  Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1390 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
The Vinton Building redevelopment story. (And a little description as to why it's taking so long.) Some time ago (almost 3 years) the city sent out an RFP for the Vinton building. The city received more than 6 but less than 10 responses. I do not know the exact number. The city reviewed the bids and came up with 2 that they liked. One from Mr Robert Porcher and his development partners. The other from my group. My group was formed from a number of DetroitYes forumers and their friends. I will not name them, they will have to identify themselves. But, if you've been around here any length of time you probably know who they are. After reviewing the two bids the City suggested that the two groups talk to each other. Mr. Porchers group had identified a use for 4 floors of the building. The Forum based group had identified a use for 9 floors of the building. After a few months of negotiations the two groups decided thay could and would work together on the proposal. Originally Mr Porcher's group would take 3 floors the forumers would take 9. Mr Porcher withdrew his proposal and merged with the forum group. Along the way one of the forum group dropped out. Mr Porcher picked up the available floor. Mr. Porcher will be getting the first and second floors as commercial space. The rest of the building will be single floor condominiums. All of the forum members involved in the deal plan on living in the building. I expect 1 of the friends of the forum group to flip their unit. The forum members will own the top 4 floors and floors 4-7. Mr. Porcher and his partner will own the first 3 floors and the 8th floor. All members of the newly formed entity are putting in exactly the same amount of money per floor. We won the bid because we offered the most money for the building and asked for the least amount in subsidies. I guess that's enough to get started. I'll add more as time permits. | ||
Machoken Member Username: Machoken Post Number: 1066 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.86.12.2 |
Great stuff. | ||
Histeric Member Username: Histeric Post Number: 644 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.220.62.144 |
12th floor Penthouse, checking in. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 5139 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 208.27.111.125 |
The amazing part is that this was kept a secret on the forum all this time. I was sure someone was going to blab. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1391 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
I have the tenth floor. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 6174 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.208.251.23 |
Tear that schitt down!! | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 9530 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 64.118.137.228 |
I'll be the first to admit, I was the forumer who dropped out. While I'm sure I would have loved it for its location, loft living wasn't for me, I need a garage and a shop at my place to be happy. I'm looking forward to this project forging ahead, as I know it was nerve racking for all those involved, as it was for me for the short time I was pondering my involvement. I just fear it would have been biting off a bit more than I could handle. Plus, I came to a cross road where if I hesitated, I would have lost my house that I now have. | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 428 Registered: 01-2004 Posted From: 64.252.152.190 |
Kudos to all that are involved in this project. I hope to have the means to pull off similar things like this (on a smaller scale) in the near future. | ||
Machoken Member Username: Machoken Post Number: 1067 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.86.12.2 |
I'm sure this question is a bit too personal for an internet forum, but it nags at me relentlessly: how much did each forumer pony up? Articles have stated that each residential floor will be valued from $500K to $1 million. I'm willing to accept if I need to become 'tangible' before I get that question answered. | ||
Skulker Member Username: Skulker Post Number: 3244 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.103.104.93 |
Minor comments - * The Offer to Puchase package was released in January '04 not '03. * The City did not demo the building and made the preservation of the building a priority. Bids that did not contemplate the restoration of the building were rejected. Further evidence that the City "gets" it, despite sky is falling claims to contrary. | ||
Lurker Member Username: Lurker Post Number: 1512 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.196.220.198 |
Congrats to all parties involved. You guys are truly an asset to the city, and it's nice to see people put their money where their mouth is. | ||
Paul Member Username: Paul Post Number: 21 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 69.222.15.94 |
If the developers are willing to field questions from the floor: If every investor is redoing their own floor, who is responsible for the outside? Will there be/is there a condo association or a 'lead' developer to renovate the facade? It is an interesting arrangement, but seems to invite a lot of disagreement about how much to invest in common costs like the facade restoration. | ||
Dday Member Username: Dday Post Number: 780 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.209.165.170 |
Visiting-atcha!!! | ||
Eric_c Member Username: Eric_c Post Number: 541 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.76.202.10 |
