  Alexei289 Member Username: Alexei289 Post Number: 1073 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.183.223 |
In relation to a thread I posted 2 days ago, several posters wanted to point out that we have an abundance of affordable housing... Well i wanted to point out that we did make the list... http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/84 86137/ Kinda sad when you think of it, that the Detroit area is thrown in a category, that, Minus Peoria ILL and Columbia SC, pretty much are old fart rust belt towns... Is that what we want and are satisfied with? Another question to ask, is it possible to be a decent place to live, with lots of nightlife, entertainment, charm, character, and beauty (the architecture of Detroit is nothing short of gawdy... unlike other rust belt towns, I kinda like it that way)... while still being affordable? To me, on the other list, it seems like you cant have it both ways... Maybe Detroit could be the difference since it has WAY more single family housing stock than just about anywhere else... way more than it needs... PLUS vacant land.. | ||
Rberlin Member Username: Rberlin Post Number: 445 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 65.43.45.201 |
Are these just the cities themselves, or metro regions? | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 56 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 209.220.229.254 |
Peoria is very much an old fart rust belt town. | ||
Alexei289 Member Username: Alexei289 Post Number: 1075 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.183.223 |
so i guess even scratch that off the list... | ||
Smogboy Member Username: Smogboy Post Number: 2068 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 69.47.100.44 |
It's almost an unfair comparison. I've always considered Detroit a region more so than just the city itself. | ||
1honey Member Username: 1honey Post Number: 115 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 208.39.170.90 |
Detroit has alot of affordable homes here. But, you better beware of some of the areas. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 57 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 209.220.229.254 |
Detroit was the only city on the "affordable" list that didn't require a state afterwards so people knew where it was, notice that? Haha. | ||
Johnnny5 Member Username: Johnnny5 Post Number: 190 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 71.227.95.4 |
The top of the list says "Metro area" so I'm assuming they're including the suburbs of Detroit as well as the city. | ||
Naturalsister Member Username: Naturalsister Post Number: 543 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 69.212.45.176 |
Of course, Regardless of our loss of population over the last 50 years, we are still a major city in America. later - naturalsister | ||
Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 440 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 69.215.30.34 |
Detroit is often grouped together with Dearborn and Livonia. Studies and surveys related to real estate have traditionally lumped Detroit-Dearborn-Livonia together as a sampling unit so it certainly is more than just the city of Detroit itself. | ||
Dhugger Member Username: Dhugger Post Number: 40 Registered: 03-2005 Posted From: 66.167.58.14 |
Wow! 5 on the list are from Michigan then the least affordable 19 out of 20 in California. I would like the specificaitons on how MSN/NBC arrived at these figures. I know when ever my friends from Europe came to stay with me in my homes in Detroit & Highland Park they would always be amazed at the quality & square footage for the price. | ||
Tomoh Member Username: Tomoh Post Number: 106 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.40.205.183 |
To answer the question, I don't think being on either list necessitates inclusion or lack of that list of attributes. Being that we're such a large region, we do have quite a bit more nightlife and entertainment and all else than all those other cities on the "affordable" list (consider how many people from Toledo come to Ann Arbor or Detroit for fun). OTOH, while most of the Californian cities on the unaffordable list are within driving distance of SF, LA, or San Diego, what about Sacremento? Not exactly known for its nightlife despite being just under San Francisco for affordability. At this point, nightlife in Detroit could improve drastically via increased suburban tourism, and this wouldn't require anyone to move, no change in affordability in the city or metro. It's a sad list of cities except that affordability is not necessarily a bad thing. Do we really want to be Phoenix? | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 557 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 68.2.191.57 |
Phoenix sux. Take my word on it. LOL I should amend that to be more serious. Most Phoenicians like Phoenix but I think native Michiganders are likely to be disappointed by Phoenix. Michigan has a much deeper history, a cultural mythos that is displaced by a void in Phoenix. YMMV (Message edited by Jimaz on March 24, 2006) | ||
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936 Post Number: 395 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 207.200.116.139 |
Jimaz posts wise words. While I love the weather in my adopted home city of (Metro) Las Vegas, I deeply miss the historic roots of Detroit and Michigan. There practically was no history here until 1905 except for some Spanish travellers, bands of Paiutes, and Mormon exploration for minerals. And ya think Detroit has "tear that schitt down" problems? A building gets to be twenty years old out here and they blow the sucker up......  | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 560 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 68.2.191.57 |
Thanks Ray. We're of like minds. | ||
Elascu Member Username: Elascu Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 70.176.203.26 |
