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Milwaukee
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Post Number: 275
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 5:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Last night I was talking with a guy from Detroit, and he told me a pretty interesting story where he was during the riots. I don't need people to give me some wikipedia articles about the riots, I'm interested in people's stories. I'd like to hear about the city pre and post riot. I don't want to put salt in a healing wound, but I'm pretty interested in this part of Detroit history.
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Dtown1
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Post Number: 313
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 5:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is true, I heard when fires were started on the west side of town, the fire department wasnt really hyped to pyut it out becuase the city was put under a tornado watch but thunderstorms never did occur, and this is a rumor, that's how all the vacant lots we have now appeared, dont know how true the second part is though.
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Jimaz
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Post Number: 836
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 6:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had a Detroit News paper route at the time. None of us received papers to deliver that day.

My parents were returning from out of town and had no idea what had happened. An armed national guard pulled them over on the freeway then told them not to exit the freeway until they arrived home.

Beyond that I recall only a deep sense of sorrow for Detroit.
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Dtown1
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Post Number: 316
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 6:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

anyway, that is odd about the Tornado watch but no thunderstorms issue. Somewhere in metro Detroit usually sees some form of precip when under any wathc, whether its a rain shower, or severe thunderstorm. the very day Detroit needed the severe thunderstomrs, Detroit didnt get it, not that i would of jynx anything, but severe thunderstorms bring torrential rains while rainshowers only bring light, moderate, and if your lucky, heavy downpours. the fires that strted on the west side I heard spreaded through Black Bottom right into parts of SE Detroit, which my mother and grandmother lived over by Belle Isle when this happened, a lot was happening over there too in terms of the riot, not so much fires.
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Xd_brklyn
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Post Number: 202
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 7:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Basically, remember being in the backyard of a neighbor's house for a cookout, and my friend's older brother, rushing out the back door yelling "The riots are on! The riots are on!" Everyone rushed inside to the living room and stood there in front of the black and white television watching a neighborhood burn.

Then there was the curfew during my confirmation or communion party. Remember everyone talking about the curfew and getting in their cars putting an early end to the party.

Afterwards as my Dad was very familiar with area, he put the entire family in the car and we drove through the 12th street neighborhood with every building a soot-covered ruin and still smouldering. And we weren't the only ones making this trip, as I remember the streets being very congested with traffic that day.

Now my Dad, probably has the one of the most interesting stories here. He worked for Detroit Edison in the early sixties along 12th street. He says a good part of his job was shutting down the electricity in many of the buildings in the neighborhood. A lot of the job sheets he said read 'Moving to Allen Park'.

The building in the 12th Street neighborhood that he worked out of soon closed after he left Detroit Edison and the building's owner then rented it to the people who would use it for a blind pig, that same blind pig at the center of the '67 riots.

From my Dad's description of the building, it had three floors. The first floor is where Detroit Edison customers could pay their bills, exchange their old light bulbs, and make changes to their service. The basement had all sorts of training equipment for Detroit Edison workman to familiar ize themselves with the company's equipment. On the top floor held the administration offices where the managers and their assistants had their desks. Sounded like a convenient neighborhood office for Detroit Edison customers, amazing the building's fate would out turn out as it did.
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Detroitteacher
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Post Number: 742
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 9:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was only a month old so I don't have any firsthand knowledge...my dad, however, was a fireman at the time. He's told me all about it (I asked so I could relate the info to my students who were studying it). I was told my mom took me to my grandma's house on Lahser (we lived at Fenkell and Greenfield). Mom got word from someone that dad was killed during the riots. Thankfully, it wasn't him, it was someone else with our last name (never a good thing to have a brother killed in the line of duty, but I am glad it wasn't my dad). Mom had no clue for about 2 days that it wasn't dad, since he had no way of contacting us. He says that people were throwing things and shooting at the firemen (which might be why they really didn't want to go out there and put anything out). Dad says they did their best to put out what fires they could when they could get to them. People were blocking their way much of the time and they were hard pressed to get close enough to a fire to put water on it (all while watching their backs making sure no one got shot).

I have pics of dad when he did get home and the look on his face was pure exhaustion and hopelessness. I can't remember just how long he was on duty but every man was pulled in from the FD. Just shows the dedication of the guys who risk their lives each day...they pulled through even under the most grim of cirmcumstances when most folks would have hauled trow out of there.
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Hysteria
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Post Number: 1548
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wow.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 9:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's a map from the DFP's Detroit Almanac showing the extent of the rioting in 1967.

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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 3071
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 9:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker, I just got to know...

Do you work for the CIA or something? You tend to pull up maps from EVERYWHERE despite the nature of thread. And they are always relavent!

lol :-)
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Naturalsister
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Post Number: 849
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 9:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have no memories of it but this story I have.

My family was coming home from church, my aunt had me in her arms (I'm a 7 month old infant). They turned a corner near Grand River/Livernois and a brick flies through the passenger side rear window of our station-wagon. Glass was every where, my aunt and I both suffered minor cuts. I have a small scar between my left brow and hairline.

My mom freaked. My dad is trying to navigate through the chaos. We make it home after about an hour and ten minutes on a ride that may parents said usually took about 15-20 minutes. Church was at Woodrow & Tireman, home is 12th and Midland.

Our street was a mess, stuff everywhere, several homes and cars on fire. Our block itself, as I'm told was pretty dead, a releif to my family.

My aunt lived in Pontiac, but she was afraid to be driven home until two days later.

My parents (both from Ohio) talked about being a bit depressed for a while after. Then my dad's business began to boom as a result of the riots. He was a commercial sign painter. He landed many jobs, big and small. My mom says that helped her feel a whole lot better. She had 5 chidren to think about. My siblings (ages 5, 6, 9, and 14) were in Pontiac at my aunt's house so they pretty much watched on TV.

later - naturalsister
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Milwaukee
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Username: Milwaukee

Post Number: 277
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroitteacher and naturalsister, both great stories. Everyone else who gave stories, thanks so much.

The guy I was talking to grew up around Livernois and Michigan. He said that his neighborhood escaped any real trouble, but there was some real bad fighting north of his neighborhood. He had relatives down in Allen Park, so he and his family left the city as fast as they could. He made it sound really scary and amazing. He said it was very surreal. There were huge plooms of black smoke, shooting noises, and helicopters. The way he told it, made it sound very trematic. I'll never feel that, but he just made it sound so powerful and real.

I didn't tell the story very well, but I felt it was very interesting when I heard it. It's still pretty hard to imagine a small scale war in a major american city.

If anybody has any newspaper photos or old pictures, I'd love to see them.
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Wash_man
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Username: Wash_man

Post Number: 140
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quick google, I found this.
http://www.philcherner.com/Det roit%20Riot/Detroit%20Riot.htm
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 3079
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Damn thats deep...
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Milwaukee
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Username: Milwaukee

Post Number: 279
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great site Wash_man, thanks so much.

Are the riots and the reason for the urban prarie in Detroit? I don't mean in the sense that it caused the huge out-migragtion, but the reason for all the buildings being demolished. Did all those buildings come down during the riots or as part of city clean up projects?
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Wash_man
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Post Number: 141
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Milwaukee, you should read this. A great summary.
http://everything2.com/index.p l?node_id=1548224&lastnode_id= 0
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 3081
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Deep reports from some eyewitnesses about the events on Elmhurst.

http://images.google.com/imgre s?imgurl=http://detnews.com/sp ecialreports/2001/elmhurst/mon lead5/a018marythomas.jpg&imgre furl=http://detnews.com/specia lreports/2001/elmhurst/monlead 5/monlead5.htm&h=392&w=250&sz= 13&hl=en&start=51&tbnid=CRghXz 8aSmteNM:&tbnh=123&tbnw=78&pre v=/images%3Fq%3Ddetroit%2Briot %26start%3D36%26ndsp%3D18%26sv num%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26s a%3DN
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Detroit_stylin
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Post Number: 3082
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

More Stories...

http://detroit1701.org/Start19 67Riot.html
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Unclefrank
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Username: Unclefrank

Post Number: 44
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When I worked security at the DMC in the 90's, most of the guys were retired DPD. I got to hear some wild riot stories.
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Jimaz
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Post Number: 849
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Milwaukee, is it possible for your contact to contribute his story directly to this thread?

quote:

The guy I was talking to grew up around Livernois and Michigan. He said that his neighborhood escaped any real trouble, but there was some real bad fighting north of his neighborhood.