What would you know about that, Lurker?  | ||
Dday Member Username: Dday Post Number: 781 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.209.165.170 |
No need to be the first.....according to what was originally posted, you were the only . | ||
Eap Member Username: Eap Post Number: 1221 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 70.230.12.29 |
Skulker, Don't go F'ing up a happy thread.... Supersport, STFU, the story Mr. Ndavies tells doesn't even contemplate your minor waffling. Don't give yourself so much credit. I wish all involved good luck. | ||
Histeric Member Username: Histeric Post Number: 645 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.220.62.144 |
Those who understand, understand. Those who don't, don't. What should be most important to other folks contemplating how they can participate in the REAL preservation of our built environment is that there is power in numbers. The forum served as an important tool to bring together like minded people (who i doubt would have known each other otherwise) who individually could never have tackled a project like the Vinton. When you combine their resources, and the 100% presold component of actually living in the building after its done, they beat out major developers for the right to develop. Go figure. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1392 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
Read valued between $500K and $1 million. We expect the apprasials for the completed units to come back in that range. The costs are running a little less than the lower number. (but not enough for my comfort yet.) Since our group is the developer and we're looking to live in the building, no profit will be realized until we sell the units. This has just become my number one retirement investment. We are also using our own sweat equity to help keep costs in line. Also, since construction hasn't started yet, the costs are still best guess projections. | ||
Skulker Member Username: Skulker Post Number: 3245 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.103.104.93 |
C'mon EAP, I'm not effing up a happy thread, I am simply reminding NDavies that while it FELT like three years, it was actually slightly less than two! | ||
Dabirch Member Username: Dabirch Post Number: 1216 Registered: 06-2004 Posted From: 208.44.117.10 |
I second itsjeff's comment -- considering the amount of people on this board that knew about the project, and the number of times the project was discussed -- the fact that the participants remained nameless is pretty freakin' cool. | ||
Histeric Member Username: Histeric Post Number: 646 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.220.62.144 |
To answer Paul's question, the members formed a development LLC with an executive board who makes all decisions during the development process. There is a managing member who facilitates the process. The development is a two step process. The first step is a complete restoration of facade, service core and common areas as well as a white box of the individual floors. Each member then has a holdback on their mortgages which allows them to customize to their hearts content. More complicated than a traditional deal? Yes. Too complicated to accomplish? Not at all. | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 9533 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 64.118.137.228 |
Truth be told, I just didn't wanna live in the same building as you dickhead. | ||
Dday Member Username: Dday Post Number: 782 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.209.165.170 |
Congratulations to all involved. I, for one, have been waiting to see this come out for some time. Well done and kudos to all! | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1393 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
OK some more. When the two groups merged they formed the Vinton Building LLC. The LLC is charged with Demo of the obsolete building infastructure. It will rehab the exterior of the building and the interior infrastructure. It will complete the building to the point where each unit can be customized with the end users finishes. When the building is transfered to the end owners the LLC will be dissolved. A condo association will be created at that point. The condo association is responsible for the exterior and common areas of the building. | ||
Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 262 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 69.215.30.34 |
Ndavies: I posted this question in the WDET thread and may well have been missed. Anyway, I am wondering if someone out there would still be interested in contributing and investing in this project, how would they contact you ? Perhaps another forum member is keen on taking over Supersports' position. | ||
Histeric Member Username: Histeric Post Number: 647 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.220.62.144 |
We are full up but I have identified a number of other buildings that I will be assembling similar teams to tackle. Now that our financing is closed and construction will begin, it is time to begin predevelopment on another. | ||
Sknutson Member Username: Sknutson Post Number: 395 Registered: 03-2004 Posted From: 67.114.23.202 |
Didn't there used to be a law library in that building? I seem to remember going there back in the early 80's. Why is the investment the same for the lower floors as for the upper floors? | ||
Rsa Member Username: Rsa Post Number: 692 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 70.225.112.69 |
