying."

What? So the news is making up crimes? Because crime is obviously happening at the rate of the events they are reporting. For it to be less bad than reported, they have to be manufacturing crime scenes and police searches.
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Cman710
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 4:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It may be true that television news make people feel that murders are constantly happening. This is not true, as 359 a year would work out to less than one per day.

One fact that focusing on murder obscures, however, is that the high murder rate only signifies a much deeper crime problem. And these other crimes do happen very frequently and affect people's daily lives.

Using data from areaconnect.com, you can find the following, using 2004 statistics. In Detroit you are:

1. Almost 4 times as likely to be a victim of a violent crime than the national average.

2. More than twice as likely to be raped.

3. Over 4 times as likely to be robbed.

4. Over 3 times as likely to be victim of aggravated assault.

5. About 1 3/4 times as likely to be a victim of property crime.

6. About 9(!) times as likely to be the victim of a motor theft crime.

The only number that compares favorably to the national average is Larceny/Thefts, which was slightly below the national average.

Now, I know that some of you will argue, "Yes, but you need to compare Detroit to big cities, not a national average!" That is true, but (1) we need some basis of comparison that is available for the purposes of this discussion, since this is not a formal study, and (2) most of the nation's crime will occur in big cities, so the national numbers are not entirely misleading.

At any rate, the real problem is not that people cannot cope with this level of crime. They surely can, and will. The problem is that high crime rates makes life more difficult, inhibits economic growth, and makes the city generally less attractive.

Any solution to Detroit's problems requires that people feel safe. Otherwise, they will leave and go someplace where they can live with less worry.
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Tetsua
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 4:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Don't forget ... yay Lexington, KY

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20061116/NEW S99/61116033
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Dds
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Username: Dds

Post Number: 28
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 4:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

murders happen at a far lower rate than we're led to believe by watching the news. not making excuses for Detroit, btw, just saying.




The 10-15 police officers I come in contact with downtown each month beg to differ with you. A few in particular are very candid about the amount of suspected murders that are reported as "accidental deaths," and the like. If anything, the media is sensationalizing the murders they report, but under reporting the actual statistics.

Regardless of your opinion of Detroit Police Officers, and I've seen threads and posts I consider bordering obscene concerning them on this site, I have the highest regard for the job they do, with what they are allowed to do, and the resources they have. I consider my personal sources more accurate than the media any day.

This city has huge problems that million dollar condos, entertainment, city boosters, winter blasts, etc. etc. etc will not solve. I wish I knew what it would take, but comparing Detroit's problems with those of other cities implying that "other cities have the same problems" does nothing to improve the quality of life here.

I will again compliment Cman's post.
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Kimmiann
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 4:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Question - why did this story make the national news? I saw it in the New York Times online today as well as hearing it on the news this morning. I'm sure we can all agree that this incident is horrible, but it is unusual, I think, for what strikes me as a local crime story to grab the national spotlight. Certainly the vast majority of shootings in the Detroit area never make it to the national news. Any idea why this one did?
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Susanarosa
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 4:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Because five people were shot, apparently by random?

I'd say that's newsworthy.
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Cman710
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 5:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kimmiann,

Five people are not typically shot within ten minutes, so I think that provided more shock value than a typical one person homicide. In New York City a few summers ago, 3 or 4 people were shot over a weekend (July 4th weekend, I think, but I am not sure), and that made the local news in a way normal shootings do not. When many people are killed in a small amount of time, it gets more coverage. (The same has been true of national media coverage of Iraq, actually.)
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Chub
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 5:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Linwood is a busy, four-lane street that runs through blocks of old homes. The area around the shooting scene is lined with liquor stores, empty lots, a church, gas stations and abandoned buildings".

I'd say this perfectly sums up what a lot of Detroit looks like these days. I travel that area of Linwood once or twice a week and always feel sad that some of the great people and homes in that area are stuck in the middle of crap like this.
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Charlottepaul
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 5:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dds said, "This city has huge problems that million dollar condos, entertainment, city boosters, winter blasts, etc. etc. etc will not solve."

That statement is not necessarily correct. One of the best solutions is the deconcentration of poverty. The high-rise projects of the 1960s were the worst for crime and the 'lower income' folks. Creating 'rich person' condos in Detroit could in theory begin to mix people of different incomes in these areas. Similarly, a 'poor' person living in a 'rich' person area is more likely to do better than with those of a similar income. Therefore, one of the best solutions to combat crimes are mixed income communities. Bloomfield Hills should take 'poor' people just the same as Detroit should take 'rich' people.