I nominate this as a potential Hall Of Fame thread.

(Message edited by Jimaz on October 24, 2006)
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 3083
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I second that and wonder why it hasnt come up sooner.
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Wash_man
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Post Number: 142
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 10:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's my memory as a seven year old in northern Macomb County: I remember watching the coverage on the news and being scared to death. I asked my parents if our house would burn down too. They assured me that it wouldn't, but I was still scared. (our house DID burn down 3 years earlier). I also remember that the men from the small town where I lived met at the town hall to prepare a strategy if "those people" came to town to riot there also. Today, I'm not sure why they felt threatened 40 miles away. I remember my dad coming home from the meetings with an oak club with a leather wrist strap. They were distributed at the meeting. My dad still has it in his gun cabinet. Luckily, it has never been used. As an adult looking back, I am somewhat embarassed that a member of my family would participate in a vigilante-type group.
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Mikeg
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Post Number: 358
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 11:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That weekend our family was staying with friends of my parents at their cottage in Lexington on Lake Huron (that weekend was the beginning of the Port Huron to Mackinac race). On Sunday afternoon as my dad drove us home on I-94 towards Detoit, we could see the black plumes of smoke on the horizon. We turned the radio on to find out that it wasn't just an accidental fire.

Over the next week or so from our house near Ten Mile and Van Dyke, we would see and hear the National Guard helicopters flying overhead, ferrying soldiers and supplies between Selfridge Field and their encampment at the State Fairgrounds. Because of the curfew, I had to delay my Detroit Free Press newspaper route delivery start time from 4 AM to 6 AM.

There is also a somewhat humorous story about Neil Shine, who at the time was an editor at the Detroit Free Press. One day during the riots, Shine "commandeered" a National Guard armored personnel carrier and persuaded the Guardsmen to drive over to the Detroit News building. As the vehicle pulled up outside the News headquarters, Shine started yelling through a loudspeaker for all the Detroit News reporters to come outside and surrender! Those were the days when the News and Free Press really fought tooth and nail for every scoop and every reader.
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Milwaukee
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Post Number: 283
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 11:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Milwaukee, is it possible for your contact to contribute his story directly to this thread?"

I know the guy pretty well, I never even thought of telling him about the site, but I think he'd like it. He's a friend of my dad's, grew up in Detroit, moved to Allen Park post riot, then came to Milwaukee for Medical school.

I hope this becomes a hall of famer. We've only heard the stories (great stories)of a few people. Come on Detroit forumers, I'm sure there are many more stories out there!
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Unclefrank
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Post Number: 48
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 11:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"am somewhat embarassed that a member of my family would participate in a vigilante-type group"

I wouldn't be. People had no idea how out of hand things were going to get. A man has a right to protect his family.
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Unclefrank
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Post Number: 49
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 11:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I still remember tanks at Eastland.
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Tndetroiter
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Post Number: 418
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Posted on Tuesday, October 24, 2006 - 11:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I worked for a man who was an Oakland County Sheriff's deputy at the time and was called in to Detroit w/ a large part of the Oakland Co. SD during the riots. He said that they had law enforcement people from all over the state come in for the riots, even people from the UP.

He told a story that involved him responding to some looting at a retail store in Highland Park. When he got there he said he saw a Highland Park Policeman putting some stuff into his patrol car. When he went up to the other officer he asked if the looters were still in the building the Highland Park guy said it was clear and then got in his car and drove off. Of course he realized that the officer had been looting, but he also realized that nothing would be done about it if he called it in and that he might catch some grief for doing so. That story shocked me when he told it. It seems human greed has no end.

My Mom worked at Henry Ford Hospital when the riots started and remembers being trapped at the hospital for a day or two when the riots started. Said she could hear lots of gunfire from the hospital. Absolutely incredible stories.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 4:51 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I still live in the Indian Village house where my wife and then two veru upimg childen lived during the 1967 Riot.

I recall not knowing why all the helicopter activity on Sunday afternoon. We found out eventually when we turned on TV that evening.

I went into work at Parke, Davis & Company on Monday morning on sparesely travled East Jefferson with no problem, but few were into work. My boss, Purchasing Vice President Don Ewing who lived in Birmingham, had to drive all the way out to East Jefferson and come in that way due to the erroneous radio news rpeorts although Woodward Avenue was open during the day.

In Indian Village we had no looting, but one house on the Southeast corner of Mack and Burns burned when it caught fire from the adjacent commercial buildings where the church parking lot is now.

On Monday night my wife and I put the boys to bed and we laid on the living room floor to listen to the gun fire just like New Year's Eve or more so. Not that we would have been in any danger with the lights on, but why take a chance?

In the Allied Suptermarket on the northwast corner of Iroqois and East Jefferson (Now the Indian Village Market) on Tuesday morning there were blacks and whites buying food, which was in somewhat short supply due to the lack of deliveries. I recall talking to several blacks in line and their saying about the rioters, "They're stupid and they're going to pay."

I believe it was on Tuesday afternoon when the first Federal Troops arrived at Governor George Romney's appeal to President Lyndon Johnson. There was much anticipation with the television newscasters building up the anticipation of their arrival. Some of the first troops were from the famed 82nd Air Borne Dviision station at Fort Bragg, North Carolina. With the TV cameras trained on the first large transport plane to land at Selfridge, the first Airborne trooper off the aircraft and carrying two ammunition boxes tripped about half-way down the long steps and tumbled tea-cup-over-apple-cart to the bottom - what a muff to a grand entry.

I have many more memories,but that's enough for now.

Bob Cosgrove
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56packman
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Post Number: 678
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:15 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was eight years old, we lived on Braille between Clarita and Pickford (bet. 6 and 7 mile). We watched TV reports, there was a curfew--no one out on the streets after dark, and I wasn't allowed to go beyond the property line of our yard without my parents or older siblings as escort. My dad reported to work every day downtown, and saw some of the burned buildings coming and going. Two memories of the riots stick in my mind:
The folks had just bought their first color TV, a Zenith console model, and it was expensive, about $700 then (about equal in todays $$$ to a good sized plasma screen) If things got bad, and trouble moved to our area (which never happened) the folks had a plan to pack all of us kids, our clothes AND the new TV into our Chevy station wagon and move in with my Aunt and Uncle in Union Lake (BFE back then)
My second memory is that the COD suspended all liquor sales after the Molotov cocktails started flying. My Dad was pretty busy working and had a small stash of Strohs, but that was gone before the booze-ban was lifted. He was working in the yard and really jones-ing for a beer. He was talking to the neighboor two doors down (each man standing in his own yard--the yards weren't that far apart). Al, our neighboor offered up that he "went on the wagon as of new years day" and that he had a case of beer in his garage that my dad could have. My Dad ran over there and came back with a case of PBR, > six months old. I can remember him popping the top off of one (had to in the house and get a church key) and drinking that piss-warm PBR and loving every minute of it.
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Walkerpub
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Post Number: 104
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 8:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From the forthcoming book, The Best of the Times Magazine, 2006 edition:

http://www.walkervilletimes.co m/26/panic-in-detroit.html
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Everydayislikesunday
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 9:02 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

At the time, my grandmother worked in the ER at Henry Ford. I remember hearing the stories of how they had to work in the dark, because there were snipers on the parking structure that could see into the front part of the ER. Also, once or twice, she was picked up by a tank from her home in Highland Park, and driven to work.
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Audioswhite
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 9:04 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was just shy of 2, so no actual memories. However I have heard the stories so many times, seems like memories. We lived on the lower east side (Jefferson/Chalmers). My family, Mom, Dad and 6 older brothers and sisters were returning from a camping/vacation trip to expo 67 in Montreal.
I was baby sat by my maternal Grandparents who lived on Seyburn and Lafeyette. Coming home through the tunnel on Sunday Evening, the folks were denied entry. "But My Baby..." was the cry, according to legend, heard from Peche Island to Kelly's Island. Needless to say, my mother insisted they be let in.
They scooped me up and headed home. Our nieghbor was ready, he had set up fire stations with garden hoses, planned escape routes for both families the whole bit.

