Jt1 Member Username: Jt1
Post Number: 6187 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.208.251.24
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:01 pm: | |
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20051209/NEW S06/512090369 BILL MCGRAW JOURNAL: Belgian outpost awaits buyer Patrons of east side café are worried about possible sale |
Gravitymachine Member Username: Gravitymachine
Post Number: 683 Registered: 05-2005 Posted From: 198.208.159.18
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:11 pm: | |
dear god i hope not... |
Vas Member Username: Vas
Post Number: 460 Registered: 01-2004 Posted From: 69.246.29.72
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:13 pm: | |
tough times seem to be everywhere |
Bob Member Username: Bob
Post Number: 716 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 4:44 pm: | |
Someone needs to save this place.....I love it because they have Blue Moon on draft. |
Oldredfordette Member Username: Oldredfordette
Post Number: 394 Registered: 02-2004 Posted From: 68.61.98.175
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 4:54 pm: | |
Blue Moon - ugh! It's Coors! I can't stand to think of the Cadieux gone. |
Psip Member Username: Psip
Post Number: 622 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 69.246.13.131
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 4:57 pm: | |
Feather bowling at the Cadieux Cafe WSU
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Gistok Member Username: Gistok
Post Number: 1594 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.72.46
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:02 pm: | |
I grew up in that once Belgian community wedged between East English Village and the Grosse Pointes/Harper Woods. As a kid growing up in the 1960's I remember seeing many pigeon coops in peoples back yards. I remember the tacky lawn ornamentation (anyone living near Lodewyck & Linville should check out the Belgian house on the southwest corner of that intersection). And I remember the Flemish/Walloon family names of neighbors and schoolmates.... Van Den Bussche, Sintebin, Van Den Storm, Guns, Theiron, Bushbakker... Unfortunately most of the Belgians have long since died off or moved away. |
Bongman Member Username: Bongman
Post Number: 881 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 198.111.56.128
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:05 pm: | |
Grew up one block over...That place is an institution in that neighborhood. It still looks packed every time I go by there if parking is any judge. Church at St. Philomena's and rabbit & muscles for dinner. |
Bob Member Username: Bob
Post Number: 717 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:09 pm: | |
Ever tried to book a feather bowling lane? It's quite a chore. Always packed when I have been there. |
Gildas Member Username: Gildas
Post Number: 294 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 147.240.236.8
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:15 pm: | |
Why not get some investors together, incorporate and go in on the place? |
Marcnbyr Member Username: Marcnbyr
Post Number: 612 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.13.13
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:52 pm: | |
It seems like some people aren't reading the article...the place isn't closing, just up for sale. "The possible sale is an emotional issue for the family, said Misuraca, 41. He politely declined to discuss details, other than to say BUSINESS REMAINS GOOD. He said he and DeVos, 47, want to do something new with their lives." I understand that new ownership has the potential to bring in a lot of changes, but one would think that whoever they are would be able to recognize a good thing when they see it. If it ain't broke, why fix it? |
Rrl Member Username: Rrl
Post Number: 415 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.58.219.220
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 5:57 pm: | |
The place could use a little sprucing up though. Not talking major changes, just a good scrub down and polishing. |
Rrl Member Username: Rrl
Post Number: 416 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.58.219.220
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 6:04 pm: | |
Wonder what the asking price is? If they're like most other bar owners, it's way overpriced. It's tough not to feel love for such a Detroit original though. |
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1
Post Number: 6193 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.208.251.24
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 6:27 pm: | |
Marc-you are probably right but they need to find a buyer. When places look for a player due to the owner pursuing other intersts it isn;t a guarantee that it will stay open. |
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_
Post Number: 1138 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 69.220.230.150
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 6:48 pm: | |
quote:If they're like most other bar owners, it's way overpriced.