See Myron Orfield's "Metropolitics" book
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Supersport
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 5:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just another signature Detroit day

...and that's all I gotta say about that.
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Matt
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 5:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Off-topic: Those are some pretty trashy collars your dogs have got on, Sporto. :P
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Udmphikapbob
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 5:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

WASHINGTON (AP) — Even as violent crime rates shrink, news outlets unfairly focus on young Latino and black men who commit acts of violence, a media think tank says.

The result of the skewed coverage is a public that believes youth crime is on the rise and supports policies based on that notion, the Berkeley Media Studies group asserted Tuesday.

The research project, "Off Balance: Youth, Race and Crime in the News," examined crime coverage in media outlets across the nation.

The study contained several major findings.

Homicide coverage on network news increased 473% from 1990 to 1998, while homicides decreased 32.9% during that time, the report said. While homicides committed by youth declined by 68% from 1993 to 1999, 62% of the public reported they believed youth crime was on the rise.

The report also said black people too often are portrayed as perpetrators and are underrepresented as victims.

Homicides make up one- to two-tenths of one percent of all arrests, but 27 to 29 percent of all crimes reported on the evening news are of homicides. Eighty-six percent of white homicide victims are killed by other whites and most homicide victims know their killer. But the least frequent killings - homicide between strangers and interracial killings - receive the most coverage.




not making this crap up. yes, Detroit has one of the highest murder rates per capita, and it is a terrible reflection on our city. media sensationalism does not solve the problem. it scares middle-class folks into running away, further concentrating the impoverished, who then turn to more crime.
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Dds
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 6:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

That statement is not necessarily correct.




[snip]

Charlottepaul-- what you are describing is better known as gentrification. No matter what kind of spin anyone puts on it, in the end gentrification ends up as displacement. Pricing the inner-city out of reach of the majority of the citizens just pushes them into areas where poverty has a stranglehold. Detroit has always had housing and neighborhoods for the wealthy. What has this done for the community as a whole in the past 30 years?

Trickle-down economics, the idea that having rich folks around will allow the money they spend benefit the lower income brackets was discredited years and years ago.

Like I said earlier, I do not and I will not pretend to know what the solution is. This post of mine is waaaay off topic, now anyways.
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Pjazz
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 6:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You know if you don't live in Detroit I'm happy for you. I live in the city and do all I can in my neighborhood (East English Village) to keep it safe. I'm very content where I live and EEV has a relationship with the police and with issues we might have.

There are a lot of people in the city who feel the same way. Detroit is not going to survive by pointing fingers and sarcasm. It will need people regretfully like the woman who was killed who was willing to fight for her nieghborhood.

I truly wish this site would split to Detroit Yes
for People who truly believe in the City, and a second site Detroit No for people who have nothing constructive to do other than bitch and critisize. rant off.
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Hockey_player
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 7:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Right, let us force people into extreme positions of cheerleader or naysayer, rather than thoughtfully acknowledging the mixture of good and bad that is not only Detroit, but all of reality.
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Dds
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 7:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Besides, creating a DetroitNo! site would be duplicating the efforts of others.

(Message edited by dds on November 16, 2006)
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Cman710
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Posted on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 9:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dds, I agree that gentrification can result in displacement. In New York City, this has certainly occurred in certain areas, and in some cases, even the middle class are being either pushed out or squeezed very tightly by rising housing prices. (In Manhattan, a studio apartment that is in a "nice area" can run from $2,000-$2,400 per month.) This can be a real problem, especially if poorer citizens have nowhere else to go.

I think that Detroit probably faces a somewhat different situation, though. For example, there has been much renewal downtown, and recently we saw condo apartments in the Book Cadillac selling for $300,000+. Clearly, those individuals are upper-middle class in income, at the least, and I imagine most are wealthy. But there, I don't think we are seeing many, if any, people displaced. After all, downtown has transformed from an almost entirely desolate area to one into a place where some people want to be.

That leaves the rest of the city, a depopulated city. Unfortunately, middle-class flight has left Detroit with a small tax base and stagnant economic growth. By attracting middle and upper income residents, Detroit would help restore its tax base, which would allow it to invest more in policing, education, social services, and the like. The city would also spur economic growth that would benefit lower-income citizens. Without a city including the wealthy, the middle class, and the poor, Detroit will remain heavily reliant on federal and state aid. In the long term, that means the city cannot control its own destiny.

