Discuss Detroit » Archives - Beginning January 2006 » The end of the Cadieux Cafe? « Previous Next »
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 6187
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.251.24
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20051209/NEW S06/512090369

BILL MCGRAW JOURNAL: Belgian outpost awaits buyer
Patrons of east side café are worried about possible sale
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Gravitymachine
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Username: Gravitymachine

Post Number: 683
Registered: 05-2005
Posted From: 198.208.159.18
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

dear god i hope not...
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Vas
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Username: Vas

Post Number: 460
Registered: 01-2004
Posted From: 69.246.29.72
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

tough times seem to be everywhere
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Bob
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Username: Bob

Post Number: 716
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 152.163.100.195
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 4:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Someone needs to save this place.....I love it because they have Blue Moon on draft.
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Oldredfordette
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Username: Oldredfordette

Post Number: 394
Registered: 02-2004
Posted From: 68.61.98.175
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 4:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Blue Moon - ugh! It's Coors!

I can't stand to think of the Cadieux gone.
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Psip
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Username: Psip

Post Number: 622
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 4:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Feather bowling at the Cadieux Cafe
WSU
Bowling
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 1594
Registered: 08-2004
Posted From: 4.229.72.46
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I grew up in that once Belgian community wedged between East English Village and the Grosse Pointes/Harper Woods. As a kid growing up in the 1960's I remember seeing many pigeon coops in peoples back yards. I remember the tacky lawn ornamentation (anyone living near Lodewyck & Linville should check out the Belgian house on the southwest corner of that intersection).

And I remember the Flemish/Walloon family names of neighbors and schoolmates.... Van Den Bussche, Sintebin, Van Den Storm, Guns, Theiron, Bushbakker...

Unfortunately most of the Belgians have long since died off or moved away.
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Bongman
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Username: Bongman

Post Number: 881
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 198.111.56.128
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Grew up one block over...That place is an institution in that neighborhood. It still looks packed every time I go by there if parking is any judge. Church at St. Philomena's and rabbit & muscles for dinner.
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Bob
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Username: Bob

Post Number: 717
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 152.163.100.195
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ever tried to book a feather bowling lane? It's quite a chore. Always packed when I have been there.
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Gildas
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Username: Gildas

Post Number: 294
Registered: 12-2004
Posted From: 147.240.236.8
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Why not get some investors together, incorporate and go in on the place?
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Marcnbyr
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Username: Marcnbyr

Post Number: 612
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.13.13
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It seems like some people aren't reading the article...the place isn't closing, just up for sale.

"The possible sale is an emotional issue for the family, said Misuraca, 41. He politely declined to discuss details, other than to say BUSINESS REMAINS GOOD. He said he and DeVos, 47, want to do something new with their lives."

I understand that new ownership has the potential to bring in a lot of changes, but one would think that whoever they are would be able to recognize a good thing when they see it. If it ain't broke, why fix it?
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Rrl
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Username: Rrl

Post Number: 415
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 70.58.219.220
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The place could use a little sprucing up though. Not talking major changes, just a good scrub down and polishing.
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Rrl
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Username: Rrl

Post Number: 416
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 70.58.219.220
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 6:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wonder what the asking price is?

If they're like most other bar owners, it's way overpriced. It's tough not to feel love for such a Detroit original though.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 6193
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.251.24
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 6:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Marc-you are probably right but they need to find a buyer.

When places look for a player due to the owner pursuing other intersts it isn;t a guarantee that it will stay open.
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_sj_
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Username: _sj_

Post Number: 1138
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 69.220.230.150
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 6:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

If they're like most other bar owners, it's way overpriced.




What do you consider over/under/right price
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Alexei289
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Username: Alexei289

Post Number: 899
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.61.183.223
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 10:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I grew up in that once Belgian community wedged between East English Village and the Grosse Pointes/Harper Woods. As a kid growing up in the 1960's I remember seeing many pigeon coops in peoples back yards. I remember the tacky lawn ornamentation (anyone living near Lodewyck & Linville should check out the Belgian house on the southwest corner of that intersection).

"And I remember the Flemish/Walloon family names of neighbors and schoolmates.... Van Den Bussche, Sintebin, Van Den Storm, Guns, Theiron, Bushbakker...

Unfortunately most of the Belgians have long since died off or moved away."


I grew up there until I was 5... off Radnor just south of Chandler park....

