 
Ndavies
Member
Username: Ndavies
Post Number: 2711
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 26, 2007 - 3:12 pm: |    |
Harwell's radio comments can be accessed from this page.
http://www.wwj.com/pages/91467 .php? |
Paulmcall
Member
Username: Paulmcall
Post Number: 285
Registered: 05-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 26, 2007 - 9:21 pm: | |
I don't think too many Detroit Tigers live in Detroit so what's the problem?
If the Corktown residents want an empty lot, go for it. I still want to know how they're going to pay for tearing it down.
I don't think they're going to sell enough seats to pay for that. |
Knocturnal
Member
Username: Knocturnal
Post Number: 220
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 26, 2007 - 9:30 pm: | |
Being that the city has been paying $300k/year for maintenance of this weed lot, what is a little more? |
Mdoyle
Member
Username: Mdoyle
Post Number: 154
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, July 26, 2007 - 9:41 pm: | |
The clowncil is at it again and this is a classic reason to organize a borough system in the city. The council people should be representative of the entire city but really they just see themselves as the DECIDERS. They wield their power to do their bidding and its complete BS. The people that live in the damn neighborhood should be represented. Now I dont live in Corktown but it might be wise for someone who does that has strong feelings about the issue to "Rally the troops" and get a very large gathering of Corktown residents to weigh in on the issue. The people should be heard and the council doesnt seem to be representing them.
(Message edited by mdoyle on July 26, 2007) |
Ffdfd
Member
Username: Ffdfd
Post Number: 113
Registered: 09-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, July 26, 2007 - 9:43 pm: | |
quote:The Kagan part of the story is priceless.
The City Council wants an in person apology from him? The written one wasn't good enough?
Kagan's response is equally priceless.
quote:"I think it's fine to request things," said Kagan, adding that he had written a letter of apology to the council. "This is a democracy. People should ask for whatever they want."
Should go in the translation thread. Kagan's quote = Council might as well ask for a magic weight-loss pill. |
Dustin89
Member
Username: Dustin89
Post Number: 64
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, July 26, 2007 - 10:08 pm: | |
Just to re-iterate my earlier comments...views on this forum in regards to what the Tiger Stadium site should look like or who should or should not be deciding this are irrelevant to this thread. The fact is, the Mayor proposed a plan and it's up to City Council to debate it and decide whether to approve it. Councilwoman Reeves' invitation to Ernie Harwell to appear before council is just a part of council's discussion/debate on this issue. Would you rather have the council simply pass Kilpatrick's plan for Michigan & Trumbull with no debate at all? I just don't understand why this is an issue. Perhaps city leadership is why things "don't get done"-but the foot-deep cynicism here doesn't help. As far as actions taken by the city council go, this one is pretty respectable: showing concern and perhaps even acting as a deliberative body when it comes to the redevelopment of Tiger Stadium, which will impact one of the city's best neighborhoods. |
Bumble
Member
Username: Bumble
Post Number: 262
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 8:43 am: | |
quote:Should go in the translation thread. Kagan's quote = Council might as well ask for a magic weight-loss pill.
Barbara Rose Collins could use an Alli (though I'd hate to be the employee who has to take her knickers to the laundry, eh Rasputin?) |
Tigersfan9
Member
Username: Tigersfan9
Post Number: 111
Registered: 03-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 11:40 am: | |
Some aerial pics of the ballpark from WWJ's web page:
http://www.wwj.com/pages/72623 4.php? |
Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham
Post Number: 227
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 12:23 pm: | |
http://www.wwj.com/pages/72637 5.php?contentType=4&contentId= 726601
Harwell Makes Pitch for Ballpark, Council to Vote
WWJ Newsroom Reporting
Detroit -- Detroit City Council is schedule to vote this afternoon on the fate of Tiger Stadium. Stay with WWJ for the latest live and local coverage.
Legendary broadcaster Ernie Harwell stepped up to the plate Friday morning, addressing council at the request of councilwoman Martha Reeves. Harwell said he would like to see a memorial there or at least some part of the park preserved at Michigan and Trumbull, but stressed caution before making a decision.
"I think there are viable solutions, maybe integrating some of the plans that have been made previously, getting all of the groups together and moving forward," said Harwell.
"The old stadium has stood there like the house by the side of the road now for a long, long time," said Harwell, making a reference to one of his many expressions--this one describing a batter who was called out on strikes, "and there's been a lot of going back and forth, a lot of bitterness and acrimony, and we want to try to eliminate that."
Reeves has said she wants to preserve portions of Tiger Stadium and create a sports museum and/or a retail center.