darwinism; read above-robert porcher took over that floor. also, not surprisingly, all floors/partners have owners/postions filled. [believe me, i tried ] anyhoo, this is a great template to how people can band together and get things done in the future. i know all above would be happy to share info., techniques, etc. congrats to all! | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1395 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
Sorry, all space and investment oportunities in the building are spoken for. It was definitely a case of needing to be in the right place at the right time. | ||
Kazooexplorer Member Username: Kazooexplorer Post Number: 955 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 155.79.138.253 |
So we can finally talk about this!? Just wanted to say it's been tough keeping things to myself but congratulations for taking the risk of development. I'm proud to know you all. | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 35 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 68.60.133.115 |
You better get some exterior lighting going on there..... | ||
Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 263 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 69.209.140.3 |
Histeric and Ndavies: I am assuming that the both of you have stakes in the project. If there are new and similar projects, Rsa and I would be interested to participate, as expressed above. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 375 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.42.176.123 |
Me three. | ||
Detroitduo Member Username: Detroitduo Post Number: 369 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 84.156.13.172 |
Ndavies.... does this mean we may not be neighbors anymore? That makes me sad.... btw, when I'm back in a few weeks, we need to have a beer. | ||
Aiw Member Username: Aiw Post Number: 5105 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.118.93 |
Eap, if Sporty hadn't dropped out, you wouldn't have such a valuable addition to the neighborhood. | ||
Gambling_man Member Username: Gambling_man Post Number: 586 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 199.178.193.5 |
Since two of our members have "outed" themselves, I feel comfortable in outing myself. I don't know what floor I have, as the evil overlord of the Vinton Building LLC hasn't told me yet......While I think the whole idea is a great one (like to think I had something to do with it), for those of you who wish to invest, it is exactly that: An investment. You will probably have to put up a good amount of cash, and your credit to become involved in a project such as this.......as well as some degree of patience. I couldn't be more excited to do all of the above. PS, in answer to a few of the above questions, I suppose it isn't unreasonable to think that a member could sell his position in the LLC at any point?!? I'll defer the answer to some of the more knowledgeable members however...... | ||
Panson Member Username: Panson Post Number: 748 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 141.156.44.80 |
Which building is this? Does anyone have pictures? | ||
Gambling_man Member Username: Gambling_man Post Number: 587 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 199.178.193.5 |
Panson, don't make me......... | ||
The_aram Member Username: The_aram Post Number: 4529 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 141.213.175.233 |
it's been hinted at quite a bit, and I thought I had put the pieces together, but it's great to finally see the whole story see the light of day. Awesome job, guys. I look forward to seeing how this turns out. Preservation at work. Congratulations on your initiative. | ||
Ddmoore54 Member Username: Ddmoore54 Post Number: 231 Registered: 07-2004 Posted From: 69.242.220.249 |
Do you guys have a sign up on the exterior so passer-bys know the redevelopment is in the works? | ||
Michael Member Username: Michael Post Number: 682 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.248.81.205 |
Nice work to all involved. Kudos. As for SSport...
Loft living is for you, just not in a high rise situation. I believe that my building would have fit all of your criteria. Hell, you could have pulled that big block Chevy engine downstairs and used the block and tackle to hoist it upstairs through the trap door and slide it into your bed where you could make sweet, sweet love to it 'til your hearts content. Back to the Vinton, enough congratulations can not be bestowed on those involved, especially those doing the majority of the leg work. I look forward to watching the progress over the coming months and year. | ||
Matt_the_deuce Member Username: Matt_the_deuce Post Number: 402 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.14.27.204 |
Congratulations to all for making this happen. I figured out that Histeric and NDavies where involved by just paying attention on this forum, but didn't realize the scope of the partnership or the creative way in which it was structured. Great job and exactly what this city needs. I would also like to throw my name in the hat for future projects. I'm assuming I will I see you guys at the Workers Rowhouse Fundraiser tomorrow... | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 2043 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 66.167.59.189 |
What great news! Finally the cat is out the bag and we can finally talk about it. I am so proud of you folk for pulling this off and saving a valuable piece of Detroit! Detroit Rises indeed. Best wishes, backslaps and hugs all around.  | ||
Wmuchris Member Username: Wmuchris Post Number: 104 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 141.218.94.137 |