Grandparents were some pretty tacky people... no doubt... I miss em.. with all their Cookoo Clocks and bird houses.... The DeHenau name lives on :-)...
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Psip
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Username: Psip

Post Number: 623
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 10:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroit; Restaurants; Cafe Cadieux
Belgian patrons:
--Victor Droz, Amile Vander Kerkhove & Walter Krasman (L to R) banding pigeons

WSU
Pigons
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 1596
Registered: 08-2004
Posted From: 4.229.81.98
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 11:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't think the writer of the article understands the Flemish/Walloon situation. Half of all Belgians are Flems, half Walloons. Saying some speak French kinda doesn't quite explain it right.

Reading about the old owner who died of a lung affliction related to pigeons..... Deja vu.... Bird Flu!

I grew up on Marseilles between Chandler Park Dr. and Chester Rd. (3 streets over from Radnor).

(Message edited by gistok on December 09, 2005)
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Freepy
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Username: Freepy

Post Number: 5
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 69.112.57.164
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 11:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Anybody half serious about buying the place? Start a list of intersted parties to mull it over. Like the Vinton building, maybe some plan can be pulled together...
I will be moving to Detroit soon with five years under my belt working at one of New York's older bars, but I wouldn't want to own the whole thing.
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Bobj
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Username: Bobj

Post Number: 263
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 68.40.89.238
Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 1:20 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The place is a good business, whoever buys it, I hope they keep similar to what it is.
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Alexei289
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Username: Alexei289

Post Number: 900
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.61.183.223
Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 1:53 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If they perhaps added a little bit more to it, and marketed it a little better, it could become quite the spot... but for now just the loyal customer base it has is pretty damn good. I just think the place could use a once over... Its definatly an older joint...
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Smogboy
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Username: Smogboy

Post Number: 1458
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.84.183.189
Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 4:40 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I absolutely love this place. I take out of towners there to show them some of this sub-culture that Detroit's got and they are amazed by it. Is it the ritziest place I can take them to in town? No, but it's got character and it might have a few rough spots in its veneer and I hope whoever takes it over will keep some of its kinks. I agree with Rrl- just a good swabbing over will do it just fine. Keep its slightly dank feel. Keep the trough in the men's bathroom. It should have an older tavern like feel to it and not so glossy.

So my appeal is to whoever takes it over... PLEASE keep the charm and character that it's ahd over the years. Besides if rumor has it to be true, isn't the Cadieux Cafe haunted as well? Keep the spirits there happy too.
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 3555
Registered: 02-2004
Posted From: 207.74.111.23
Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 8:58 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If the next generation of ethnic white-folks gone the suburbantopia, gone forever are their way of life. A Dieu, Cadieux Cafe. What's the next generation are going to do without the long time hangout As the Detroit neighborhood has gone to the black folks?
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Ilovedetroit
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Username: Ilovedetroit

Post Number: 1819
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 63.149.5.130
Posted on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:39 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have lots of friends who live in EEV area and the area across the street Balduck Park - the area is still very diverse racially. Cadieux Cafe probably draws more suburbanites that Detroiters anyway.
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Michigansheik
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Username: Michigansheik

Post Number: 48
Registered: 09-2005
Posted From: 69.242.215.232
Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 2:31 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's a great place, I just hope the new owners don't touch the largest men's room ever!
Did some f-bowling a few weeks ago with some co-workers who never go in Detroit, they're in love.
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Smogboy
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Username: Smogboy

Post Number: 1469
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.84.183.189
Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This place is a local treasure and deserves to be saved! I'm sure for the area, it's been an establishment and even for those of us who don't live that close, it's a great destination.

And just for you, Michigansheik...

Cadieux trough

(Message edited by smogboy on December 13, 2005)
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Jeppy
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Username: Jeppy

Post Number: 4
Registered: 10-2005
Posted From: 69.212.254.40
Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 10:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

a good friend of mine, and a major investor is seriously looking to purchase the Cadieux Cafe. He has every intention to keep it EXACTLY as is. He's met with the owner, made preliminary tours. It looks VERY good.
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Smogboy
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Username: Smogboy

Post Number: 1470
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.84.183.189
Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:00 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We'll keep our fingers crossed for your investor friend then Jeppy-- ESPECIALLY if he plans on keeping the same look & feel of the place (with maybe some elbow grease to clean the place up a touch). Let us know how it goes.
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Jeppy
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Username: Jeppy

Post Number: 5
Registered: 10-2005
Posted From: 69.212.254.40
Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 8:43 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Clean up? He likes the dirt! But seriously... He doesn't want to ruin a good thing, and he's very traditional too.
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Dream
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Username: Dream

Post Number: 110
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 65.143.135.237
Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great news Jeppy!
Good luck to your friend.
The Cadieux Café is a great place with tremendous charm and local history.

