  Border5150 Member Username: Border5150 Post Number: 148 Registered: 03-2004 Posted From: 68.58.211.179 |
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20060508/NEW S01/605080338 I think the COD has a very real chance at the Democratic Convention, but the Olympics? Let's get real... | ||
Toog05 Member Username: Toog05 Post Number: 9 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.61.197.58 |
yea the Democratic Convention is more of a reality, not the Olympics, I think Chicago is going to get the olympics | ||
Drdetroit Member Username: Drdetroit Post Number: 79 Registered: 04-2006 Posted From: 68.79.103.130 |
Why not the Olympics in Detroit & Windsor??? Why not? You 2 have been programmed to hate Detroit!!! If you dont like it no one else will | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 594 Registered: 01-2004 Posted From: 65.91.73.194 |
What makes a city Olympic worthy or not? Why shouldn't Detroit try and put in a bid for the Olympics | ||
Mountainman Member Username: Mountainman Post Number: 33 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 153.90.110.121 |
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Detroit and Windsor put a bid for the Olympics in 1970s or 60s. | ||
Motorcitymayor2026 Member Username: Motorcitymayor2026 Post Number: 787 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 24.231.189.137 |
Detroit, without Windsor, was in the final three, and the representative for the United States in the bid for the 1968 Olympic Games | ||
Paulj Member Username: Paulj Post Number: 358 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 68.250.41.176 |
uh oh, the emperor is parading around naked again and all his followers are raving about his marvelous outfit... Dem convention? For sure could be pulled off, and pulled off well, downtown. Olympics? Come on now, I envy your optimism but I think thats about 3 leagues too high for Detroit right now. Unless you want a transit-miserable event sprawled out between Ann Arbor, Pontiac, and Windsor... Talk about headaches when your #1 shot-put guy is being stripped-searched at the border and everyone else is tied-up in shuttle bus traffic trying to get to the decrepit silverdome. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 27 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.40.65.66 |
Why not the olympics? If Atlanta can do it we certainly can. Detroit has been runner-up more times than any other city who has not hosted the Olympics. The only thing we would need to actually build is a stadium for opening/closing ceramonies. And to organize/create public transit system (Which btw, Turin did for 2006 winter olympics that it still uses now). So if we're going for a midwestern US city, Detroit DEF deserves it | ||
Mountainman Member Username: Mountainman Post Number: 35 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 153.90.110.121 |
Paulj, good point. The D has a long way to go before its viable for the Olympics. Motorcitymayor2026, Cool. Wasn't sure about the Windsor thing, but I was fairly sure about Detroit. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 7357 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 4.229.99.90 |
The way it works now is that the host city has to take on a lot of costs. The costs would not be covered regionally or state wide and Detroit simply does not have the money. Logisitics aside it would be foolish financially for Detroit to even make an attempt no matter how feeble it may be. | ||
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker Post Number: 1136 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.214 |
Link to movie about Detroit's Olympic proposal: http://www.archive.org/details /DetroitC1965 | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 29 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.40.65.66 |
@ Mountainman - it might be a ways to go before it's viable, but that's why the event is 10 years away. How ready for the SuperBowl were we when our hosting was announced? Also, in terms of the money - your logic is backwards. Similarly with the superbowl the capital is an investment in the future of the city. The raw capital def exists, its a matter of investing it in the city (Message edited by apbest on May 08, 2006) | ||
Eric Member Username: Eric Post Number: 445 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 35.11.210.161 |
It has nothing to do with hating Detroit it's called being realistic. Now with the political conventions Detroit has a good chance. Of the two I'd rather have the Dem convention come to the city since it'd attract less protesters and disturbances | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 31 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.40.65.66 |
The Olympic Committee doesnt make the 2016 decisions intil 2009. Maybe the conventions can be a platform for our Olympics bid | ||
Jiminnm Member Username: Jiminnm Post Number: 545 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 68.35.85.184 |
The City of Atlanta spent about $2 billion (in 1996 dollars) to prepare for the Olympics, in addition to whatever the USOC spent. I expect Detroit would have to spend at least twice that amount, and maybe more, because it lacks even the the facilities that Atlanta began with. That's more than $4,000 per resident if the city were to try it alone. As for a political convention, that's more doable. As I recall the last time this came up, there was an issue about having an adequate number of hotel rooms within a stated distance from the convention site. Is that still an issue? | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1626 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 70.236.173.208 |
Don't be too quick to rule out the Olympics in Detroit/Windsor. Just take a look at where Atlanta was before it was awarded the Olympics. Crime was high. Mass transit had some major issues. It was widely regarded as a back-water, third-world city. Does any of this sound just a little familiar? Upgrade mass-transit. Build the gondola lift. Finish the permenant casinos and some hotels. Welcome more restaurants and retail. All of this is very doable by 2016 (the next Olympic Games to be bid). Detroit and Windsor would be foolish not to bid for it. | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1627 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 70.236.173.208 |