Man Alive! I can only imagine having a whole floor of that sweet sweet thing! All those windows, you better save some room in your budget for blinds, or the neighbors might get an eyeful. Congratulations guys, that place is going to be beautiful. I'd like to do the same thing with the Wurlitzer building, but I refuse to touch that thing for as much as old boy is asking for it. Any word on ground floor retail? Is Porcher using for personal space? | ||
Digitaldom Member Username: Digitaldom Post Number: 366 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 67.149.108.143 |
Is anyone willing to say what the individual investment was per person? 100K, 200k, 300K... Please tell.. I would interested if the investment was less than 200k... Can't afford anymore.. Therefore I ask are there any plans to renovate any other building in downtown not midtown but downtown in the same manor? Such as the Book tower (not completely vacant).. Whitney building.. Could you please provide details on other vacant buildings that could be jointly purchased? Such as the UA Theatre building? (owned by the Illiches I know)... I would be willing to partake in a joint venture... Please email me dmacpherson@wideopenwest.com | ||
Dan Member Username: Dan Post Number: 1155 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.47.194.247 |
“The City did not demo the building and made the preservation of the building a priority.” I am glad to see the city doing what is right. Thanks again Skulker! | ||
Digitaldom Member Username: Digitaldom Post Number: 368 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 67.149.108.143 |
This information is really news worthy... Honestly people who met on the web group together to buy a a building to preserve it... | ||
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker Post Number: 525 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 66.2.149.176 |
From a early 1930s shot looking up Woodward...  WSU/VMC | ||
Eap Member Username: Eap Post Number: 1222 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 69.212.60.58 |
I wouldn't get too carried away with the "they are saving a building" congratulatory stuff. As Ndavies said above there were other interested and well established developers competing for the opportunity to do this deal. Saving a building is when you are the only entity either willing or capable of doing the deal. However, I am by no means saying this team didn't take on significant risk. | ||
Slows Member Username: Slows Post Number: 93 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.250.202.236 |
And take on significant headaches. I think the perseverance alone by everyone involved is amazing. The obstacles faced and overcome to this point were tougher than almost any deal I've seen. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 2045 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 66.167.59.189 |
"I wouldn't get too carried away with the "they are saving a building" congratulatory stuff." Maybe... who knows. But they did it and the others didn't. That's all that counts. So excuse me while I get carried away. | ||
Psip Member Username: Psip Post Number: 614 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 69.246.13.131 |
Well,, congratulations. I still think my proposal would have attracted more excitement to the downtown area. As you are aware, I proposed to make the Vinton building a 10 floor museum to the man, the legend, the Polish Prince, Bobby Vinton | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 1587 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 4.229.150.33 |
How about a Forum Open House in a year or two? Congrats! | ||
Dday Member Username: Dday Post Number: 786 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.209.165.170 |
Is Ndavies a Bobby Vinton fan? Read in your best The Bobs voice from Office Space
| ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 432 Registered: 01-2004 Posted From: 64.252.152.190 |
Ndavies, Do you think in the near future you, and your group would want to give a mini symposium on making this kind of deal work. Some of us are interested in these kinds of project, but want to learn a little more before jumping in head first. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 5142 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 208.27.111.125 |
Come to an FSC. We've had "symposiums" on the Vinton Building for two years... | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 434 Registered: 01-2004 Posted From: 64.252.152.190 |
Cool, I'll be there as soon as I get back (hopefully begining of the year). | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 742 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 141.216.1.4 |
Dday that was Michael Bolton. | ||
Dday Member Username: Dday Post Number: 788 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 65.209.165.170 |
Yeah, I know....I took a little artistic license for effect (Message edited by D-Day on December 08, 2005) | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 743 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 141.216.1.4 |
OK all is forgiven | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 55 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 148.61.248.90 |
This is really great! It's good to hear about news like this. It's also really great as an investement since I'm sure in 10 years the prices will be alot higher than they are now. | ||
Atl_runner Member Username: Atl_runner Post Number: 1732 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.209.118.72 |
Awesome. I've been a bit Jealous since first hearing about this. It seems like a can't miss in terms of investment. Done right, this place could be THE place to own in the CBD.
