  Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 51 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 68.42.78.175 |
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20060901/M ETRO/609010385 Here's something that I thought that I would never see in my lifetime! | ||
623kraw Member Username: 623kraw Post Number: 922 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.61.65.162 |
Did Yamasaki design the fountain? | ||
Toog05 Member Username: Toog05 Post Number: 33 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.61.197.58 |
I thought something was different about it when I went down there, its pretty impressive | ||
Exmotowner Member Username: Exmotowner Post Number: 35 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 205.188.116.137 |
Did that fountain ever work like it was designed? It always seemed to me that it wasnt. I like that fountain because it was designed with kids in mind too. They love to play under it. Glad theyve restored it! | ||
Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 52 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 68.42.78.175 |
The fountain was designed by Isamu Noguchi who also designed Hart Plaza. (Message edited by Ramcharger on September 04, 2006) | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6752 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.136.149.133 |
Did Yamasaki design the fountain? Isamu Noguchi | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 23 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 69.136.11.178 |
Wow, that was a very informative article. Keep it up Detroit News! | ||
623kraw Member Username: 623kraw Post Number: 923 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.61.65.162 |
Thank you - I got Noguchi and Yamasaki mixed up... | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6753 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.136.149.133 |
I had to double-check Noguci's first name. I kept thinking it was Uhura. | ||
Noggin Member Username: Noggin Post Number: 69 Registered: 09-2004 Posted From: 68.40.106.164 |
Nope that was the communication officer on the USS Enterprise. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6755 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.136.149.133 |
Lt. Uhura designed the Dodge Fountain? | ||
Neilr Member Username: Neilr Post Number: 337 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 68.60.139.212 |
To me, one of the most beautiful, restful spots in NYC is the Isamu Noguchi Museum and Garden in Queens. It was his studio and sculpture garden when he was alive, now it’s open to the public, on and off, throughout the year. It’s located in a rather isolated, industrial area; but the Asia Society on Park Ave. runs a shuttle bus back and forth on the weekends. At least it used to.  After World War II, fearing total destruction by atomic bombs, Noguchi designed a massive earth sculpture of a human head, Sculpture to be Seen from Mars, so big it would be seen from Mars so that future extraterrestrials would know that at one time civilized people lived on Earth. This sculpture has yet to be built. In this country, it seems that Noguchi is best know for the design of his lamps and a coffee table that bears his name. | ||
Motorcitymayor2026 Member Username: Motorcitymayor2026 Post Number: 1257 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 24.231.189.137 |
it cost 950,000 to restore the fountain, and the money came from a private, anonymous donor. | ||
Bob Member Username: Bob Post Number: 1108 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.60.105.164 |
I remember on the video screen at the jazz fest them thanking Gretchen Valade for donating money for the fountain renovation. But then again maybe I have it mixed up with thanking her fo rthe jazz fest. | ||
Motorcitymayor2026 Member Username: Motorcitymayor2026 Post Number: 1258 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 24.231.189.137 |
ohh, you could be right... i had it heard it was anonymous.. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 2926 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 66.167.211.42 |
View from yesterday:  | ||
Naturalsister Member Username: Naturalsister Post Number: 805 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.30.75.124 |
It's Jeff, Quote 1: "I had to double-check Noguci's first name. I kept thinking it was Uhura." 2: "Lt. Uhura designed the Dodge Fountain?" You truly slay me! :-) later - naturalsister | ||
Patrick Member Username: Patrick Post Number: 3574 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 75.9.245.204 |
I think one of the Dodge heirs also submitted a design for a fountain memorial. | ||
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936 Post Number: 779 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.96.231.230 |
The will of Mrs. Horace Dodge bequeathed 1 or 2 million for a fountain some thirty years or more back. I truly believe she envisioned something like the Scott Fountain on Belle Isle, not that ugly hunk of plumbing the city ended up with. Plain butt ugly, it is. | ||
Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 53 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 68.42.78.175 |
Actually, Mrs. Dodge was led to believe that the fountain would be similar to “The Magic Fountain of Montijuic” (http://www.barcelona-tourist-g uide.com/albums-en/magic-fount ains-montjuic/) in Barcelona, Spain. She died in 1970, years before the fountain that bears her name was completed in 1981. | ||
Genesyxx Member Username: Genesyxx Post Number: 581 Registered: 02-2004 Posted From: 71.159.22.100 |
Just in time for it to be turned off for the cold months. Horray! | ||
Bvos Member Username: Bvos Post Number: 1932 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 134.215.223.211 |
I think the fountain is very appropriate for it's era and is a nice piece of modern sculpture. The Magic Fountain of Montijuic is a neo-classical/neo-baroque fountain that was appropriate for the 1920s/30s, but would have been very out of place if constructed today. One thing I like about the Dodge Fountain is that it is easy to interact with it and it's very approachable, just like art should be. Those baroque/classical style fountains were meant to just look at. I think it will grow on folks now that it is actually working. Lots of cities have modern fountains. Why is no one complaining about the fountain in Campus Martius? That's a modern fountain. | ||
1953 Member Username: 1953 Post Number: 971 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 209.104.146.146 |
Wouldn't it be great if they replaced the Dodge Fountain with something better? Like, anything, for example. | ||