We stayed in our house through the mid 80's. A pervailing sadness regarding the riots lingered through out my childhood. My true memories start in 68, of course a much brighter story. By the early 70's, for me Cash. Lolich, Kaline. Northrup, and Horton were super heroes, stuff of legend, having saved the city.

(edited, original message mentioned bridge, older sibling just informed me it was the tunnel)

(Message edited by audioswhite on October 25, 2006)
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Fortress_warren
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 9:56 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I remember standing on the front lawn watching about 30 Hueys flying from Selfridge to the Tank Arsenal. You could hear the tanks warming up and then haul ass down Van Dyke to the east side to protect the Pointes. Natural Guard was on the west side.

I also remember the gas stations under curfew, same thing happened in April 68 during the MLK shooting riot. Otherwise, just watched what was on the tube.

Strange how we had just come back from Expo 67 as well.
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Goat
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 9:58 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What is even sadder is the fact that some areas of Detroit still look like the riots have just happened. Look at the pics in the link Wash_man provided and compare those pictures with today.
That is some real sad irony there...what did the riots really acheive? The police are still corrupt and pervasive (not to mention unprofessional).

My parents used to sit on the waterfront in Windsor and watch Detroit burn. They couldn't believe that some of their friends across the border could do such a thing.
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Ptero
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:17 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was 14 at the time. We lived on Ardmore near Fenkell, between Hubbell and Schaefer. My brother, 18, was an orderly at one of the WSU hospitals off of Woodward. He usually rode his bicycle down 12th to get there and was there when all of this started. They would not let him leave, between needing everyone possible to be working and the route he would have to take to get home. At least we knew he was safe. He had stories of watching looting from a United Shirt as well as other places along Woodward from the upper windows of the hospital. No cops, no one, challenging the looters. Eventually Dad went and collected him in the car.

Our Neighborhood was not directly impacted with fires and such. Smart or not I never felt personally at risk. We all stayed close to home and respected the curfews of course. Dad was concerned about it drifting our way but it never did. Our church was not far from Grand River a bit west from where we lived. We did a number of spaghetti dinners for the Guard. I remember them showing up in tanks, armored personnel carriers and jeeps. With weapons and in full battle gear. Pretty impressive for a jr high schooler.

We also collected clothing and canned goods to help out. The first Tuesday we took a church-bus load (PACKED FULL to the brim) to a distribution center in a storefront on Grand River in the middle of the action. The minister drove and the Guard escorted us allowing two of us 'kids' to ride along to help with the unloading.

They said we could go but we had to lay on the floor due to the snipers along GR! We passed the John F Ivory Moving and Storage building (around about where Joy crosses GR??). It had a tall sort of tower that did not have many windows. It was sitting there burning and smoldering with no fire equipment to be seen. Smoke was billowing out of the few upper floor windows.

We did a second bus trip the following Tuesday (10 days after it all began) and the Ivory building was STILL burning!

When things were settling down we drove around as many did the area to rubberneck and see what was left. We knew what had happened but were still pretty stunned to actually see the empty city blocks that were formerly full of houses. Just some chimneys standing tall here and there. It does seem like this was a major step in the development of the urban prarie. Grand River took a huge beating in terms of lost businesses burned out never to return. The Lodge was fairly new and we were familiar with cruising GR to get to Olympia and downtown. We could see the massive changes wrought in '67.


ptero... going to Sam's Drugs looking for new comic books....




(Message edited by ptero on October 25, 2006)
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Wash_man
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Post Number: 144
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:24 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

As terrible as all these stories are, compare these few days of unrest to what is happening in Iraq, Lebanon, etc. Those people have been living in similar circumstances for years. It's hard to believe they've survived this long. Just think what it would be like to live like that. By similar, I mean the presence of military personnel in the street, snipers, fires. Luckily, I've never heard reports of bombings in '67.
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Goat
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Post Number: 8927
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:38 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quit suicide bombing Israel and focus on their own homeland and they wouldn't HAVE to live like that.
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Peachlaser
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Post Number: 38
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:24 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker - Nice find with the map. Now, I realize that if our family had stayed in Detroit that we would of been within blocks or right in the middle of the worst sniper sites. This goes back to an earlier time. Back in 1952, my older brother walked into a store at the corner of Lincoln and Trumbull when he was 14 or so. A couple of young toughs in a new gang in the area walked up to him and cold cocked him up side the head for no reason. That was when my Father decided that it was time to get the family out of Detroit. That was in 1952, so by the time 1967 rolled around I imagine the area was really simmering.
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Jan
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:34 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My father was also a firefighter during the riots. He was on vacation, but everybody was called to active duty. I was 12, out in the suburbs spending a few days with my grandparents. My father called my grandparents and had them come into the city to pick up my mother and siblings and take them to the burbs. I then remember my mother and grandmother watching tv non-stop and waiting to calls from my father. We didn't see him for a week. One of our mementos from this time is a picture of my father and other firefighters pinned underneath a rig to avoid sniper fire.
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Dalangdon
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 12:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How was the downtown core affected during the riots? The department stores and big hotels? I don't mean the long-term impact, but during the actual riot.

I have a friend whos mother worked at the Conrad Hilton in Chicago, and she has stories about standing in an upstairs window and watching them fight it out in the street during the Democratic convention. They wouldn't let her leave for several days - she had to camp out in her office.
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Spacemonkey
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 12:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was too young to remember the riots, but my grandfather lived in Detroit and worked in a machine shop in Detroit at the time and here's the story he told me:

Grandad had spent that weekend up at Higgins Lake working on his cottage. The cottage didn't have electricity--no radio. no TV--so he had no idea what had happened back home.

In fact, he was still clueless while driving to work Monday morning as he saw barricades and burned out buildings and broken store front windows.

He says he was at a loss until he got to work. That's when he noticed that all the black guys had new shoes; that's when he realized what had happened.

Yes, that is a bit racist of a way to tell the story. But that's what grandpa said.
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Lowell
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 12:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I lived in an apartment at 70 W. Warren [Barnes and Noble today] that summer and rode the DSR bus out Warren to the Rouge where I worked on the Dearborn Engine assembly line.

On the first [Sunday] morning, some friends picked me up to visit their place in Southfield. On the return trip down the Lodge, we noticed numerous columns of smoke and learned of some “disturbances” but thought little of it.

My friend’s friend worked at muffler shop on Livernois, so she wanted check on her. We exited at Livernois and immediately at the top of the ramp, saw looters, white and black, joyously running across the streets, arms laden with loot. My friends continued to the down ramp and returned me home.

By Sunday night the rebellion was in full force. Increasing background gunfire could be heard, but nothing like what was to follow. Noticeable were the police cars returning to the 13th precinct station a block away. Their windows were shattered and fenders dented and from the start it was apparent that this was not a race riot but an anti-authority, particularly anti-police, uprising.

The following day I rode the Warren bus to work and noticed considerable devastation along the way, the “Soul Brother” signs on Afro-Am owned business, and surly armed merchants by others. Yet there was still an air of disbelief or denial, as if it would go away. That had changed by the time my overtime shift ended. When the bus got to around Grand Blvd. the bus driver had us get out saying curfew was on that was the end of the route!

So there I was, background gunfire increasing, the smell of smoke everywhere, sun setting on a sultry summer night and two miles from home. Luckily I flagged a cab on his way in and he got me back. You can be sure he got a good tip.

The National Guard had arrived in the meantime and that night machinegun fire was added to the growing crescendo of non-stop sirens and gunfire. If any of you have heard the New Year’s gunfire in Detroit at its peak, just add the sound of countless machine guns and imagine it not stopping all day and night and you get the picture. It was like some giant popcorn popper, popping at its peak but never stopping, accentuated by deep booms and the throaty ‘whump, whump, whump’ of 50 caliber machine guns.

Click here for part two of my personal account.
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Detroitstar
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 12:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

These stories are just incredible. I'm trying to put myself in that position at the time, trying to think about what my thoughts would be. I cant do it.


Are there any news videos from the time? I've seen a few after the fact videos, but were any news people bold enough to venture into the war zone?
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Zimm
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 1:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Finally, after 5 years of lurking, an excuse to post!