© MMVII WWJ Radio, All Rights Reserved. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 1388
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 1:01 pm: | |
I was shocked nobody caught my "house by the side of the road" reference earlier in this thread. |
Waz
Member
Username: Waz
Post Number: 136
Registered: 11-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 1:33 pm: | |
I caught it, Johnlodge, and thought it was very funny. Guess I should've acknowledged it earlier.
Okay, so now Ernie heas spoken. I still think it was a waste of everybody's time for him to address the council. I even agree with much of what he said, but so what? |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3374
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 1:40 pm: | |
Harwell merely reiterated what most of the mixed use development plans have called for: preserving the field and a small piece of the stadium.
I guess there's some weight to what he said just because of who he is, but he should have much less of a say than the residents of Corktown. |
Pmb
Member
Username: Pmb
Post Number: 1
Registered: 07-2007
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 2:02 pm: | |
As many other residents of Corktown have said, I too am perplexed that Harwell's and other suburban voices have had more of a hearing than Corktown voices. Part of that is the fault of the office of the mayor, claiming this as his plan instead of the neighborhood's, and some people just won't work with this mayor. Many do not realize that the DEGC plan is the neighborhood plan that the mayor adopted. Part too might be a council resentment of the neighborhood, not all of which I understand. |
Tetsua
Member
Username: Tetsua
Post Number: 1288
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 2:50 pm: | |
Stadium is outta here.
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20070727/NEW S01/70727045 |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3376
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:00 pm: | |
I don't understand why the land wasn't transfered to the DEGC. Can someone interpret the impact of this to me?
I trust the DEGC and their ability to put development into motion. That story leaves me with the feeling that it will be demolished with no developer lined up to start rebuilding. |
Tetsua
Member
Username: Tetsua
Post Number: 1289
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:06 pm: | |
Seems that way, and I don't get the logic behind it. |
Histeric
Member
Username: Histeric
Post Number: 783
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:19 pm: | |
Couldn't have asked for a better result. It allows the Old Tiger Stadium Conservancy to move forward with its planning and fundraising, it allows DEGC to move forward with asset disposition, but it reserves some leverage to ensure that DEGC allows the Conservancy sufficient time to fund the preservation aspect of the Corktown Plan. City Council hit one out of the park with this decision. Nicely done. |
Livernoisyard
Member
Username: Livernoisyard
Post Number: 3514
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:28 pm: | |
Some $2 million was wasted on Tiger Stadium already. Tear it down!
Milwaukee turned the 1953-built Milwaukee County Stadium into a little-league ball diamond years ago after it was replaced by a retractable-roof stadium next door in the former center-field parking lot.
BTW, Bob Uecker is a better play-by-play announcer than Harwell, and he's into his 38th season and still going. How many dozens of times has Harwell been a regular guest on Johnny Carson's Tonight Show?
(Message edited by Livernoisyard on July 27, 2007) |
Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham
Post Number: 228
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:30 pm: | |
Sounds like the Conservancy is the stadium's best bet. Or at least the site's. I wish Wattrick and Company the best. |
Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham
Post Number: 229
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:35 pm: | |
Uecker better than Ernie?!
That comment's "juuuust a bit outside."
: )
But, dear GOD, I'd take Uecker over Jim Price any day of the week. Somebody, PLEASE ... give that man a job in sales or something. Get him off the air already. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3377
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:41 pm: | |
What's your problem, LY?
What do late-night TV appearances have to do with how well someone does play by play? Harwell is among the best. Hall of Fame. Shut up. |
Livernoisyard
Member
Username: Livernoisyard
Post Number: 3515
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:48 pm: | |
Uecker's play-by-play call for Jim Price: quote:"Get up! Get up! Get outta here! Gone!" |
Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham
Post Number: 230
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:51 pm: | |
I wish, Livernoisyard!
I WISH! |
Quozl
Member
Username: Quozl
Post Number: 1041
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 3:51 pm: | |
I cannot stand that Tim McCarver. I want to kick him in the nuts. |
J_stone
Member
Username: J_stone
Post Number: 384
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 4:19 pm: | |
I think this is the best decision.
Interesting though, today I was walking by the stadium on my way to Brooks Lumber, when I noticed that I could see from the Trumbull side, parts of the 3rd base upper deck seats, both blue and orange, through a gap. I never realized that before. The sun was shinning illuminating them. They looked brand new. It was then that I realized just how special a place it was to watch baseball and that I'll probably never feel that way about Comerica Park. I wish I could go back inside just one more time. I miss it.
I really hope the Conservancy does a great job with the field plans and/or museum. It could really be a cool place.
I think whoever does become the developer for the condo project, should really play up the whole baseball concept and try and keep similar dimensions and foot print of Tiger Stadium. If they do it right, I think they'll sell very well. Who wouldn't want to say they own a condo in the 3rd base upper deck!?