On average, $4,000 per resident. Sounds like a lot but: a) It's spread out of 10 years; b) A decent chunck of it will be spent by business, who will make a profit off of it when the Olympics come; c) Most of those upgrades are for stuff that we should be investing in anyway; and d) We get to keep all of the cool stuff when the Olympics are over. Again, Detroit and Windsor would be foolish not to bid for it. (Message edited by fnemecek on May 08, 2006) | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1628 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 70.236.173.208 |
And it wasn't that long ago that "realistic" people were saying that there was no way Detroit could pull off a Super Bowl. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 18 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.246.96.250 |
Detroit put everything it had into having a Superbowl. And the Superbowl brought people from all over the area, a good number from Green Bay, and a handful of the coffee drinkers. The Olympics bring people from all over the world, on a scale that made people think Greece was going to fail. Mostly because of an inadequate mass transit system. Detroit has some sports venues nicely situated around town, but it would take years to prepare to host the Olympics. And the time between winning the bid and hosting would not be enough at this time. | ||
Mountainman Member Username: Mountainman Post Number: 36 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 153.90.110.121 |
ApBest, the only city I know that has paid off their Olympic debt is Calgary. Detroit can't even fund its schools. The Superbowl is peanuts compared to the Olympics. There's problems paving roads with the money the city has (and most likely will have). The Montreal Games have left that city with a financial nightmare. Something I won't wish on my worst enemy. I love Detroit, and I'd hate to see it saddled with that sort of added problem. | ||
Matt_the_deuce Member Username: Matt_the_deuce Post Number: 634 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.14.248.252 |
You mean Pittsburgh.  | ||
Matt_the_deuce Member Username: Matt_the_deuce Post Number: 635 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.14.248.252 |
not Green Bay... | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1630 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 70.236.173.208 |
They're bidding for the 2016 Olympics at this point. Plenty of time. | ||
Aaron Member Username: Aaron Post Number: 106 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 69.241.224.171 |
Not in this lifetime. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 59 Registered: 04-2006 Posted From: 68.40.50.194 |
Detroit NEEDS the Olympics. I doubt that they get the 2016 Olympics, which will be a summer games. The region seems to have its sites more set on the 2018 Winter Games, which is okay, but I'd rather see a summer games. | ||
Viziondetroit Member Username: Viziondetroit Post Number: 462 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 65.42.23.2 |
Security alone is what would keep Detroit and Windsor from having a joint Olympics. There would have to be one of the border crossings for 100% use. | ||
Detrola Member Username: Detrola Post Number: 19 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 69.14.28.209 |
The next party? Just a reminder. The city of detroit/KK is trying to borrow 120 million just to get through the end of this fiscal year which ends june 30th. City employees have been warned about payless pay days. City unions have not accepted the 10 percent cuts and increased copays (the city did quietly elmiminate insurance coverage for coverage for several hundred lower level employees union officials looked the other way. Some perish so that others may prosper) The budget cuts that have been made thus far, barely address the current deficit. The mayor and the counsil can not even agree on how many hundreds of millions of dollars the deficit is. The exodus of residents continues unabated. No one is city government seems willing to make revenue projections based on the current rate of population loss. Population loss is just one of many topics that few seem willing address. How is the city going to pay for the police overtime required to stage the fireworks? If the auburn hills Pistons win the championship how will the city pay for the police overtime and that of other city departments that would be necessary to host a parade? There is an alarming lack of urgency on the part of the mayor and CC. How much time and effort has gone into this silly cell phone ban. They are polishing the brass on the titanic. Talk of hosting the olympics is folly. Any time and effort on behalf of this effort is an insult to every tax paying citizen of the city. Los Angeles in 84 utilized pre-existing venues and incurred very little construction costs. Detroit like Montreal in 76 would have to build some or several venues including the massive olympic stadium that would be of little of no use after the games. The city should put a bid in for the Republican and Democratic conventions. These events would require the least resorces for the most return. It is time for the democrats to give something back to detroit for all these years of blind support. It's criminal that the party we so unconditionally support has continued to hold their conventions elsewhere. How much PAC money from the UAW/TEAMSTERS etc has gone into pockets of democrats who have done little or nothing for the cause. They give us lip service, we give them our vote because voting for a republican would be sacrilege. Unless the mayor and cc begin to move forward with the focus and urgency required by the massive budget deficit we will be planning a WAKE instead of a PARTY. | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 350 Registered: 09-2005 Posted From: 198.103.184.76 |