obvious as it's already been stated, but creating a condo association solves all those problems. Believe me. If several hundred units can mostly agree in one building, then 12 parts can find a way to mostly agree. There will always be a small level of disagreement and associated resentment. On the same note, will the condo association be managed by an outside party? Seems like a logical thing to do. Congrats to all involved. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1396 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.212.215.89 |
We spent many months working on the Vinton Building LLC operating agreement. We made sure we knew the rules of the partnership before we started. It is part of the reason this took so long. We had to really generate three agreements. The first at the formation of the development LLC. Then one with the City for the transfer of the building. The third is the Condo operating agreement. That is still in process but almost complete. Yes, the lawyers are earning a nice little share of the outgoing cash. | ||
Atl_runner Member Username: Atl_runner Post Number: 1733 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.209.118.72 |
Are you going to rename the building? Is that even an option? Keep it for historical reasons? Lots of questions. | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 58 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 148.61.248.90 |
The Vinton-YES? | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1398 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106 |
Renaming the building was an option. We decided to retain the original name. It will receive a new sign at the top of the building. There will also be decorative lighting added to the outside of the building. The lighting is similar concept to what was added to the Kales.
I'm sure there will be plenty of parties, Knowing the group of people moving into the building. They are not the shy retiring type. (Well, everyone except me. I'm the shy one in the group.)
I'll try to answer them as best I can. Some questions, Such as what Mr. Porcher intends to do with the first floor, I cannot. | ||
Fnemecek Member Username: Fnemecek Post Number: 1331 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 69.212.59.185 |
Sounds cool. Kick ass job for everyone involved - including whoever suggested that the Forum group and the Porcher group talk to each other. | ||
Panson Member Username: Panson Post Number: 750 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.45.18.38 |
As for changing the name of the building, I was voted down on 'Casa De Panson'. I'm still pretty bitter about that. | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 437 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.240.205.61 |
maybe i missed it in an earlier post, but when will the renovation start? What is the timeline until first move-ins? The Wurlitzer does seem like a very logical choice for a Vinton building-like group collaboration and restoration. If only the damn owner weren't so greedy. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1402 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.234 |
Construction can start as soon as the demo and building permits are back from the city. We're anticipating right after the holidays. The initial construction timeline runs about 11 months from construction starting to sale of completed units to the puchasers. The Wurlitzer has some additional issues that will make it a little more difficult to do than the Vinton is. | ||
Dougw Member Username: Dougw Post Number: 908 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.248.54.29 |
Congrats to all involved! Also, this building is in a great, central location, which is even an understatment. You're right on Woodward, one block down from Campus Martius, a couple blocks up from Hart Plaza... | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 9556 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.246.37.236 |
Sounds racist to me, I'd call Fieger! Oh wait, he may be busy. LOL | ||
623kraw Member Username: 623kraw Post Number: 707 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.41.224.200 |
Kudos to all of you. This is great news. I'm just seeing this thread for the first time and wondering what is the present condition of the building? Looks to be very solid and stable. I was in the Kales Building the other day - amazing!  | ||
Panson Member Username: Panson Post Number: 751 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195 |
Aside from some minor water damage due to a broken roof drain, it's in excellent condition. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 383 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.42.176.123 |
Just out of curiousity, does anyone have any photos of the current state of the inside of the building? | ||
Michael Member Username: Michael Post Number: 684 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.74.9.120 |
just as a side note, I heard that other rejected names for the building were YayDetroit, DetroitYes and Black-atcha. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1407 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.212.215.89 |
Pictures, It's Pictures you want?    | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 59 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 148.61.248.90 |
Doesn't look too bad. Are those cubicle marks on the floor? When was this building abandoned? It'll be fun to see before and after pictures. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1409 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.212.215.89 |