My dad has told me once or twice about his experiences during the ’67 riots. I never really understood them until I moved to this part of the state. All of your stories, plus Hornwrecker’s great map are helping me piece them together.

My dad was at the time a college student at Ferris State, probably in his sophomore year. He spent his summers back at my grandparent’s home in Harper Woods, where the family had moved in the mid 50’s after living near my great grandparents place on the Detroit side of Alter Rd, on the 1st block West of Jefferson.

In the summer of ’67, he was working in a factory on or near 8 mile, on the West side (probably a tire factory, but not the Uniroyal plant on Jefferson, where he had worked a previous summer.) I get the impression that for the first day or so of the riot (before the Army and National Guard were brought in) that he had gone about life very much as normal, as the rioting had not spread anywhere near Harper Woods. I think he had left for work when the fighting was just an incident confined to the central part of the city.

Where the danger became very real for him was when, after working a double shift that let him out in middle of the night (I’m guessing he worked a double because workers had failed to show up for the next shift,) he and a friend were forced to stop by a jeep full of Guardsmen with guns drawn, questioning why they were violating curfew and what business they had driving 8 mile.

He too remembers several of his black co-workers wearing new shoes in the days following the riots.

That was the last summer my dad and mom spent in Detroit. Later that summer, they would marry and live in Big Rapids full time until my dad graduated. I think the riots finalized a conclusion that they were already well on the way to arriving at-that they preferred the kind of lives that they could live on the West side of the state.
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Dabirch
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 1:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

that they preferred the kind of lives that they could live on the West side of the state.




You mean the kind without black people?
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Zimm
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

------------------------------ ------------------------------ --------------------
quote:
You mean the kind without black people?


------------------------------ ------------------------------ --------------------

nah. the kind where a couple could live a long ways away from their very old-school parents.

the neighborhood I lved in for the first 2 years of my life (and my parent's first 7 years in Grand Rapids) was ethnically mixed (mostly black and white-although a couple they still keep in contact with from those days are some sort of SE Asian ethnicity that I am unsure of). It wasn't a black/white issue-it was a personal thing.
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Karl
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dabirch said, "You mean the kind without black people?"

No - the kind where everyone, regardless of color, appeared to have common wants & needs:

1. Safe streets

2. Decent education

Folks who wanted what they saw in Detroit stayed and allowed Coleman Young to lead them. Folks who wanted what they saw elsewhere left. It's called freedom - and everyone had freedom.
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Detroitnerd
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Being poor means not having the same choices as other people.
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Jt1
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Why did it start with CAY in your mind Karl.

Can you explain the 330,000 that left prior to CAY. Can you explain the fact that 700,000 white people left the city prior to CAY. Can you explain the 180,000 people that left from 1950-1959 (bear in mind there was a gain until 1952 so the loss was actually greater)

Why arbitrarily start it at CAY or 1967 when people were fleeing long before that and in numbers in the hundreds of thousands.

Oh wait, CAY was the devil and everything was perfect until he came along. Don't let the real facts get in the way of the entire story when you can lump it on one incident or one person.
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Careful Jt1....

You know Karl will find away to turn those figures you just put out there into a tirade about abrotion becuase he doesn't have/ can't deny the facts when confronted with them.
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Jimaz
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.67riots.rutgers.edu /
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wait hold up. Let me not be a party to this.

This is actually a good thread and I think that it should be a HOF thread. So people if we could FOCUS on the topic at hand and not bring our individual ideologies, thoughts or beliefs into it and focus ont he stories at hand, then I and i am pretty sure quite a few other people would really appreciate it...
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Karl
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Stylin is right. This thread should remain one of memories from that tragic period of time, not what happened before or after.
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Spacemonkey
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 2:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm glad that Zimm's dad confirmed my grandad's 'new shoes' claim. I thought perhaps grandpop was tellin' tall tales.
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Milwaukee
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 3:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Stylin, I want this thread to stay on track. Again, thanks for all the great stories you guys. My mom has a friend who grew up in Detroit, her dad was in the army. I'm going to try and call her up and see what she has to say. If I hear anything good, I'll post it.
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

July 24, 1967



(Message edited by cozmikdebris on October 25, 2006)
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

July 25, 1967



(Message edited by cozmikdebris on October 25, 2006)
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

July 26, 1967

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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

One thing that's interesting is the first day of the riot - Sunday - the crowds of looters as seen on TV were mixed blacks and whites - it was not in that sense a race riot, but rather it just was lawlessness.

The Detroit Police Department was very arrogant at that time, patrol cars often didn't stop at traffic lights even if they were not on a run. So what happened with the Police Department on 12th Street was defintely anit-black and that continued witness The Algriers Motel incident.

It became more of black-white issue in part due to the lack of fire discipline on the part of the Michigan National Guard,who were on the Westside. The Federal troops, primarily from the 82nd and 101st Airborne Divisions (Ft. Bragg, N.C. and Ft. Campbell, Ky.) were on the Eastside.

Most of the deaths occured on the Westside (I believe some 40) where the Michigan National Guard troops were. I believe there were less than 10 deaths on the Eastside.

At that time the Michigan National Guard officers were poorly trained, as I witnessed serving with some of them at Historic Fort Wayne. That's not to be taken as a criticism of today's Guard, nor of all the Guard officers and men at that time.

But, you have to remember that we had Unvisersal Military Training at that time - almost all males had to serve. The National Guard had programs with 6 months active duty and the balance of service at home. So the Guard was an atrractive alternative to having to serve two full years if drafted.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jimaz
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1 2th_Street_Riot has a list of fatalities with causes of death.
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

July 27, 1967

Riot day 4
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

July 28, 1967

Riot day 5
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

July 31, 1967

Riot aftermath
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Mayor_sekou
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For those of you who were there during the riots whay were houses being burned that is something I could never understand? Did the fires just spread or were certain houses targeted?
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 6:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mob mentality is someting else Mayor
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 7:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mayor_sekou asked if houses were set on fire or burned because the fire spread.

For the most part it was the grocery stores, liquor stores, and others that were intentioanlly burned and these set neighboring houses on fire. Certainly a vacant house, just like today, was a fire-bug target.

The black-owned businesses painted "Soul Brother" on them to avoid being burned, yet some of them were still torched.

Bob Cosgrove
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 7:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ok ok, I misunderstood the question in general...
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Dalangdon
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 7:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mob mentalities are indeed scary. The stuff we saw here in Seattle during the WTO was pretty raw.

My Grandfather was coming home on the streetcar in Omaha one night when the car got stopped by a mob who were on their way to the courthouse to lynch a black man. Grandfather ended up getting his head cut open in the melee. The mob ended up lynching both the black man AND the mayor of Omaha (although he survived) and they set fire to the courthouse. I've seen pictures of it - it was terrible.
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Livedog2
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 7:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

The mob ended up lynching both the black man AND the mayor of Omaha (although he survived) and they set fire to the courthouse.




After laughing my ass off after reading that here are my thoughts. I would have loved to have seen the look on that mayor's face. As a matter of fact I think that's a good way to keep mayors in line. I suggest a little of that for Kwame!

Livedog2
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Barnesfoto
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 8:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was all of five years old, what little I remember is a phone call that my mom recieved from my aunt, who was at Mt. Carmel Hospital with my Grandfather, and my mom hanging up the phone saying "Aunt Bonnie says there's rioting going on towards downtown".
Later my Aunt called to say that my Grandfather had died.
The Northwest side at that time was a world away from the rioting, but I'm shocked to see maps showing that looting branched out Grand River close to us.
I'm told that I ran up to Grand River with other kids from my block to watch the tanks rolling towards downtown, but oddly, I have no memory of this.
My Grandfather's funeral was at the Sullivan Funeral Home on McNichols, and the burial was at Grand Lawn Cemetery, where columns of smoke rose in the east.
What I remember more is the mentality after the riots. All my Aunts and Uncles moved out of the Grand River-Greenfield area to the suburbs within a year.
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Jimaz
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 8:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm sorry but I can't understand how anyone could find anything amusing about a lynching. :-(
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Wilderness
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 9:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was sixteen years old in 1967 having lived in Lincoln Park since 1954, however and as previously explained, still had family in the city.
My parents allowed to ride the buses from when I was very young to visit relatives (something most youngsters from "the burbs" didn't experience).