A couple of points this Tuesday morning: 1. A winter games is out of the question unless Michigan starts importing enough trash to build a mountain fit for skiing. 2. If a Detroit/Windsor bid saw both as equal partners, the games may be easier to fund. The Government of Canada is spending a lot of money on the Vancouver games and was to commit a lot of money to any Toronto-based games along with the province of Ontario. Depending on the role given to the Windsor side -- Windsor, Ontario and Canada could pick up a substantial part of the tab. 3. No need for the gondola -- people crossing at the border could take a ferry shuttle across the river like they used to do in the old days. Other than building docks and temporary customs facilities, the cities would need to rent or purchase several ferries. Maybe permanent ferry service tying Windsor and Detroit together could be the games’ legacy to the area. I will not contest the fact that Detroit is in financial straights. However, the economic activity generated by a successful games bid would certainly kick start the economy and bring quality mass transit that much closer to reality. | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 30 Registered: 01-2006 Posted From: 35.8.144.6 |
I've generally beeen agaisnt a Detroit Olympic Bid, but I'm curious as to what the long term benefits to the city could be, especially in regards to almost forcing the building of a mass transit system. Can anyone give a number to the estimated LONG TERM economic impact of hosting a summer games such as those in Atlanta, Sydney or Athens? | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 352 Registered: 09-2005 Posted From: 198.103.184.76 |
Most cities have to significantly upgrade their public transit systems. That alone would be a huge long term benefit to the Detroit area. Infastructure would need to be enhanced between Windsor and Detroit, i.e. the second bridge, use of the rail tunnel for passenger rail service (Via/Amtrak and even intercity Windsor-Detroit), potential for summer ferry service, tunnel plaza improvements. Building of an Olympic village -- scores of permanent new housing would need to be built for the games in Detroit neighbourhoods. | ||
Tayshaun22 Member Username: Tayshaun22 Post Number: 134 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 69.14.101.116 |
Let's take care of Wrestlemania first before we worry about the Olympics. | ||
Toog05 Member Username: Toog05 Post Number: 11 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.61.197.58 |
Wrestlemania aint nuthin, we dont need to do anything for that | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 2071 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.81.65 |
Upinottawa you hit the nail on the head.... where would we build an Olympic Village (including arenas and a stadium)? Use eminent domain and clear out another poor Detroit neighborhood, like they did for Poletown? | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 150 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 209.220.229.254 |
Highland Park! Get rid of the orange houses and BAM! ;) | ||
The_aram Member Username: The_aram Post Number: 4862 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.41.124.8 |
Detroit would not qualify for the 2016 Olympics based on the criteria set down by the USOC for the event. From the Wikipedia article outlining the possible cities competing for the bid:
OK, that being said. Let's run down the list, assuming that Detroit would be holding it alone without Windsor: 1. That's probably a no, as I'm pretty much certain Comerica Park and Ford Field do not have field surfaces big enough to accomodate a standard track. Nor could any of the stadiums in the area, including Michigan Stadium in Ann Arbor, accomodate such a thing. And I don't see the possibility of another stadium being built for this purpose. 2. Definite no, as we have no system of reliable mass transit, nor hope of one in the near future. Note that the sentence reads "already built or fully committed." Bids are due, what, end of 2007. That's likely to be far too soon to make transit magically appear. 3. Media village is iffy but doable, hotel and convention space are probably adequate, or at least could be made so by then. 4. If you can get the metropolitan area to get along, that's probably a go. 5. Doubtful. So, yeah, scratch Detroit from ever having a shot at the games. And I don't see bringing Windsor into the equation as helping the cause out substantially. | ||
The_rock Member Username: The_rock Post Number: 1231 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.42.251.225 |
It would be just so wonderful to have the Democrat Convention come to Detroit. Then they could see for themselves,first hand, what the last 50 years of Democratic administrations have done to this poor city since the Cobo years. I am sure they will be ever so proud of their policies/ achievements that have lead to population increases, safe neighborhoods,strong employment, great schools etc. Let the chest-thumping begin. | ||
Drdetroit Member Username: Drdetroit Post Number: 94 Registered: 04-2006 Posted From: 69.218.153.178 |
The_rock - They would see first hand what white flight (trash) racism has done to Detroit over the last 50 years! | ||
Detrola Member Username: Detrola Post Number: 20 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 69.14.28.209 |
Drdetroit, The flight continues, only it is no longer white, ergo no longer based on racism. The city leaders needs to acknowledge the continuing flight of the able. Something must be done to keep the residents it needs most from joining the mass exodus. Every spring DPS announces the closure of more schools. Every spring the mayor lays forth new cuts to deal with the budget deficit. And every month 1000 more people leave the city. The racists fears that contributed to white flight dealt the city a severe blow. The current flight of the able if not addressed will throw the knockout punch. Sadly, the city leaders are fighting like Gerry Cooney. | ||
Detroit48213 Member Username: Detroit48213 Post Number: 34 Registered: 04-2006 Posted From: 69.218.153.178 |