It's tackless carpet strip. The pictures don't really show the amount of space there. Those windows are 4'x7'.     | ||
Panson Member Username: Panson Post Number: 752 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195 |
Actually, the windows are closer to 5'x7' (4'-10", if I remember correctly). | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 384 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 68.42.176.123 |
Thanks. Good pics. | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 62 Registered: 09-2005 Posted From: 198.103.184.76 |
Nice view of the Detroit River. | ||
Everydayislikesunday Member Username: Everydayislikesunday Post Number: 132 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 68.41.153.99 |
Kudos to all involved...im insanely jealous and, at the same time, extremely proud to be part of a community of folks who are so committed to the city. I cannot wait to see the final product. DetroitYES building warming - atcha? | ||
The_aram Member Username: The_aram Post Number: 4553 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 141.213.175.233 |
you guys are going to have so much fun with that. what a great project. those windows are awesome. looks like some fantastic views, too. | ||
Histeric Member Username: Histeric Post Number: 649 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.42.77.90 |
Regarding a name change, we didn't really consider it given the prominent role the Vinton family played in constructing most of Kahn's residential structures in IV, GP, etc. That provenance made our request for historic designation a foregone conclusion. The only remaining step is for council to act on the unanimous recomendation from Historic Designation Advisory Board. As for why the investment is the same, regardless of which floor assigned, there is a method to the madness. The top four floors are occupied by those folks (all forumer on this thread) who have put an enormous amount of time into the exec board, development team, design and construction meetings. After that, it was more or less first come (with all necessary docs), first serve. At the end of the day, it is as fair as possible and given the fact that folks are able to purchase their units for around 110.00 a square foot, while 250.00 per square is being charged across CM park, anyone who complains can KMA. For those seriously interested in the concept and more importantly, has some dough and good credit, I will be starting a thread on the connections side over the holiday break with the first meeting to take place sometime after the first of the year. In particular, I am putting a team together to tackle one of the biggies (as in thirty plus stories) so there will be considerably more memberships available in this one for both live and work. I hope to have a third of this one leaning toward office condominiums for young entreprenuers. Feel like taking a ride? As for the amount necessary to buy into a membership, think in terms of 50-100k liquid and several times that amount in borrowing power. For the Vinton, times that by 12. For the next project, times that by 30+. As many of you have probably figured out by now, it really is a simple matter of applying a hybrid of the non profit development methodology I use in my day job to a market rate deal. Everyone shares the risk and ultimately, they share the benefits. Hippy dippy I know, but think of how such a model could shrink the gaps that exist in some deals. Minus the 10-20 percent profit line item and lots more can happen. Can anyone say preservation? | ||
Skulker Member Username: Skulker Post Number: 3268 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.42.176.88 |
p...pp...pre....presevinton? Presevision? presidentclinton? Prestidigitation? I can't seem to say that so....f#@% it, just blow the damn thing up...... | ||
Ghetto_butterfly Member Username: Ghetto_butterfly Post Number: 556 Registered: 09-2004 Posted From: 68.60.139.186 |
So what about 600 Woodward ...? | ||
Michael Member Username: Michael Post Number: 685 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.38.12.5 |
Vinton = 600 Woodward | ||
Adamjab19 Member Username: Adamjab19 Post Number: 578 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 69.47.170.119 |
Definetly jealous too! What a great thing you guys are doing! | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 748 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 204.39.225.195 |
<------trying to picture these "biggies" Could you possibly be talking about the Stott? | ||
Machoken Member Username: Machoken Post Number: 1075 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.62.2.248 |
LOL @ skulker! I'm extremely jealous. A little angry too, that I don't have the means to get involved with one of these. Damnit, give me 10 years and I'm down, put me down! (Message edited by machoken on December 12, 2005) | ||
Sfdet Member Username: Sfdet Post Number: 69 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 69.109.200.94 |
couple of questions for the investors (sorry if any of them are redundant from earlier posts): about how many usable sq ft per residential floor? will investors have the space and/or right to build more than one residential unit per floor? where will residents park? (i know, sore question around these parts) thanks. great job, you guys! (Message edited by sfdet on December 12, 2005) (Message edited by sfdet on December 12, 2005) | ||