Rrl,

Asking price for the business, building and liquor license is $525k.
Built in 1929 the 6,000 square foot building can seat 125 happy patrons and lots of beer.
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_sj_
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Username: _sj_

Post Number: 1141
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 69.220.230.150
Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I must admit 525k appears to be a little a high.
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Eastside
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Username: Eastside

Post Number: 734
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 68.42.170.57
Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

...way high.
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Jfried
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Username: Jfried

Post Number: 696
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 209.131.7.190
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 1:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

no. that is fair asking price.
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_sj_
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Username: _sj_

Post Number: 1145
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 69.220.230.150
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 1:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

fair compared to what, so me another establishment in that area that would sell for that money.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 6218
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.251.23
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 2:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Show me another establishment in that area that does that kind of business.

Businesses are not like housing where all things are typically equal in one area. CC has a long, established clientele and the revenue numbers to justify the cost.
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Alexei289
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Username: Alexei289

Post Number: 909
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.61.183.223
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 2:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

... 500 million isnt jack squat... remember, your also paying for the clientelle, the name, and the liquor liscence to go with it... along with the business, the beer taps, the trained workforce... ect.

Go figure out how much it would cost to open up a gas station... it would be atleast twice that... and they are fukin all over the place...
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Jfried
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Username: Jfried

Post Number: 697
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 209.131.7.190
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 2:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"fair asking price" doesn't mean that's what it will sell for.

anyway, how much do you think a 6,000 sq. ft building goes for? then add what Jt1 pointed out. we're talking a very well known, successful, unique business.
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_sj_
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Username: _sj_

Post Number: 1147
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 69.220.230.150
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 3:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Considering the area and the other bars in the area I would say between 300-425k sounds about right to me.
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Krawlspace
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Username: Krawlspace

Post Number: 218
Registered: 04-2004
Posted From: 69.47.77.195
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 3:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The liquor license alone is $250,000 with Sunday sales and cabaret. Add to that the building AND the lot/park to the north which is also part of the property, the equipment and fixtures in the bar, (a three compartment sink to code is damn near $1000) and an existing good business with a history, established name, and clientèle. The place is turn-key. Look up some commercial bars for sale in Detroit and you'll be amazed the asking prices. Jacobys is 4000 sq ft and asking $995,000, Dunlevyz is 9500 sq ft asking $850,000.
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Eastside
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Username: Eastside

Post Number: 735
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 68.42.170.57
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 3:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Those places are downtown...a liquor license has more value.
Anybody would get out of the business if the price were right. $525k is a fair price to throw out to see if they get a bite...I just dont see them getting a nibble.
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Krawlspace
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Username: Krawlspace

Post Number: 219
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Posted From: 69.47.77.195
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The vast majority of liquor licenses are not tied to the building and are transferable. So one could buy the Cadieux, close it, and open a new bar downtown on the same license. The value of the license is most related to how many are available in the city. For instance, Royal Oak has a cap on how many licenses are available. So a potential business owner has to wait until one becomes available through sale or forfeit back to the state. A license in RO is worth around $450,000 because of this. Some cities put restrictions on licensed establishments, others don't. Detroit does not. So a Detroit license has substantially less value due to their easy availability.
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Eastside
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Username: Eastside

Post Number: 738
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 68.42.170.57
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You're right, I should not have written it that way...I knew somebody would clarify.
The owners have overvalued the concern, they wont get anywhere near what they think it's worth.
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Jams
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Username: Jams

Post Number: 2371
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.79.88.187
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Actually, Detroit licenses are becoming much tougher to acquire. Many places put their licenses in escrow after they closed their places.

A few years back the rules were changed to no longer allow licenses not attached to specific establishments to remain in escrow. This was done to limit the number of licenses available due to the decrease in population of the City.

BTW I don't think the price is out of line by any means, and I've been looking at quite a few places over the last couple of years. That place has a great reputation and longevity, if it were me, I'd keep it the same and make changes as they were needed.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 6223
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.251.23
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would turn it into a dance club with only 80s music.

Either that or a techno club with extremely loud music, cover and over priced drinks.
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_sj_
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Username: _sj_

Post Number: 1148
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 69.220.230.150
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 8:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroit is actually over by 164 license last time I checked, 1 license per every 3000 residents.

No matter the tradition or the culture I still think they are about 100k to high.
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Rijobo
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Username: Rijobo

Post Number: 7
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 68.21.46.79
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 8:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Could somebody please put some ice cubes in the troth. Thank you
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Jams
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Username: Jams

Post Number: 2381
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 64.148.230.159
Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I only know of one place in Detroit that was offered more than the asking price in the last couple of years.

Asking price is one thing, what is accepted is another. I don't find CC's asking price out of line.

Would I offer them less?......Damn right, Skippy. It's called business, ask for more than you think what you can get and hopefully you'll get more than you would have accepted.

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