Why not bid? I say go for it. | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1632 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 70.225.113.82 |
The_aram: I have to disagree with most of your conclusions regarding Detroit's eligibility to host the 2016 Olympics. Let's run down the requirements. #1. Stadium. Yes. The various proposals to host the event in Chicago have called for using Soldier Field as the venue for the opening and closing ceremonies. If they can do it in Soldier Field, Detroit use either Ford Field or Comerica Park. #2. Infrastructure. Maybe. Mass transit in Detroit is an embarassment. However, I believe that the Olympics are exactly what is needed to jar the region's political leadership into doing the things they need to do. #3. Media Village. Yes. We have already hosted a large media contingent for SBXL, the All-Star Game and a half dozen other events. While the Olympics would call for stepping that up to an even larger degree, we are already farther ahead of the game than Chicago currently is or Atlanta was when they bid for the Games. #4. Support from the Private & Public Sectors. From the private sector, we have Rock Financial in the region - who has long used sports as a way to promote their business. They could easily spearhead efforts with other businesses. From the public sector, if we point out how much our suburban neighbors benefited from SBXL and remind them the Olympics takes that to a whole new level, we could bring them into the fold rather quickly. (It's amazing what a few billion dollars does to one's attitude.) #5. International Support. Definately. This is probably our greatest strength. First, if submit jointly with Canada then we'll likely be the only truly international contender. We'll start out with support from the Canadians. The fact that Detroit is warmly regarded in Europe will help (they sell "Detroit" t-shirts in Germany, for Christ sake). Plus, we can always do what Atlanta did to get the Games. Their mayor at the time went to the African contingent on the selection committee, pointed out the ethnic composition of the city and noted that Atlanta was the only African city to submit a bid. And their Mayor hadn't made any trips to Africa prior to submitting the bid. Face it guys, if we go for it, we can win. Or we can sit on the sidelines and bitch. (Message edited by fnemecek on May 10, 2006) | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1633 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 70.225.113.82 |
Detrola: No one is disputing Detroit's financial condition. However, simply cutting back won't save Detroit. We need to grow or we'll die. Hosting the Olympics allows us to grow, with someone else picking up a part of the tab. | ||
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_ Post Number: 1335 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 69.220.230.150 |
The_rock is right. This city has been democratic for decades and it has gotten them nothing. They blindly vote and aid the party and yet they give back nothing to the area. | ||
The_aram Member Username: The_aram Post Number: 4864 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.41.124.8 |
But, also, we've missed the boat on the bid for the Olympics, it seems. We're not on the short list, with those host cities being visited about their bids, literally, as we speak. I believe the committee is in Chicago today for a meeting with their mayor and officials, with the other cities being visited this week. Check out this link for more information: http://www.gamesbids.com/engli sh/bids/2016.shtml Like it or not, 2016 is out of the question for Detroit. If we're not on the short list right now, and we're not getting visited right now by the USOC, we're not getting it. And the likelihood of having it co-hosted with Windsor is pretty much nonexistent, like it or not. With Canada dropping a ton of coin on the 2010 games in Vancouver, they're not going to drop more coin on Windsor in 16 or 20. | ||
7milekid Member Username: 7milekid Post Number: 14 Registered: 01-2006 Posted From: 68.41.222.28 |
Why does everyone insist on including Windsor as part of an olympic bid for Detroit. Yes including Windsor would technically make it an international games, but as others have said the situation of the mass amounts of people trying to cross the border would create huge headaches not to mention a terrorist attack waiting to happen. Also lets not forget that such an arrangement would not only require an agreement between Detroit leadership and Windsor, but also between the U.S. and Canada. This may not sound like an obstacle but when you start throwing out how the money will be distributed, who would pay for what etc. im sure it would become a nightmare. Detroit's leadership cant even get along or agree upon anything with the cities in our own state let alone another country. On top of all that, what does Windsor really even have to offer as an enhancement to the games or the event as a whole. If im not mistaken they dont have any type of large veneues available to hold any events. They have a small casino, which Detroit will have three much larger along with brandnew hotels by the time 2016 rolls around. Windsor has some hotels as well, but im pretty sure that Warren, Sterling Heights, and centerline do as well. If Detroit is gonna do this, it needs to do it alone. Maybe that way it will get some of the respect it deserves. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 36 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.40.65.66 |
those are just preliminary visits...I dont think it excludes us from bidding | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1634 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 69.213.80.6 |
Hmm... Okay, I did not know that. It would definately pose some challenges if they're that far along and we haven't gotten the proverbial ball rolling. Apbest is correct that this wouldn't exclude us from bidding. However, we would be so far behind the others that it might be best for us to concentrate on the 2020 Games.