Adamjab19 Member Username: Adamjab19 Post Number: 579 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 69.47.170.119 |
Edit: (NM, see Sfdet next post I had no relevent info for him/her.... :P ) BTW anyone want to get together with the DuCharme building on Grand Blvd. and John R? I keep telling all my friends about this and they are all amazed in a good way. Even I'm still amazed that forum members came together to do such a thing. It's great! (Message edited by adamjab19 on December 12, 2005) | ||
Sfdet Member Username: Sfdet Post Number: 70 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 69.109.200.94 |
to clarify my earlier question about parking, will the residential units come with existing rights to a permanently reserved parking space in a designated nearby garage? or are the residents on their own to find permanent designated parking in a nearby garage if they so choose? | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1413 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.212.215.89 |
There's approximately 3700 Sq. Ft. as a single unit. If you split it in 2, you lose another 1000 Sq.Ft. You need to provide a hallway outside the units. This allows access to both the stairwell and fire escape for both units. This is one of the things that drove us to 1 unit per floor. The other was the parking. We hope to have one parking space per residential unit. It will be in the basement. We're putting in a car elevator. We've been negotiating with the neighboring decks for additional parking. | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 60 Registered: 07-2005 Posted From: 148.61.248.90 |
The Stott would be cool, but isn't that already owned by someone (and partially occupied)? The Detroit Free Press Building might not be bad, judging from the outside. I don't know how the inside's arranged. But $3,000,000 in borrowing power seems like alot to me. Has anyone contacted a newspaper about the Vinton Building? To me this is definately news-worthy! | ||
Pam Member Username: Pam Post Number: 16 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 66.19.19.75 |
It was in the newspaper: http://www.detnews.com/2005/bu siness/0502/27/B01-101205.htm | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 69 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 204.24.64.25 |
Has anyone sketched up their floor plan yet? It has to be pretty cool to layout your own floor plan, and have 3700 sft to work with! | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1414 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.234 |
Why would we want this in the local papers? They couldn't even retype a press release accurately. The linked article is the example. There are so many innacuracies in that article. They took the original press release we sent them and fabricated a bunch of things into it. | ||
Hamtramck_steve Member Username: Hamtramck_steve Post Number: 2581 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 136.181.195.17 |
RJ King did something like that? You don't say... | ||
Eric Member Username: Eric Post Number: 245 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 35.8.218.33 |
Another building with potential for this style of development is the Capitol Park Building/1145 Griswold it's selling for a pretty reasonable $2,200,000. I think people already live in the building so it can't be in that bad of shape. http://www.exclusive-realty.co m/properties.html | ||
Goat Member Username: Goat Post Number: 7883 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 64.228.66.47 |
I agree Eric. That is a fantastic building! I'm not sure about the inside of it though. Does anyone know what kid of shape it is in? BTW: I noticed that the Masonic Temple is for lease. Do the masons still use the building? | ||
Slows Member Username: Slows Post Number: 96 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 68.42.77.90 |
1145 Griswold has only one tenant on the upper floors, and then owner occupied ground floor. Has a tough mezzanine level to deal with too. Needs a ton of work, has five elevator shafts that eat up too much room. As usual, parking issues to deal with. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 6202 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 198.208.251.24 |
Say it ain't so: 400 East Congress Detroit cm Confidential Sale 5,000 sqf Approx. Call for details. Business, Equipment, Furniture, Class "C" Liquor LIcense, 15 year lease. If new owners come in they better not change the food!! | ||
Motorcitymayor2026 Member Username: Motorcitymayor2026 Post Number: 257 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 71.10.63.140 |
ohh... the abandoned free press building would be nice | ||
Everyman Member Username: Everyman Post Number: 13 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 24.136.14.239 |
I wish it were like 3 years from now ... | ||
Kraemerdesigngroup Member Username: Kraemerdesigngroup Post Number: 18 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 69.216.129.114 |
Dnvn522 - KDG designed a loft in another Detroit building with the same foot print, except without the long wall of windows. Here is idea we came up for that building. Ceilings were a bit higher.   | ||
Psip Member Username: Psip Post Number: 637 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 69.246.13.131 |
A view of the Vinton Building from the David Stott WSU  | ||
Pam Member Username: Pam Post Number: 17 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 67.107.47.65 |
BTW: I noticed that the Masonic Temple is for lease. Do the masons still use the building? ----- Yes. |