What do you consider over/under/right price |
Alexei289 Member Username: Alexei289
Post Number: 899 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.183.223
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 10:09 pm: | |
I grew up in that once Belgian community wedged between East English Village and the Grosse Pointes/Harper Woods. As a kid growing up in the 1960's I remember seeing many pigeon coops in peoples back yards. I remember the tacky lawn ornamentation (anyone living near Lodewyck & Linville should check out the Belgian house on the southwest corner of that intersection). "And I remember the Flemish/Walloon family names of neighbors and schoolmates.... Van Den Bussche, Sintebin, Van Den Storm, Guns, Theiron, Bushbakker... Unfortunately most of the Belgians have long since died off or moved away." I grew up there until I was 5... off Radnor just south of Chandler park.... Grandparents were some pretty tacky people... no doubt... I miss em.. with all their Cookoo Clocks and bird houses.... The DeHenau name lives on ... |
Psip Member Username: Psip
Post Number: 623 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 69.246.13.131
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 10:22 pm: | |
Detroit; Restaurants; Cafe Cadieux Belgian patrons: --Victor Droz, Amile Vander Kerkhove & Walter Krasman (L to R) banding pigeons WSU
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Gistok Member Username: Gistok
Post Number: 1596 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.81.98
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 11:27 pm: | |
I don't think the writer of the article understands the Flemish/Walloon situation. Half of all Belgians are Flems, half Walloons. Saying some speak French kinda doesn't quite explain it right. Reading about the old owner who died of a lung affliction related to pigeons..... Deja vu.... Bird Flu! I grew up on Marseilles between Chandler Park Dr. and Chester Rd. (3 streets over from Radnor). (Message edited by gistok on December 09, 2005) |
Freepy Member Username: Freepy
Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 69.112.57.164
| Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 11:58 pm: | |
Anybody half serious about buying the place? Start a list of intersted parties to mull it over. Like the Vinton building, maybe some plan can be pulled together... I will be moving to Detroit soon with five years under my belt working at one of New York's older bars, but I wouldn't want to own the whole thing. |
Bobj Member Username: Bobj
Post Number: 263 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.40.89.238
| Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 1:20 am: | |
The place is a good business, whoever buys it, I hope they keep similar to what it is. |
Alexei289 Member Username: Alexei289
Post Number: 900 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.183.223
| Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 1:53 am: | |
If they perhaps added a little bit more to it, and marketed it a little better, it could become quite the spot... but for now just the loyal customer base it has is pretty damn good. I just think the place could use a once over... Its definatly an older joint... |
Smogboy Member Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 1458 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.84.183.189
| Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 4:40 am: | |
I absolutely love this place. I take out of towners there to show them some of this sub-culture that Detroit's got and they are amazed by it. Is it the ritziest place I can take them to in town? No, but it's got character and it might have a few rough spots in its veneer and I hope whoever takes it over will keep some of its kinks. I agree with Rrl- just a good swabbing over will do it just fine. Keep its slightly dank feel. Keep the trough in the men's bathroom. It should have an older tavern like feel to it and not so glossy. So my appeal is to whoever takes it over... PLEASE keep the charm and character that it's ahd over the years. Besides if rumor has it to be true, isn't the Cadieux Cafe haunted as well? Keep the spirits there happy too. |
Danny Member Username: Danny
Post Number: 3555 Registered: 02-2004 Posted From: 207.74.111.23
| Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 8:58 am: | |
If the next generation of ethnic white-folks gone the suburbantopia, gone forever are their way of life. A Dieu, Cadieux Cafe. What's the next generation are going to do without the long time hangout As the Detroit neighborhood has gone to the black folks? |
Ilovedetroit Member Username: Ilovedetroit
Post Number: 1819 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 63.149.5.130
| Posted on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:39 am: | |
I have lots of friends who live in EEV area and the area across the street Balduck Park - the area is still very diverse racially. Cadieux Cafe probably draws more suburbanites that Detroiters anyway. |
Michigansheik Member Username: Michigansheik
Post Number: 48 Registered: 09-2005 Posted From: 69.242.215.232
| Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 2:31 am: | |
It's a great place, I just hope the new owners don't touch the largest men's room ever! Did some f-bowling a few weeks ago with some co-workers who never go in Detroit, they're in love. |
Smogboy Member Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 1469 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.84.183.189
| Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:45 pm: | |
This place is a local treasure and deserves to be saved! I'm sure for the area, it's been an establishment and even for those of us who don't live that close, it's a great destination. And just for you, Michigansheik... (Message edited by smogboy on December 13, 2005) |
Jeppy Member Username: Jeppy
Post Number: 4 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 69.212.254.40
| Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 10:56 pm: | |
a good friend of mine, and a major investor is seriously looking to purchase the Cadieux Cafe. He has every intention to keep it EXACTLY as is. He's met with the owner, made preliminary tours. It looks VERY good. |
Smogboy Member Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 1470 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.84.183.189
| Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:00 am: | |
We'll keep our fingers crossed for your investor friend then Jeppy-- ESPECIALLY if he plans on keeping the same look & feel of the place (with maybe some elbow grease to clean the place up a touch). Let us know how it goes. |
Jeppy Member Username: Jeppy
Post Number: 5 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 69.212.254.40
| Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 8:43 am: | |
Clean up? He likes the dirt! But seriously... He doesn't want to ruin a good thing, and he's very traditional too. |
Dream Member Username: Dream
Post Number: 110 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.143.135.237
| Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:24 pm: | |
Great news Jeppy! Good luck to your friend. The Cadieux Café is a great place with tremendous charm and local history. Rrl, Asking price for the business, building and liquor license is $525k. Built in 1929 the 6,000 square foot building can seat 125 happy patrons and lots of beer. |