Now maybe the (MPLC) Maltese Parking Lot Cartel will disband and sell their land to house builders, who in turn will sell their houses to yuppies, who in turn will obsess about their lawn.
My new motto for Detroit is ....."One blade of grass at a time"
Green grass, over time = cops who care?? Better schools? Cleaner streets? More retail?
Think about it.. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3378
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 4:42 pm: | |
I would totally live in a nice rowhouse with Michigan Ave. on one side and the field on the other.
Anyone understand why the DEGC was kept out of this? |
Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham
Post Number: 231
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 4:43 pm: | |
Speaking of green, let's hope that whatever is built on the site has some good old "Briggs Green" incorporated into it.
They never should've changed the color of the seats.
I think that was Jim Campbell's idea.
Blue & orange. Gack. |
Xd_brklyn
Member
Username: Xd_brklyn
Post Number: 269
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 4:46 pm: | |
So the City Council could have some say in the development of the Tiger Stadium site. |
Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham
Post Number: 232
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 4:46 pm: | |
Why was the DEGC kept out?
I dunno.
I suppose "politics" might be the best answer. |
Histeric
Member
Username: Histeric
Post Number: 784
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 4:55 pm: | |
If you understood the structure of DEGC you would realize they were not "kept out" of anything. The DEGC staffs the EDC, DDA, DBRA and is fully involved in the TS project. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3379
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 5:17 pm: | |
When should we expect an RFP for mixed use redevelopment?
Sure as hell better be before the demo. |
Drm
Member
Username: Drm
Post Number: 1124
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 8:42 pm: | |
quote:Sure as hell better be before the demo. Why? |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3381
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 9:11 pm: | |
Don't tear shit down without a plan, or else you'll end up with, i.e., an empty Madison-Lenox Site, an empty Motown Building site, an empty Hudson Block... |
Drm
Member
Username: Drm
Post Number: 1125
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 9:53 pm: | |
quote:Don't tear shit down without a plan, or else you'll end up with, i.e., an empty Madison-Lenox Site, an empty Motown Building site, an empty Hudson Block... What part of the fact that there is currently a plan, and has been a plan since the mayor's June 2006 announcement, do you not understand? |
Dustin89
Member
Username: Dustin89
Post Number: 68
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 10:09 pm: | |
Drm-it appears there is no funding. The fact is, Corktown is functioning quite well as a stable neighborhood right now, even with this big empty stadium looming over it. Why not do this carefully so that whatever happens results in development benefiting Corktown rather than an empty lot? I think things are on the right path now, and the council is actually trying to ensure there is an actual funded plan in place for this stadium once it's demoed. Oops, I said something positive about the City Council--time to dodge the impromptu stoning about to take place!  |
Supersport
Member
Username: Supersport
Post Number: 11646
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 10:40 pm: | |
quote:Ernie is too smart to get sucked into this mess.
quote:Ernie has too much class to be involved in something like this. Maybe if one of the city council wanted to meet with him in private without any press coverage he'd probably agree to it. Something like this places too much importance on Ernie's opinion and that's not what he's about.
Now it seems those who said Ernie wouldn't get involved are standing their silent, like a house on the side of the road. |
Gistok
Member
Username: Gistok
Post Number: 4968
Registered: 08-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 10:57 pm: | |
Ironically Corktown is better now than when baseball was at Tiger Stadium.
Back then neighborhood empty lots were a cash cow for game days, but made the neighborhood look as gaping as the smile on a jack-o-lantern.
Since infill has taken place, the neighborhood is much improved.
There's no longer an incentive to tear down Corktown houses for ugly weed filled lots used only on game days. |
Urbanoutdoors
Member
Username: Urbanoutdoors
Post Number: 477
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 11:07 pm: | |
I love corktown its kinda sad though I would love to stay down here but it is almost like I am getting priced out of the area because property values are so much higher here than the rest of the city. I wish I had moved here a few years earlier Because I heard of people moving here back in 2000 and getting a fully renovated house for 80,000 dollars now with the stadium in its current condition the house is almost 3 times that. There are exceptions but those are mainly in the west section of corktown closer to the train station. That is going to be the next area of rejuvenation, although I doubt it will have little to do with what ever happens with the stadium. |
Lmichigan
Member
Username: Lmichigan
Post Number: 5852
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 11:16 pm: | |
Really? It would seem that the resolution of the Tiger Stadium situation will exponentially cut down on the time it will take the area to revitalize. This is one of the few cases where I think that the negative affect of an old dinosaur are actually very significant to the prospects of revitalizing the area in question. |
Urbanoutdoors
Member
Username: Urbanoutdoors
Post Number: 478
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 11:25 pm: | |
There could possibly be infill but the last abandoned house east of rosa parks is already being rehabbed, so in terms of housing the area west of rosa is all that is left for fixeruppers. Those will still be affected by MCS but that area has slowly been coming back already but not as quickly as the rest of corktown did. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3382
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 27, 2007 - 11:42 pm: | |
Look, Drm, I'm in favor of the demo and the mayor's "plan," I just would like to have a developer named, perhaps some renderings, or at the very least an RFP written up before the tear down is approved.