The exodus (as previously explained by jt1; many thanks) began long before 1967 by people to other areas.
There were gangs in the city (around the Clark & I-75 in the 40's and 50's of different ethnic groups).

The police presence both City and county that existed in the periods leading up to 1967 is difficult to concieve today. Most were white officers.
The "big four" was notroious for intimidation.

There was a book written of the police dominance (not sure if it's still available) the "Algeirs Motel Incident".
I had not read the book until late 1969 or 70. For the first half of 1969, I went to a trade school and one of the suspended officers was a student as well. It didn't take long to find out that he wasn't a nice a person.
When the trials finally came and he was in attendance, my feelings were that he was getting everything he deserved and even that was not enough. (God forgive me.)

For many years I worked in and out of the city. For some years I worked in the streets at odd hours.

People in "the burbs" really have no clue as to what is part of everyday life in the city.
The youngsters that I grew up with in Lincoln Park were intimidated with the thought of the city.
I was (and remain) fortuante to have good memories of special places and special people to reflect upon.
There's good and bad in most issues and that's part of life. At times it may be damned hard to accept.

BTW, I also recall the MLK curfew in 68 because a bunch of use drove to Ohio to get our beer.
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Milwaukee
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 9:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'd suggest to all who are into this thread to check out Gsgeorge's thread. Has some great information about the riot.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Joahhnes Spreen who Mayor Jerome Cavanaugh brought in as Police Commissioner immediately after the 1967 Riot and who later the long-time Sheriff of Oakland County wrote a book last year whose title is "Detroit:Death of a City" if my memory serves me right.

It's a very good analysis of what caused the 1967 Riot.

Another book on the Riot of University of Michigan History Professr the late Sidney Fine is a good work, but since he lived in Ann Arbor it suffers in some its detail, but not measurably so.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jimaz
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I can't find my copy of "A People's History of The United States," by Howard Zinn but it may have contained a good account of the riots. Either that or "Common Ground."
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)










WSU/VMC
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Milwaukee
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker, great shots. Thanks so much! :-)

Jimaz, just looked it up. He didn't really go into detail about the Detroit riot. He mentions Detroit and Newark as the most violent, but not much more than that.
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Neilr
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

After the 1967 Riot, Bessie Williams Ernst, wife of Dr. Reginald Ernst, wrote and privately published a collection of poems she had written as she had tried to come to terms with what had happened that summer in Detroit. All the poems were based on actual experiences of her own or of her friends or written about in the media. Her book is entitled,
Soulful Reflections on the Detroit Riot, 1967

To me, she has best encapsuled the feelings and emotion of the riot. I have copied the following poems from her book.

The Telephone Conversation

Honey, have you heard the news
Them colored folks is running wild
Girl, they done toe up Twelfth Street
Now they goin' ou seben mile.
Child, Honey, I don't know what's wrong wif our folks dese days.
Guess dey must be
tired of dese white folks uppity ways.

Naw, I got my chillun locked up here wif me.
I don't wear no stolen clothes and
NEITHER SHALL DESE THREE!


All Negroes Blamed

Tears in his eyes, the youngster turned from a situation he didn't understand.
He came to buy food for his dog, but, the grocer had a gun in his hand.
To the grocer all Negroes are alike: undisciplined, ignorant, and to be feared.
But the boy standing there with his heart in his mouth was three generations reared.
This wasn't in an area that had felt the destruction of all this strife.
But that child being a Negro now had guessed, he would be prejudged all his life.


Cash Sales

Suits, watches, fur coats and rings,
You name it, I got all those things.
Discount prices you can afford to pay,
'Course you can't put it in the lay-a-way.


Ashes to Ashes

Ashes to Ashes
So goes the song.
Twelfth Street's time
Just came along.


A Child's View

Dear God,
Please let the riot stop so I can stay outside
Until the street lights go on.
Amen.


A Lone Sentinel

At eight thirty, every night
A lone plane makes its round
Slowly circling our neighborhood,
Making a now familiar sound.
I feel safe knowing it's there, Watching over me
Ready to report any evidence of trouble
That its pilot might see.
When the troops didn't come, And fear gripped our city
When it seemed that even
Our Lord had no pity,
That one lone plane circled the sky
And seemed to say to me,
"Take hold of yourself,
Things are not what they seemed to be.
Courage, have courage
I'm watching up here
Just try to bring comfort
To those you hold dear."
I'll never see that pilot,
Nor will I know his name,
But in my prayers nightly,
I'll thank him just the same.
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Lowell
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1967 continued....

By Tuesday all the corners around Warren and Woodward were occupied by National Guardsmen. They were a comical lot, slovenly dressed, guns at all angles, shirt tails sticking out, helmets hanging sloppily on their heads, some overweight and all looking like deer in the headlights. I remember talking to one, some skinny kid from way up north who had never been to the D and nervous as a Chihuahua.

Items like milk and other high turnover items ran out and gasoline could only be sold in limited amounts and not in containers.

We learned that during the previous night the NG and police had abandoned a 200 block area of the west side bounded roughly by the Lodge, Grand Blvd., Livernois and Davison. The city had fully exploded and Johnson had announced that troops from the Viet Nam hardened 82nd & 101st Airborne division had been ordered into the city.

Hornwrecker’s map does not show it all; a line should extend way out Warren and other avenues. Also there needs to be a sniper spark behind the DIA. I could hear him clearly from my apartment. Blam! Then five minutes of gun fire with at least four machine guns finally fading away, a pause, then Blam!, and another five minutes of the same as [we learned later] the NG freaked out and fired wildly in all directions. This went on for about three hours.

During that time my brother called me from Illinois wondering if it was as bad as it looked on TV. Just as he asked a flurry of machine guns opened up. So I just held the phone handset by the window and let him have his answer.

Meanwhile at the 13th Precinct, the battered police cars now only left in convoys of five or more cars, all with non-driver windows open and long guns protruding. This would continue for many weeks following the riot. Once often cocky faces were dour, tired and worried.

Life on the street was not what one might suspect. As happens in times of disaster [I saw this after the tornado that swept through Highland Park too] people pulled together, helped each other out, shared meals and looked in on the old folk. People of all races and differences were drawn together, not apart. There was no anger, nor was there an aura of fear. Instead there was an air of mild excitement, almost a sense of being in the midst of great history and change.

When the Federal Airborne troops arrived, the contrast with the NG was striking. Their arrival was almost like a flowers and kisses welcoming. I joined a friend of mine to visit a friend of his in the 101st. They had bivouacked on a school playground on the eastside. Not only was the force made up of about 30% minorities, it was all spit and polish disciplined pros right down to their shiny combat boots.

Wherever they took over, the riot ended almost immediately. People trusted them and felt [and rightly so] they would not carelessly open fire without order or reason and clear targets.

Unfortunately there were not enough of them for the Westside where the police and poorly disciplined NG’s were again driven out of the 200 block zone. The riot peaked that night and the full glare of the national and international media spotlight fell totally on Detroit – and stays with us to this day in many ways.

The smell of smoke was omnipresent making those hot hazy days even hazier. Like a massive snow storm everything came to a halt during that midweek but gradually and steadily it abated. By the weekend, it was over.

I went to work every day. When I look back I had to be nuts, but I needed the money. My afternoon shift kept being called off after four hours because of the 9 PM curfew and every day it was nip and tuck to make it home by bus. Sometimes I ended up walking several blocks or taking circuitous bus routes.

The devastation along my Warren bus route grew daily and was immense. The ashes of a huge furniture store lay smoldering on the SW corner of Grand River and Warren, a vacant lot to this day and only a short distance from the Fire Department Training station. Countless storefronts lay shattered and the remains of their contents littered the sidewalks while military patrols whisked by. Every liquor store along the way was looted and destroyed. The city was under military occupation.

But then life went on. The Tigers were in a pennant race, Motown was cranking out the hits and I was back to slamming pistons into hot selling Ford 390 cubic inch engines. And 1967’s shock wave still rolls on.
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Lowell
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What timing! Hornwrecker's picture no.3, posted while I was writing my post, shows the Warren and Grand River intersection. The aforementioned smoldering furniture store ruins can be seen in the upper left corner of the intersection.
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Miketoronto
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

To be honest, I can not believe how little information there is on the net about the riots in Detroit and other American cities.