So, while bringing in wealthier residents may not have a dramatic trickle down effect in wealth, it will improve the tax base and spur economic growth. It will also result in some job growth. Consider all the new lower-income jobs the Book Cadillac project will generate during construction, and then once the hotel/condos open. Such projects provide employment for construction workers, desk workers, porters, housecleaning people, laundry personnel, waiters and waitresses, and the like. All these people will not only be making money, but will be paying taxes (along with the wealthier residents, who will be paying taxes, too).

This is a long post, but I wanted to explain why I feel projects meant to attract middle and upper class citizens are vitally future to Detroit's long term viability. In this process, it remains important to demonstrate sensitivity to the needs of the city's poorer citizens. But a Detroit with a more self-sufficent tax base will be best able to face those challenges.

Dds, I invite you and anyone who disagrees to share their views, too. Building the city of Detroit needs to be a collaborative process, and if you disagree, I would like to hear it!
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Tetsua
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 12:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20061116/NEW S99/61116009

I hope they got the right guy. And if it's him, I hope he gets a proper ass whupping too.
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Dds
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 1:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cman-- to be quite honest with you. That is the most intelligent post I have ever read on DetroitYES.

Not that I wouldn't relish the thought of trading ideas with you, but I'm certain this specific thread need not be cluttered up with socio-economic gab since it is designated to the recent murders.

The murders which are already 13 bodies ahead of last years total according to this morning's News. A news item that is just plain statistic, and not sensationalism.
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Viziondetroit
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 1:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Give em the Blue haze... I got the wood to swing on him, lol.

GOMAB
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 3:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

VIzion do I sense a little Sigma in you?
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Tetsua
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 3:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Are you Greek D_S?
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 3:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

<<<Non- Greek Tets...

G Phi G
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Aschar76
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 8:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Is this the work of the fireworks shooter?
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Cman710
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Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 8:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dds, I appreciate your words. It looks like the city will have more murders than last year, unless December ends up being unusually quiet.
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Ray
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Posted on Saturday, November 18, 2006 - 2:22 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The beginning middle and end of Detroit's crime problem is a poorly run city government and a bad police department.

Nobody wants to admit this, nobody wants to challenge the liberal democratic machine that has run the city (into the ground) for 60 years.

Ultimately, the voters are at fault. They have the power to effect change, but they don't.

All this finger pointing at the "evil Republicans" and "evil corporations." The evil is the corrupt and incompetent political system the runs the city.. What a horrible tragedy for the thousands of crime victims and the hundreds of thousands of residents who are condemned to economic isolation and dislocation.

Just a reality check: while our auto economy flounders, 20 assembly plants have been built around the country. Why not in Michigan? They don't like the water? Are the trees not green enough? Perhaps the soil is too acidic? Come on people: open our eyes. Our dysfunctional culture and political system are the only logical answers for our decline and attendant human suffering.

Jesus, it's enough to make you scream.

Wait, sorry. I forgot. It's all George Bush's fault.
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Johnberk
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Username: Johnberk

Post Number: 49
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Saturday, November 18, 2006 - 11:47 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Unbelievable:

Shootings suspect takes bloody coat to cleaners

A suspect in the shooting rampage in Detroit that left two people dead Thursday took a bloody coat to a dry cleaners before being picked up by city police, a worker at the cleaners said Friday.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20061118/NEW S01/611180385
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Aschar76
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Username: Aschar76

Post Number: 2
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Saturday, November 18, 2006 - 12:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Common Census on Crime

Over the past three decades, urban flight robbed cities of their most ambitious and entrepreneurial taxpayers, leaving many urban neighborhoods—and whole swatches of cities like Detroit—boarded-up wastelands. But what caused the massive exodus to the suburbs? Though some blame racism, hard evidence now shows that the real reason is increased crime.

Economists Julie Berry Cullen of the University of Michigan and Steven D. Levin of the University of Chicago have authored an exhaustive study relating changes in crime rates to changes in population for more than 100 U.S. cities since 1970. The two economists, controlling for other factors, found that every 10 percent rise in a city’s crime rate produces a 1 percent population loss. Roughly, that works out to one less city resident for each reported crime. Most of crime’s impact on city population results in people packing up and leaving, rather than in a smaller number of new residents moving in—perhaps because current residents know the real threat of crime from living close to it. Race made little or no difference in city dwellers’ decisions to move, Cullen and Levin discovered.

As to who is most likely to leave, it’s folks (of all colors) with higher education and young families—exactly the demographic group that provides a city’s sturdiest tax base. They rarely move out of the metropolitan area, and most of them continue working in the city, the authors found; but their tax dollars, and civic input, are lost to it.



http://www.city-journal.org/ht ml/9_1_sndgs08.html

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