I moved from Detroit to Mesa, Arizona a year ago and I haven't regretted the loss of Detroit's historic ambiance for one minute. Don't get me wrong, I was born and raised in Detroit, all my friends and relatives are there; and, I love my memories of Detroit "before the Coleman Young era." Detroit today has only 1/100th the grandeur and grace of the 50's and 60's. I had learned long ago to hide my cigarettes and jewelry when out on the town; and, to be suspicious of "friendly" gestures. Dressing down was the hardest part. But, how else could I avoid giving the impression that I had money. It doesn't take long to figure out which cars to buy, I you don't want rhem stolen. But, still, I hung in there; and would be there today, had it not been for my doctor telling me that I needed lots of sunshine to cure a neurological problem. Mesa has been a great change. Municipal services functioning at optimal levels. Streets so clean you're wary of throwing a gum wrapper out in the street. song birds usher in another consistently sunny day and the air smells like magnolias. I have been here a year now and have yet to be approached for a handout. I don't have to hide my cigarettes here and I dress according to the way I feel when I get up in the morning. The supermarkets all have greeters at the front door. Everybody is always hiring and drugstore cashiers pay more attention to me than their cellphones. Each morning, I throw open my blinds and say "YES, I love this place!" Oh I forgot to mention that I was paying $319 mo. for a subsidized apartment in Highland Park. Here, I don't have subsidized housing, but my rent is still only $410 mo. for a whole lot more space and amenities. My utilities are 50% less even though I run the A/C 24/7. Checking accounts here are all free( no statement charges); and, banks reimburse you for ATM fees charged by other banks. This must be an Arizona law, because Comerica stopped charging me statement fees as soon as I changed my address. Most people that I meet here are friendly and polite. You know, like people are supposed to be. Winter weather here is unbelievably beautiful. Summer, between may and October, is unbearably and repressively hot. We call that period "HELL" and that's when we do whatever outdoor things in the early morning or after dark. During the day, we hang out wherever there is A/C, which is just about everywhere. Even buses have excellent A/C and run on time to the minute. What I do miss about Detroit is the fluffy, white deep snow that we kids used to burrow underneath in the 40's. It doesn't even snow like that anymore; and Detroit Parks and Recreation no longer maintains the vacant lot Ice skating rinks. There's no more auarium or zoo and they kill people at Belle Isle while the Detroit masochists bemoan their fate. | ||
Jjw Member Username: Jjw Post Number: 63 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 68.33.56.156 |
hehehe--doc told ya to move for your health and you did so you don't have to hide your cigarettes?????????? | ||
Tomoh Member Username: Tomoh Post Number: 109 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.40.205.183 |
I love sunshine too, although I'm not sure I have any diagnosable health condition. I used to live in Dallas which is probably as sunny but not quite as hot as Mesa, so I know how unbearably hot it can be from May to October even if it's air conditioned inside everywhere (not that climate control is a foreign concept in these northern parts). It makes the sun a bit harder to enjoy though. Many of the things you mentioned, though, I think you can find in any suburb (Detroit's or any city's). Just that we can't import sun and warm weather. I do believe there are artificial lamps that mimic sunlight though. | ||
Ray Member Username: Ray Post Number: 655 Registered: 06-2004 Posted From: 68.42.220.37 |
Our Detroit area homes are about to get even more affordable. <-- Watching home equity evaporate, but didn't want to retire before age 75 anyway. | ||
Ray Member Username: Ray Post Number: 656 Registered: 06-2004 Posted From: 68.42.220.37 |
The nice thing about expensive housing markets like CA is that it forces people buy smaller homes in higher density. This is ecologically more responsible: Less materials, less land, easier to provide mass transportation, less lawns (and accompanying pestacide and fertilizer pollution), lower energy consumption for HVAC. | ||
Cheddar_bob Member Username: Cheddar_bob Post Number: 511 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 204.128.192.5 |
Delusions of grandeur, I'm guessing? I wasn't aware that we couldn't dress how we wanted here. I've never had a problem wearing what I wanted, but then again I've never been paranoid enough to believe that everybody was looking at me. The streets were so clean that you were wary of tossing out a gum wrapper, huh? God forbid the cleanliness of the streets should be your indication of whether to litter or not. "Hmmmmm, I really want to litter here, but the streets are soooo clean. It almost doesn't seem right. Oh, well". | ||
Jiminnm Member Username: Jiminnm Post Number: 363 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 68.35.85.184 |
Ray, you should have moved a little east and south to New Mexico. I'll match our sunshine against that in Vegas, and we don't have the same summer heat. We've had a human presence here for more than 10,000 years, and the Spanish first arrived in 1540 (although most left after 7-8 years and real Spanish settlers arrived in the 1590s and stayed). | ||
Alexei289 Member Username: Alexei289 Post Number: 1077 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.183.223 |
... I wouldnt mind working and living in another state for a few months out of the winter... Yes i do love Detroit... but I do love myself as well... And simply the money isnt here nor the weather, nor the mentality to make a great metropolis. I plan to help in the change, but only god himself can change the weather. If it snowed alot, it wouldnt bother me, but rain and clouds dont do it for me  ... Things will change one day, Im sure, cause I want to help that change, but in the meantime, things are what they are. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 566 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 68.2.191.57 |
Alexei289, did you read Elascu's post above? It offers a good counterpoint to my opinion of the Phoenix valley. For the purposes of your business prospects, Phoenix is well worth investigating. There's no doubt it's pro-business, pro-development there. I'd disagree with the "clean streets" assessment but maybe Mesa is cleaner than Phoenix. The scent of orange blossoms is absolutely magical. Er, but that's not business. Pro-development is. Check it out. I still prefer Detroit, but different strokes for different folks. There's a different scent in Metro Detroit that's equally magical. (No garbage jokes!) I need to identify that flower! | ||
Tomoh Member Username: Tomoh Post Number: 110 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.40.205.183 |
Re: Phoenix, here's an interesting article I came across about Phoenix's heat island, how the temperature stays hot late into the evening and that the temperature has been getting hotter over the years as development increased. "Of course, it was 10:30 p.m., and it seemed strange that the temperature was still above 100 degrees. "When we moved here, we were surrounded by gravel roads, which didn't absorb the heat like cement does," said Walter Heater, who moved from Michigan to Tempe 22 years ago." http://www.azcentral.com/weath er/monsoon/articles/0611heatis land.html (PS Can someone tell me how to quote text on here?) |