The Riots are probably the most important issue that caused the decline of the American inner city.

Suburbs did not kill the inner city. It was flight after riots. Yet talk of riots is hardly anywhere.
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Mayor_sekou
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 10:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My old high school Murray Wright is in the area near that same photo Its amazing that the area looked so different then. There were actually buildings!!! on 14th, Warren, and Grand River.
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Chitaku
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

have you seen your old school?
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Mayor_sekou
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Not in like 3 years, have you? Does the area look any better/worse?
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Dan
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great thread.

Does anyone know if there is a good documentary on the riot/uprising?
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I imagine a few TV stations are going through their archives to do a 40th anniversary documentary next year, if not they should be.

I've been saving up maps and photos for an eventual thread that would show some legs, that's why I have things in a timely manner.

More pics coming. The aerials are really overexposed due to all the smoke in the air, each one has to be tweaked so some detail will show up.
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Chitaku
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Murray Wright has been gutted it is a hollow building, eerie as hell. Supposedly it is going to be converted into lofts. I think they might be a hard sell though. Unless they are cheap.
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Mayor_sekou
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

HUHHHHH??????????? My school is GONE!!!! WTF.
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Lowell
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I saved the following from a previous thread which I cannot find. I think, could be wrong, that MikeM provided it.

Pre-Riot events:

Riots in other US cities, starting in Harlem spreading westward, '64-'67
Kercheval incident, August 9-10, 1966
prostitution problem on 12th
prostitute beatings by police on 12th Ave, April '67
prostitute murder, possibly by vice-officer, July 1

Sunday, July 23

blind pig raid, 3:45 AM
disturbance calls start, ~5:00 AM
mayor notified, 7:00 AM
state police notified, 7:00 AM
sheriff notified, 7:07 AM
National Guard Commander notified, 7:10 AM (MI guard at Camp Grayling)
Belle Isle bridge closed, Rouge Park patrols started, mid-morning
black community leaders enter area in failed attempt to calm situation, 11:00 AM
360 state troopers arrive at Artillery Armory, 3:05 PM
first reports of activity outside neighborhood of blind pig, 4:00 PM
first arson, GR @ Warren, 4:00 PM
first guardsmen arrive at Central HS, 5:25 PM
rapid spread of incidents outside of initial 12th & Linwood area, 5PM-6PM:
looting on GR, 5:05 PM
looting at 7 & Livernois, 5:27 PM
looters in Oakland-Westminster-Owen area, 5:31PM
looters at John R & Canfield, 5:44 PM
looters on Washington Blvd, downtown, 6:01 PM
Romney authorizes guard activation, 6:15 PM
first guardsmen on streets, 6:57 PM
Cavanagh issues 9:00 PM - 5:30 AM curfew, 7:45 PM
first confirmed sniper, 1600 block Seward, 9:07 PM
police order closing all theaters, liquor stores, bars, ~9:30 PM
all gas stations closed by order of Fire Chief, 10:25 PM
rapid and widespread reports of looting and arson, 11PM - midnight (average 3 reports/minute in area covering 11 of 13 precincts)
Romney declares Detroit, Hamtramck, & HP in state of emergency, 11:59 PM


Monday, July 24

Fire Chief calls for help from suburbs, after midnight (suburbs supply 90 trucks)
first fatality, 45 y.o. white male, shot by store owner, 12:25 AM
entire block of Dexter & Davidson on fire, 1:33 AM (black citizens pour into streets to protect fireman)
2nd fatality, 23 y.o. white female killed by sniper, 1:35 AM
3rd fatality, 23 y.o. white male shot by guardsman, 4:00 AM
Cavanagh & Romney request 5,000 federal troops, 3:00 AM
Cyrus Vance arrives at Selfridge, 1:20 PM
82nd and 101st Airborne arrives Selfridge, deploys to State Fairgrounds, afternoon
officials tour riot areas, afternoon
first guardsman shot, 9:04 PM
first reports of snipers attacking police & fire stations, eastside, 9:00 PM - 1:00 AM (2 police precincts, 2 command posts, 5 fire stations under fire)
Washington agrees to send troops, 11:20 PM
LBJ appears on TV announcing decision, midnight

Tuesday, July 25

first fireman killed, shot by sniper, Mack & St Jean, 12:09 AM
82nd Airborne troops appear on streets, 1:10 AM (remain east of Woodward at all times)
49 reports of sniper fire, midnight 1:00 AM - 3:00 AM
Cavanagh requests businesses to resume operations, 8:00 AM
Cavanagh allows sales of gasoline allowed, noon - 5 PM, limit 5 gals only into vehicles, 10:00 AM
first prisoners transported to Jackson, 9:00 AM
additional prisoners transported to Ingham Co jail and Milan Federal, afternoon
more sniper attacks, > 9:00 PM

Wednesday, July 26

7 killed, midnight - 3:00 AM
Algiers Motel Incident, 3 killed, early morning
first guardsman killed, 2:20 AM
rash of snipers attacking more police and fire stations, 3:00 - 4:30 PM
sporadic snipers during hours of darkness

Thursday, July 27

white arsonist shot, early morning
federal troops withdraw to command posts, morning
state police withdraw from city, morning
curfew briefly lifted, re-imposed by 7:15 PM
police engage in gun battle with carload of Kentucky whites, 9:05 PM
numerous reports of cars with out-of-state plates wanted for looting & arson, all day

Friday, July 28

more reports of out-of-state cars wanted for illegal activities, all day
Romney announces state of emergency will continue through weekend
troop withdrawal continues
7,000 prisoners detained at 20 facilities in 6 counties

Saturday, July 29

1,400 prisoners detained for curfew violations released, 6:00 AM
82nd Airborne withdraws from Southeastern High to Chandler Park
post-arraignment detainees moved from busses at Recorder's Court to women's bathhouse at Belle Isle

Sunday, July 30

sporadic calls for gunfire and selling of looted goods
Army troops withdraw totally

Monday, July 31

police return to normal 8-hour shifts
43 killed, 700 wounded, $50,000,000 damage, 7800 arrested

Tuesday, August 1

curfew lifted

Thursday, August 3

security perimeter around police HQ, jail, and courts removed

Saturday-Sunday, August 5,6

National Guard de-mobilized
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Mayor_sekou
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Not trying to threadjack or anything but why??
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Chitaku
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Posted on Wednesday, October 25, 2006 - 11:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm sorry Mayor
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Kathleen
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 5:55 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was 10 years old that summer, living in the E. Warren-Outer Drive area.

What I remember most is at night when we could see the orange glow of fires west of us and hear random gunshots. Some of the East Side neighborhood of our parents' youth was being burned by looters. We knew the neighborhood well enough from all the Sunday drives through the streets of their youth so us kids could visualize what was happening where.

On Tuesday, July 25th, my younger brother's 6th birthday, Grandfather came over for dinner and afterwards we drove to Corrigan Park across the street from Engine 52(?) at E. Warren and Manistique (near Alter Rd.) to see the nearest staging area for National Guard tanks and fire trucks called in from the suburbs. Many police officers, firefighters, and soldiers were there...in full gear for whatever awaited them. Helicopters buzzed the sky around us. It was an awesome sight to a 10-year-old!

Every night that the riots wore on was a disappointment for us older kids as the curfew imposed on us cancelled our nightly bike ride with our mom (who worked during the day). It was a summer evening ritual that we enjoyed and remember fondly.

At some point after the riots were over, we resumed our Sunday drives and, of course, did see the devastation on the East Side, mostly along Kercheval.
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Fortress_warren
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 7:52 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"hot selling Ford 389 cubic inch engines".

Pontiac had 389's, Ford had 390's, get it right. How many rings did you break a shift? Just curious.
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Barnesfoto
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 7:59 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

relax, M_S, only the older wing of Murray-Wright is empty (It was actually the School of the Performing Arts in its last incarnation). The M-W building on Warren is still up and running.
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 8:47 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Can anyone identify this area during that time?

E:




(Message edited by Detroit_stylin on October 26, 2006)
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 9:01 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Or this one here where the Machine gun emplacement is?