Gravitymachine Member Username: Gravitymachine Post Number: 1266 Registered: 05-2005 Posted From: 198.208.159.18 |
noguchi rules! | ||
Dialh4hipster Member Username: Dialh4hipster Post Number: 1777 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.187.234 |
What's with all the old folks bitching about ugly modern sculpture? I feel like I accidentally stumbled onto the forum for my grandma's retirement community. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6768 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 208.27.111.125 |
I'd hardly call Luther Haven on E. Grand Blvd. a "retirement community." | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 2933 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 66.167.211.42 |
I agree with Bvos. As much as I dislike many designs of modernist influence, this fountain is a masterpiece of minimalist design - two legs united by a circle above a simple cylinder - pure elegance and simplicity. With is waterflows, it gains complexity, dynamicity and surprise. It is approchable, touchable and interactive; yet does not interfere with sight lines or traffic flow. One of its best recommendations? Kids love it. | ||
Dabirch Member Username: Dabirch Post Number: 1828 Registered: 06-2004 Posted From: 208.44.117.10 |
Priceless... | ||
Kenp Member Username: Kenp Post Number: 36 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 216.93.121.82 |
Was at Hart Plaza yesterday and noticed the fountain working. I recall when is was built it never worked well. Around 10 years ago the city tried to fix it and much to their suprise found that workers had left paint cans and other objects inside it. | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 10550 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 64.118.137.228 |
Quite possibly one of the funniest things I've read on here in a long while. | ||
Johnnny5 Member Username: Johnnny5 Post Number: 360 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 71.227.95.4 |
"Plain butt ugly, it is." Agreed. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 2750 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.105.140 |
I wonder what inspiration Noguchi had for that fountain.... he was probably at Frank's Nursery & Crafts and was looking in the sprinkler aisle... and voila! It came to him... the common circular garden sprinkler would become the modern minimalist centerpiece of his design. Ah... such is genius... | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 27 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 129.9.163.233 |
Alright all you critics, if you guys are so brilliant why don't you throw some ideas out there for a fountain you feel would look better? | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 30 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 129.9.163.233 |
Maybe I should ask this question? If you don't like Noguchi's design then why not suggest another designer, architect, or artist you think would make something more interesting, unique, exciting, or whatever? Here's the catch. He or she still has to be alive. (Message edited by stecks77 on September 05, 2006) | ||
Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 54 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 68.42.78.175 |
Fortunately, Noguchi’s work is held in much greater esteem by the art world then it is by the citizens of metro Detroit. Here’s a scan of the cover of Smithsonian Magazine from April 1978. The issue contained an article on a touring exhibition of Noguchi’s work.  Frankly, I believe it would be criminal to tamper with Noguchi’s art; the fountain or the plaza. It would be like hiring a contemporary artist to “fix” the Mona Lisa’s smile. | ||
Downtown_dave Member Username: Downtown_dave Post Number: 94 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 63.77.247.130 |
I agree, Ramcharger. I recall that Noguchi once described the fountain as a "water engine" - a fitting piece of machinery for his space - in the city where engines put us on the map. If you look at the most successful fountain designs today, like those provided by Wet Designs (Bellagio fountain in Las Vegas, and Campus Martius and Metro Airport McNamara Terminal locally) - "it's all about the water," not the fountain's architectural structure. Noguchi's minimal Dodge Fountain design with emphasis on the jets, flows and fog it produced, should be considered a precursor to these new wonders with their completely hidden infrastructure. Detroit now has a "working classic" in Hart Plaza and a wonderful next-generation kid at Campus Martius. Plus, a "grandad" will soon return near Campus Martius, as H. H. Richardson's Bagley Fountain is currently being reassembled on Cadillac Blvd. I have yet to see the "new" Dodge working, but great to know that this fountain has both a benefactor and a new lease on life. As Ramcharger said at the top of this thread "something I thought I'd never see in my lifetime." Stecks77: If you completely crumpled up the Noguchi, then turned the water back on, you'd have a Frank Gehry Fountain. ;-) | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 2754 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.105.140 |
Actually I wasn't trying to belittle Noguchi with the Frank's Nursery commment. It was just that some design ideas are inspired by some very simple sources... "art immitates life". But what has jaded my view of Dodge Fountain all these years is the fact that the fountain hasn't worked correctly since (probably) Day 1. So getting it to do what it was intended to do all along will certainly be a big plus! It'll be nice to see it do something besides shooting water straight down in a circle (see previous pic)! I'm not expecting a Las Vegas Bellagio Casino water show... but give us some of the "often hyped/lamented" computerized water show that this fountain was supposed to deliver! Actually I am hoping that the new water show will return this "dysfunctional artwork" to its' intended stature... | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 33 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
Downtown_dave: I love the Gehry idea! Conceptually of course. Also, thanks for the historical tidbits. I love Noguchi's work. Sometimes I think people forget how old it is. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6781 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 208.27.111.125 |
I know the Bagley Fountain is being restored and the Merrill Fountain is in trouble in Palmer Park, but I seem to recall there was yet another fountain in the CBD that was a more modernish work (other than the fountain at Kennedy Square). Does this ring a bell to anyone? | ||