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_
Post Number: 1141 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 69.220.230.150
| Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:33 pm: | |
I must admit 525k appears to be a little a high. |
Eastside Member Username: Eastside
Post Number: 734 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.42.170.57
| Posted on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:38 pm: | |
...way high. |
Jfried Member Username: Jfried
Post Number: 696 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 209.131.7.190
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 1:24 pm: | |
no. that is fair asking price. |
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_
Post Number: 1145 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 69.220.230.150
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 1:36 pm: | |
fair compared to what, so me another establishment in that area that would sell for that money. |
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1
Post Number: 6218 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.208.251.23
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 2:12 pm: | |
Show me another establishment in that area that does that kind of business. Businesses are not like housing where all things are typically equal in one area. CC has a long, established clientele and the revenue numbers to justify the cost. |
Alexei289 Member Username: Alexei289
Post Number: 909 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.61.183.223
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 2:31 pm: | |
... 500 million isnt jack squat... remember, your also paying for the clientelle, the name, and the liquor liscence to go with it... along with the business, the beer taps, the trained workforce... ect. Go figure out how much it would cost to open up a gas station... it would be atleast twice that... and they are fukin all over the place... |
Jfried Member Username: Jfried
Post Number: 697 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 209.131.7.190
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 2:46 pm: | |
"fair asking price" doesn't mean that's what it will sell for. anyway, how much do you think a 6,000 sq. ft building goes for? then add what Jt1 pointed out. we're talking a very well known, successful, unique business. |
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_
Post Number: 1147 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 69.220.230.150
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 3:15 pm: | |
Considering the area and the other bars in the area I would say between 300-425k sounds about right to me. |
Krawlspace Member Username: Krawlspace
Post Number: 218 Registered: 04-2004 Posted From: 69.47.77.195
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 3:16 pm: | |
The liquor license alone is $250,000 with Sunday sales and cabaret. Add to that the building AND the lot/park to the north which is also part of the property, the equipment and fixtures in the bar, (a three compartment sink to code is damn near $1000) and an existing good business with a history, established name, and clientèle. The place is turn-key. Look up some commercial bars for sale in Detroit and you'll be amazed the asking prices. Jacobys is 4000 sq ft and asking $995,000, Dunlevyz is 9500 sq ft asking $850,000. |
Eastside Member Username: Eastside
Post Number: 735 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.42.170.57
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 3:28 pm: | |
Those places are downtown...a liquor license has more value. Anybody would get out of the business if the price were right. $525k is a fair price to throw out to see if they get a bite...I just dont see them getting a nibble. |
Krawlspace Member Username: Krawlspace
Post Number: 219 Registered: 04-2004 Posted From: 69.47.77.195
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:30 pm: | |
The vast majority of liquor licenses are not tied to the building and are transferable. So one could buy the Cadieux, close it, and open a new bar downtown on the same license. The value of the license is most related to how many are available in the city. For instance, Royal Oak has a cap on how many licenses are available. So a potential business owner has to wait until one becomes available through sale or forfeit back to the state. A license in RO is worth around $450,000 because of this. Some cities put restrictions on licensed establishments, others don't. Detroit does not. So a Detroit license has substantially less value due to their easy availability. |
Eastside Member Username: Eastside
Post Number: 738 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.42.170.57
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:47 pm: | |
You're right, I should not have written it that way...I knew somebody would clarify. The owners have overvalued the concern, they wont get anywhere near what they think it's worth. |
Jams Member Username: Jams
Post Number: 2371 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.79.88.187
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:49 pm: | |
Actually, Detroit licenses are becoming much tougher to acquire. Many places put their licenses in escrow after they closed their places. A few years back the rules were changed to no longer allow licenses not attached to specific establishments to remain in escrow. This was done to limit the number of licenses available due to the decrease in population of the City. BTW I don't think the price is out of line by any means, and I've been looking at quite a few places over the last couple of years. That place has a great reputation and longevity, if it were me, I'd keep it the same and make changes as they were needed. |
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1
Post Number: 6223 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.208.251.23
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:51 pm: | |
I would turn it into a dance club with only 80s music. Either that or a techno club with extremely loud music, cover and over priced drinks. |
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_
Post Number: 1148 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 69.220.230.150
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 8:10 pm: | |
Detroit is actually over by 164 license last time I checked, 1 license per every 3000 residents. No matter the tradition or the culture I still think they are about 100k to high. |
Rijobo Member Username: Rijobo
Post Number: 7 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.21.46.79
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 8:41 pm: | |
Could somebody please put some ice cubes in the troth. Thank you |
Jams Member Username: Jams
Post Number: 2381 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 64.148.230.159
| Posted on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 9:14 pm: | |
I only know of one place in Detroit that was offered more than the asking price in the last couple of years. Asking price is one thing, what is accepted is another. I don't find CC's asking price out of line. Would I offer them less?......Damn right, Skippy. It's called business, ask for more than you think what you can get and hopefully you'll get more than you would have accepted. |