E:
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Lowell
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 10:23 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You're right on both counts Fortress, they were 390's and I broke a lot of rings. We also built 427's. Since the quality control was so poor in those crank'em out days, the biggest question on the line always was, "How do ever get those things to start up at hot test at the end of the line?"

Tanks. When I hear that term, I think those big machines with metal treads a big cannon on a turret. I never saw any of those or any pictures. Were there really any?

I did see a number of smaller armored vehicles but all had rubber tires and had nothing larger than 50 Caliber machine guns, which are big enough to chop a house down. More typical were jeeps, like in the picure above, with lighter machine guns.
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Rustic
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 10:53 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

in '67/68 for ford the hot selling v8 was the small block 289 not the (probably typoed) '389'. The big block v-8 in 67/68 might have been their new 385, but that was no where near as common is the 289. Ford made HUGE $$ off of that 289 engine. With modifications, they were still cranking 'em out well into the 1990s and maybe still to this day, tho I think they stopped making them in the 2000MY (~a 40 year run!).
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Rustic
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 10:57 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

oops I stand corrected about the "390"
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Frank_c
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 10:58 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah there were tanks, they came from the National Gaurd Armory on Schoolcraft out in Livonia. I remember watching them streaming down the pavement, going the wrong way(north side of the street)ripping up the pavement.
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Dday
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 10:59 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't think it was the 101st Airborne. It was the 82d Airborne (1-505 PIR). The unit I would serve in at a later date. I am certain that the deployment to Detroit was listed in the battalion's unit history which was required knowledge for all in the unit. The 505 was coming off a tour in Vietnam if I remember correctly
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Thnk2mch
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 11:14 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From the Michigan National Guard website:

Detroit, 1967

Widespread protest rioting broke out following the Detroit Police raid on a "blind pig" in the early morning hours of July 23, 1967. The protests became so violent that neither the Detroit or Michigan State Police could contain them. Mayor Jerome Cavanaugh appealed to the Governor. Governor Romney called out the Guard on July 24th by ordering the 2nd Brigade, 46th Infantry Division to state actual duty. The other two brigades of the 46th were at Camp Grayling conducting annual training. Their training was cancelled and the troops quickly moved to Detroit.



The situation worsened and by July 26th, twelve square miles of Detroit were burning. Mayor Cavanaugh and Governor Romney consulted with U.S. Vice President Hubert H. Humphrey; they decided to commit more troops to Detroit. At the same time, the Michigan National Guard was federalized and placed under command of the U.S. Army's XVIII Airborne Corps from Fort Bragg, N.C.



One brigade each from the 82nd and 101st Airborne Divisions were flown to Selfridge Air National Guard Base and joined Task Force Detroit under the command of Lt. Gen. John Throckmorton. The task force cracked down on the rioters. By July 29th, the situation was calm enough to pull regular army troops out and leave the city in the hands of the federalized Michigan National Guard. The Guard returned to state control and demobilized on August 2nd.



During the Detroit rioting, 42 fatalities occurred, including one Guardsman--Corp. Larry L. Post of the 182nd Field Artillery. In all, 8,500 Michigan National Guardsmen were involved in quelling the rioting.




http://www.michigan.gov/dmva/0 ,1607,7-126-2360_3003_3009-273 93--,00.html
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Lowell
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 11:53 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dday you are right it; was the 82nd Airborne, not the 101st. I was going by some old notes I wrote at the time, which were incorrect. I have changed my post above to make the corrections found. Thanks.
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Lowell
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 12:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Another curious factor about 1967 Detroit was that it was a prosperous year in the auto industry. Jobs were plentiful and labor supply was shortened by the increasing drafts into the Army, so wages were good and rising. The fact that I and others could blow into town and land the equivalent of a $25 an hour job today demonstrated that. Sure there were still a lot of people left out but compared to other times, this was still a 'best of times' period and the black middle and business classes were rapidly rising perhaps symbolized by Berry Gordy.

On the cvil rights front there was a new, young and open-minded Mayor of the City, some even thought of him as Presidential 'timber' in the mold of the Kennedys right down to the Irish Catholic part. Detroit's relations were considered above par.

The riot did not break out in the decaying neighborhoods of the Black Bottom and the projects, it erupted and raged most furiously in an area of middle and upper middle class homes.

So not only was a bubble burst, a very perplexing bubble was burst. The size and fury of the event compounded the perplexity. When the guns fell silent everybody sat there dumbfounded and, other than the usual platitudes, speechless.
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Thnk2mch
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 2:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

Dday you are right it; was the 82nd Airborne, not the 101st.




Lowell, it appears you are both right, according to the Michigan National Guard site ( see my post #467 above )

"One brigade each from the 82nd and 101st Airborne Divisions were flown to Selfridge Air National Guard Base and joined Task Force Detroit under the command of Lt. Gen. John Throckmorton."

(Message edited by thnk2mch on October 26, 2006)
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Psip
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 3:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

An interesting side note is the people Washington sent to manage the event for LBJohnson
Cyrus Vance.. Undersec. of Defense
Warren Christopher.. Undersec of State.
Those name should ring a bell.
There was a lot of political grandstanding going on between them and George Romney.
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Spacemonkey
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 3:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Life's a riot.
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River_rat
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 3:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For a long time I didn't want to post on this thread or any "67 riot thread" because it was a reminder of one of the painful reasons my home city has imploded to the state of today. I lived at Mack near Beaubien. I was shot at, forced to take cover, shuttled around under police/military presence, and worked almost every moment of every waking hour for a week away from my family because of the riot.

From any rooftop you could see fires lighting up the sky for several nights, gunshots, then tanks on our street corners.

A very good analysis of the events and related events can be found by the author, Eugene Methvin. The deaths and injuries were very under-reported. The media accepted figure of 46 deaths is very low. But then, who was really counting?

A good time to try to understand, but as Lowell points out, it just is incomprehencable as there was prosperity with good jobs for all, civil rights were gaining at great leaps, and the communities most affected were those that needed the most assistance to change their conditions.

Bad time.
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Cozmikdebris
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 3:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have many of the books mentioned in this thread, and a few others: Detroit: I Do Mind Dying, A Study In Urban Revolution (Georgakas & Surkin, 1975) and A City In Racial Crisis (Gordon, 1971). Somewhere in the basement I still have the issues of the Free Press I posted pictures from earlier.

I was only ten that summer, living in Westland. We watched on TV, but I don't recall my dad sleeping with a shotgun under the bed or anything like that. My great aunt lived on either Mendota north of I-96 or had moved to Patton near 7 Mile by that time. I've never heard her talk about the events, but never directly questioned her, either. She moved to Mackinaw City and lives there to this day.

(Message edited by cozmikdebris on October 26, 2006)
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Milwaukee
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 3:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"The media accepted figure of 46 deaths is very low"

I'll be honest, it really seems like that number is pretty low. From what I've read and heard, it sounds like all out war in some parts of town.

River_rat, I wrote up at the top, that I didn't want to open up a sore issue. Sorry, if it brought back bad memories, but it is a great thread with some great information and stories. Thanks for sharing your story.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 6:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

12th St.

12th St 1967 Detroit Riots





Grand River area

Grand River 1967

Kercheval and E Grand Blvd area

Kercheval and E Grand Blvd 1967


Linwood area

Linwood 1967

Grand River and Warren area

Grand River and Warren 1967
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 6:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Armory on Schoolcraft Road was an Army Reserve Center, not National Guard, but the 70th Division was also based there.

Bob Cosgrove
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Dtown1
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 6:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

those homes and commercial buildings looked so beautifal.
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Wash_man
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 6:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

One thing that really sticks out in those pictures (other than the city is on fire) is the density of the buildings.
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Detroit_stylin
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 7:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yanno Wash? Thats the first thing that hit me, especially around 12th, Linwood, and Grand River. I have never known those areas to be so dense in my lifetime...
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River_rat
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 8:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A side note about the riots. Hospitals had to put sheets up over windows to preclude shooters from seeing targets inside. No one and no thing was immune from the violence. As I said earlier, there were more than 46 casualties. To be counted as a 'riot death', there had to be direct evidence of riot violence (shot, stabbed,etc.) If you were just dead, you were not riot related.