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936 Post Number: 783 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.96.231.230 |
Hey, here's how we build 'em in Las Vegas.  | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 2757 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.90.75 |
Stecks77.... the Dodge Fountain was built in the 1970's. It's not that old! (Saying that cuz I remember its' construction!  ) | ||
Andyguard73 Member Username: Andyguard73 Post Number: 111 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 64.25.200.14 |
Speaking of the Bagley Fountain, are they installing it yet? If they are does anyone have any pics? | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1369 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.60.143.186 |
Does anyone have a picture of it doing any of these 31 different patterns. All I ever se it doing is taking a giant pis on the ground. Aren't all those circles around it water jets? Becuse if they are I imagine it could be quite impressive. | ||
Southwestmap Member Username: Southwestmap Post Number: 566 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 70.229.231.102 |
I remember walking through Hart Plaza when the Plaza was new. Trees were carefully plotted for the Jefferson Ave approaches, from the east side near mariner's Church and from the west side from the Veteran's Memorial Bldg. The boulevards they created were a pleasure to walk through. Are they still there? In the underneath areas there was a maze of staircases and offices. Japanese rain chains carried rainwater into basins. It was really very lovely - but very lost, overall, on Detroit. | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 36 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
Gistok: I should have been more specific. Compared to alot of the new fountains like those in Campus Martius and the NWA terminal, the engineering is old. | ||
1953 Member Username: 1953 Post Number: 976 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 209.104.146.146 |
Pretty much every thing designed or created in America in the 1970s is awful, in all respects. Detroit is a large, world class city. Let's have a civic centerpiece reflective of that. Something substantial and significant. This is a city built on motors and Motown - music with backbone. Let's get something big and noticable. A real signature piece for our community. The Dodge fountain may say simple, but as an image of our community, its a pimple. | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 38 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
Maybe a stack of dead cars piled in a pyramid with water pouring over them would be more appropriate? A memorial of sorts. Or maybe we can have Aretha stand in the middle of Hart Plaza and spit water during designated times of the day? | ||
Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 58 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 68.42.78.175 |
Itsjeff, There is the Edison Memorial fountain in GCP west.  The Alger Memorial fountain in GCP east.  The base of “Passo di Danza” (Step of the Dance) is actually a fountain, although at one time it had a much larger pool, as shown in this picture from the early 70’s.  Besides the fountain at Kennedy Square, there was a fountain around the base of the Spirit of Transportation statue when it was located between Cobo Hall and Cobo Arena before it was moved inside during the expansion in the late 80’s. There was a fountain in the plaza at the Blue Cross & Blue Shield building which, I believe, was recently removed due to the current remodeling. And I think the National Bank of Detroit building (Chase Tower) has/had a small “step” fountain at the NW corner of Woodward and Congress. These are about all of the outdoor fountains that I can remember in the CBD over the past 40 years. P.S. Now that I think about it, there may be a small fountain in Harmonie Park, as well. (Message edited by Ramcharger on September 06, 2006) | ||
Bvos Member Username: Bvos Post Number: 1943 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 70.228.57.79 |
All this discussion of fountains around the city has me thinking about a fountain mega-thread! There are at least a dozen fountains on the WSU campus and it seems that there are another dozen fountains downtown. There are some other magnificent fountains scattered through out the rest of the city. Each fountain would get its own thread but be combined under a Mega-Thread title, just like the Detroit Sports thread or the Election super-threads. This would prevent the questions about other fountains amidst what is a good conversation. I would commit to taking pics of many of the WSU fountains. Hopefully others would be willing to help out with WSU and other areas as well. This would be a thread destined for the HOF. What do you think Lowell? | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6786 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.136.149.133 |
Thanks for the info and pics, Ramcharger. The small fountain at Chase Tower is still there. | ||
1953 Member Username: 1953 Post Number: 981 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 65.54.155.55 |
Stecks77....exaggeration is a logical fallacy. We might imbue our cultural icons with characteristics of the community. That's not to say our community is only cars and music, but shouldn't our central artwork be more reflective of the community it represents? (Message edited by 1953 on September 06, 2006) | ||
623kraw Member Username: 623kraw Post Number: 926 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.61.65.162 |
The Noguchi aligns with the Yamasaki...  | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 43 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 129.9.163.233 |
1953: Exaggeration and logical fallacy can also be called a joke or satire, not meant to be taken seriously. Also, the car and Michael Jackson are cultural icons, not Dodge Fountain. Don't get me wrong, I'm grateful for what motown and the auto industry has done for this community and your right, there is more to this town then that. Citizens should be reminded of the great events, people, and industries that built there community. On the other hand though, why can't new civic buildings, objects, and artwork be a harbinger or representation of the communities future, its aspirations, and progress? (Message edited by stecks77 on September 07, 2006) | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 156 Registered: 01-2006 Posted From: 67.185.177.235 |
I would like to see water around the DeRoy Auditorium at WSU. From the design, I think it looks pretty neat, especially with the tables and sitting area around it. It looks terrible in it's current state. |