Why? For starters, the Olympics are such a mind bogglingly huge event that very few cities can seriously contemplate hosting them on their own. The Olympics, after all, are the only event that can make the Super Bowl seem like a small-time affair. Atlanta, for example, actually had some of the events as far away as Washington, DC in 1996. As far as the concern about terrorism goes, every Olympics since Munich has worried about it. Detroit is one of the few cities that have built the security infrastructure to respond to it and they were put to the test during SBXL. One of the reasons why I always mention building a Detroit-Windsor gandolla is that it actually stregthens our border security. A person simply can't carry as much stuff with them in one of those things as they can in a car. Plus, you have to get out of a vehicle in order to board one of them. This makes it easier for security personnel to inspect everyone and harder for someone to sneak into the country (in the trunk of a car, for example). | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 357 Registered: 09-2005 Posted From: 198.103.184.76 |
If Detroit were to host the Olympics Windsor would be involved somehow. Windsor might as well be an official host so that the planning committee can tap into Canadian funding for the games. A Detroit-Windsor gondola would enhance security and facilitate travellers across the river. Passenger-only ferries can also accomplish this. During a large event such as the Olympics it only makes sense to increase temporary border capacity. A gondola could be a lasting monument to the games -- so could a Detroit-Windsor ferry system that can move people towards a Detroit rapid transit system. Windsor's contribution could be the building of the Olympic stadium in Windsor (although the stadium would need to be capable of being scaled down after the games). The Olympic village for the Windsor events (track and field) would be built on the Windsor side so that athletes who compete in Windsor would stay in Windsor (thus eliminating border concerns for athletes). | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 37 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 68.40.65.66 |
If we dont get a 2016 olympics theres literally no way 2020 would be an option. In the global scope they would not let two midwestern cities host them back to back. the US would not host after 2016 for a few olympics | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 359 Registered: 09-2005 Posted From: 198.103.184.76 |
If the 2016 summer games are in the United States (no Canadian city will be bidding), then the 2020 games will not be in North America. If the 2016 games are not awarded to an American city then the 2020 will certainly be awarded to an American city. The unwritten convention is that the US gets the summer games every 20 years (at least). 2016 would be 20 years from Atlanta. That does not mean that 2016 is a lock for the US, but it means that 2016 or 2020 are a lock. The US will not host back to back games. If the US gets 2016, the earliest the US will get a summer games will probably be 2028 or 2032. | ||
The_aram Member Username: The_aram Post Number: 4866 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.41.124.8 |
Apbest, who's to say that it's a guarantee that the United States would be host to the 2016 games? The finalists being discussed on the short list are merely for the USOC's official bid for the games. It's not a foregone conclusion that one of the American cities competing for the American bid would get it. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 647 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 69.242.223.42 |
So, then it's decided. Detroit shouldn't submit any bid before the 2024 Games. And until its hell freezes over, there won't be any Winter Games, either. Now, some serious thought on this forum can be directed to keeping the city solvent for the next year or two, bringing in some serious, realizable employment positions, and educating its citizenry... | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 2079 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.6.193 |
How about Detroit's Belle Isle and Windsor's Peach Island for the Olympics? Fill in the Belle Isle Lagoon and use that end of the island as well as all of nearby Peach Island. Granted the shipping channels are between the two, but put the gondola's between them. Windsor would have to build a bridge to Peach Island though, but since the shipping channel doesn't run between Peach Island and the Canadian mainland, the bridge can be low like Belle Isle's MacArthur Bridge. And leave the western 2/3 of Belle Isle as parkland. | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 558 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.240.205.61 |
Just bring in another event that would light up downtown like they did for the super bowl. That was incredible, the spotlights from the Fox and on top of the Rencen were out of this world. Crowds are cool too and the MWB brought in truckloads of people, but the skyline being brought to life by light is something I'll never forget. |