The riot produced a new diagnosis, "looter's arm". Looters would smash a window and reach in to pilfer, and the top of the glass would often come down, and chop on the arm.

To one who lived through the entire event (and the MLK disturbance) it was a very tragic event for everyone in Detroit, especially those who lost their lives and their property.

Detroit was as difficult as my stint in the military during the Vietnam War and and a Haitian revolution I later inadvertantly attended.

The sixties were the years that changed our society in ways we still feel so powerfully today. Good or bad ????
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321brian
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Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 9:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The riots were definately Detroits tipping point.

Sure, the city was losing population at the time but the riots pushed the exidous to high gear.

Without them people would still have left the city but I'll guess that population today would still be in the 1.5 million range with a lot more whites.

It is just amazing to see how dense the buildings were. I was born in the early 70s and can't imagine seeing it.
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Gannon
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Post Number: 6940
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 26, 2006 - 11:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Rat,

I say bad...or MUCH delayed and tendered good...as the momentum of those sixties movements were seriously derailed. Pretty much EVERY leader aiming for the betterment of mankind, peace amidst celebrated and welcome diversity, and balanced justice for all who stuck their neck out got their heads blown off.

I've wondered what would have happened in our world if JFK, MLK, Malcolm, RFK, and Medgar Evers were allowed to finish the work they had started. Some of their causes were galvanized by the martyrdom, but for the most part their original intent and ideals were diluted.


We got a hint of social change in a few dimensions, but I believe the national riots alone changed LBJ's Great Society programs from well-thought education and employment focussed to relatively random dumpers of money into the inner cities...opening the doors for over twenty years of abuses by some.


Those common and documented abuses seem to be why many on the right illogically consider ALL welfare to be bad. At least, that is all they can come up with to argue why they think it should all go away...
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Nanska
Member
Username: Nanska

Post Number: 8
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Friday, October 27, 2006 - 12:51 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was only a small child at the time so my memories are sparse. I remember sitting on the living room couch and watching the tanks roll down Wildemere, which for a 3 yr. old wasn't scary, I had no idea just what they were. My mother was quite scared though. My father was stuck out at the Rouge so my mother and I slept together in my parents big bed ( what a treat !), with Daddy's .38 underneath her pillow. My mother says that she remembers quite vividly there being lots of out-of-town license plate in the City the days before the riots started. So her opinion has been that out-of-towners came into Detroit and lit the fuse, so to speak. Anybody else heard/saw an unusually high number of Ill/OH plates driving around the Westside before the riots?
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48202
Member
Username: 48202

Post Number: 11
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, October 27, 2006 - 1:23 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroit_stylin –

You asked if anyone can identify the photos…

I think the first one is looking southwest from the Boulevard Building at Woodward and East Grand. The Cunningham’s looks like the southeast corner of that intersection.
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River_rat
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Username: River_rat

Post Number: 243
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Friday, October 27, 2006 - 8:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gannon, I tend to agree that the sixties were the beginning of the slow decline. It would never be that MLK, RFK, Medgar could finish their work and the "Great Society" has wasted $9 trillion in futile attempts to correct injustice by throwing money at it.

Unequivocally, the events of July, 1966 remain the seminal acts that have taken the city to the depths of today. And I also agree that LBJ was lured into the quick fix of throwing money into the cities as a response to urban violence. Can anyone deny that it didn't work? What it did was collectivize the violence in pockets of urban poverty that the "great war on poverty" hasn't touched in 40 years.

The riot in Detroit in 1966 has had a great effect on policies since then and will continue to reverberate for years to come.
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Chucktown_motown
Member
Username: Chucktown_motown

Post Number: 11
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 9:02 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You know it's funny. As I look at these pictures as sad as it's to say that this had to happen sometimes out of uprisings and destruction comes good. Good in the form that true many had to die in the riots it help pave way for racial equality. I live in the south now, well until sunday then I'm moving back home to the D. And living in the south it's a whole other world. Take my neighborhood for example. I live next to one of the worst housing projects in SOuth Carolina and yes it's ALL black. My neighborhood, literally all black. And people ask me why. Why do I live here. I don't see any reason not. I think when your from Detroit and you think like a Detroiter, at least I do. You don't see color. I belivev our way of thinking is that of "we are all in this together". The better of the whole is better then a divided and so on. I can honestly say I don't look at race. I was'nt brought up that way. It's not in my blood. That's why I'm moving home, I am not a southerner. I don't think along those line. You should see how divided Charleston is here. The attitudes and soforth. It's sickening. I think us as Detroiter's learned valuable lessons from the riots. I think that when you have a establishment, such a Cavanaugh's mayoral tenure it can divide. And one can turn the whole sterotype of a whole sour. Thus being the blacks attitude twords whites. Cavanaugh hurt the whites rep. And that's what is going on here in Charleston. Mayor Riley been in power for 20 some odd yrs I think, old southern attitude. The place can't progress. Some places it takes voting, other rioting. But I think as much harm as the riots did, it did alot of good. It made change and action happen. And sometimes like a kid learning to ride a bike that action may have to be sudden and drastic. I beleive in all my travels that Detroiter's are some of the most unifies people there are and I'm taking Detroiters. Not Oakland County. When I meet someone from Detroit here in Charleston, there's a instant bond. You instantly look out for one of your own. Whoever they are. That's the attitude I see. And it makes me proud. We are a hard people. But good people. A tough hard breed. That can take any challenge, without racial divides.
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Chucktown_motown
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Username: Chucktown_motown

Post Number: 12
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 9:13 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

ANd this is what I'm talking about. Read the timeline of the Riots by Lowell. Monday July 24 entire block of Davison and Dexter on fire- Blacks citizens pour into streets to protect firemen. Now you understand the attitude. Lookin' out...ya dig keep that attitude
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Admin
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 592
Registered: 09-2003
Posted on Monday, December 11, 2006 - 9:28 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Click Here to Continue to Part 2 of 1967 Detroit Riots
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Jgavrile
Member
Username: Jgavrile

Post Number: 201
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Thursday, September 11, 2008 - 3:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found it sort of strange that during the riots in 67. I was living in the area of Livernois and Fenkell. the first night we had all the windows open and the smoke kept coming in. It was pretty bad. So I decided to take my wife and kid and go stay with my folks in Highland Park,as they relayed ,there was not any problem over there.
So we went and stayed there for a couple days, until it quieted down. in spite of the fact that Highland Park was probably half black back then, there were no problems of any rioters and looters there. the police came out right away and blockaded the main streets and kept everyone from coming in ,who didn't live there and basically kept people from going out to cause any trouble in Detroit. They were able keep the lid on it without major problems. Sort of interesting ,when you look at it now. the police in Highland Park probably couldn't control a small parade now if it had to.
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Dogman
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Username: Dogman

Post Number: 1
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Tuesday, February 03, 2009 - 3:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I remember all too well about this time. I was coming back from Camp Grayling after dropping my brother off there. He was serving with the NG from the Artillery Armory on 8 Mile Rd. Stopping off at the family cabin near Harrison with the rest of our family, I made it back to Detroit which was in chaos, with my brother beating me back to the city. A lot of things transpired in the next few days, which will probably never come to light. I enjoyed the pictures in this discussion, too many to read at one sitting. I joined the NG the following year during MLK assignation riots in Detroit. It was a very interesting time in those days with what all was going on everywhere and for every cause and all. Some comments were made about "sloppy" guardsmen. I guess that no sleep for about 72 hours would take its toll on anyone. They did the best they could under the circumstances. They patroled the streets at the onset with no ammo and were being shot at by cowards hidden in buildings. When the federal troops arrived, they were fresh and really pissed off that they had to be there. Police and firefighters were undermanned, certainly outgunned, and worked til they dropped also. All I can say is "thanks for more parking spaces" near where I worked off Grand River. I hope we have progressed far enough in our civility and matureness to never see this again. I moved to Florida in the early '70s, returning to visit on rare occasions, and only relatives and close friends who had moved from the city long ago. In '04 I was going west out Fenkell in the old Brightmoor area and at every traffic light someone wanted to sell me "something". Good ole Detroit!!! I took pics of Redford High, Emerson Jr. High and Holcomb gradeschool, among anything that still looked remotely the same. Memories are great.

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