Yes there's a plan, and a good one at that, but nothing is written in stone. |
Drm
Member
Username: Drm
Post Number: 1127
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2007 - 1:52 am: | |
quote:Look, Drm, I'm in favor of the demo and the mayor's "plan," I just would like to have a developer named, perhaps some renderings, or at the very least an RFP written up before the tear down is approved. What part of the fact that The Old Tiger Stadium Conservancy has been named as a developer for the preservation portion of the project do you not understand? I'd be more concerned if developers were announced for the remainder of the site but not for the preservation portion.
quote:Drm-it appears there is no funding. I'd hope that all the stadium "lovers" would step up to assure that there is funding. It looks to me like the preservationists have been given a golden opportunity here. quote:The fact is, Corktown is functioning quite well as a stable neighborhood right now, even with this big empty stadium looming over it. True. I wonder how much better it could function without this anchor holding it down. quote:Why not do this carefully so that whatever happens results in development benefiting Corktown rather than an empty lot? Sounds like Council is doing this carefully. The neighborhood supports this plan, so I assume that the residents feel that Corktown will benefit. |
Danny
Member
Username: Danny
Post Number: 6285
Registered: 02-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2007 - 8:46 am: | |
Sorry Enrie Harwell!
The city CLOWNSIL has spoken! Tiger Stadium is HISTORY! I mean extinct. Now who wants to lobby the city CLOWNSIL to save Tiger Stadium? |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3385
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, July 28, 2007 - 12:35 pm: | |
"Named as a developer for the preservation portion of the project..."
As I want the field and part of the architecture preserved as a monument, this is great, but all we know at this point is that some relics will remain, but mostly we'll have a large vacant block.
Whose job will it be to find a developer that will actually build something there? The conservancy? The DEGC?
Your condescending posts don't change the fact that I cannot be sure that something good will end up happening until I see an RFP and/or a developer with plans and money named.
http://www.degc.org/main.cfm?l ocation=83
Don't see it yet. |
Drm
Member
Username: Drm
Post Number: 1130
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 30, 2007 - 11:11 pm: | |
quote:As I want the field and part of the architecture preserved as a monument, this is great, but all we know at this point is that some relics will remain, but mostly we'll have a large vacant block. If you understand that the field and a portion of the structure (I don't know where your reference to "relics" comes from) will be preserved, why do you claim that "mostly we'll have a large vacant block"?
quote:Whose job will it be to find a developer that will actually build something there? The conservancy? The DEGC? We know who is going to preserve the site. Turn the rest into a park and turn it over to the Conservancy if no developers are interested in the development parcels.
quote:Your condescending posts don't change the fact that I cannot be sure that something good will end up happening until I see an RFP and/or a developer with plans and money named. The field will be preserved, baseball will once again be played there, a portion of the structure will be preserved, a rotting hulk will no sit at Corktown's main intersection (and at an important gateway into the CBD) and land speculators will no longer have an incentive to hold onto vacant parcels in the neighborhood for parking. Sounds like "something good" to me.
You're right, my "condescending posts" don't change anything, but message board posts seldom do. Change results from action. The Conservancy has been taking action for over a year (and Scott Martin, Kelli Kavanaugh and the GCDC for years before that) to move this project forward in a way that honors the history of the site and benefits the neighborhood. Their efforts should be respected and acknowledged, not trivialized and dismissed. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3408
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 30, 2007 - 11:40 pm: | |
We agree on a lot, I'm just expecting more, and sooner.
In response to your first question...relics = the field and a piece of grandstands. If nothing is built over the rest of the footprint on the existing structure (i.e. along all the streets), you have an empty lot with the exception of the remaining grandstand. That would be problematic because we would NOT have millions invested and we would NOT have substantial taxes being paid. We'd be slightly better off because we would have a conservancy and the stadium wouldn't be disgracing itself any more (not to mention the upkeep costs that the city is on the hook for up til now), but we need to judge complete success by the development that occurs. That is why Corktown residents want the stadium gone, so that something which enhances their neighborhood and their land values gets BUILT. Settling for a conservancy and no development would be just that: settling. |
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