Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 9145 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 6:14 pm: | |
Everybody's favorite vacant lot is back in the news. http://www.freep.com/article/2 0081117/NEWS03/811170381/1005/ news03
quote:Eyeing a prime vacant site in Royal Oak, one developer proposed a convention center, another suggested a hotel topped by condos, still another saw a car dealership under an office tower, and one even wanted to build an aquarium linked by a skywalk to the Detroit Zoo. Advertisement Yet, after three decades of on-again, off-again proposals, the vacant lot at one of metro Detroit's most visible sites is back on the block. |
Bike4beer Member Username: Bike4beer
Post Number: 44 Registered: 09-2008
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 6:23 pm: | |
I vote for a strip mall with a Starbucks, Panera, Jimmy Johns, CVS and a Walgreens. |
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott
Post Number: 1700 Registered: 12-2006
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 6:35 pm: | |
This ought to be a prime spot for development in a freeway-crazy city like Detroit, right on 696 and only maybe a mile from 75. Has RO put so many restrictions on it that nobody can do a project? Or what's the situation? I mean, OK, right now not jack shit is going to happen, but this has been sitting around growing dandelions for a loooong time. |
Douglasm Member Username: Douglasm
Post Number: 1176 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 7:01 pm: | |
Whose dealership? I remember a dealership on the corner of Washington and Woodward (a Ford dealer?), but unless it was a used car lot, the only thing I can think of was a block of retail buildings...... |
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd
Post Number: 3667 Registered: 07-2004
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 7:17 pm: | |
Forest Arcology? |
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 9146 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 7:17 pm: | |
Professorscott, the city definitely has an interest in what goes there. They were all for Schostak's plans until went from a larged mixed-use building with office, hotel and retail space to a giant surface lot with an LA fitness in one corner. I see they still have it on their web site. Their development sign at the location with the original rendering has been whitewashed. http://www.schostak.com/newdev elopments.htm I'd say RO got it right on that one. |
Savannah Member Username: Savannah
Post Number: 83 Registered: 02-2008
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 7:24 pm: | |
What was on that spot in the 1960's? any help would be greatly appreciated. I think my dad bought a car there in '64 |
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner
Post Number: 2007 Registered: 04-2006
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 7:42 pm: | |
The dealership that used to be there was Matthews Hargraves Chevrolet. I find many of the proposals sort of comical. The parcel is really not that big to do much with. Maybe a small strip mall, an apartment building, but thats really about all you can do with it. The cost of the land is most likely so high that it might take 50 years to recoup your investment. Hardly a worthwhile project to take on. I would suggest using it as a park or perhaps something that could compliment the zoo. |
Savannah Member Username: Savannah
Post Number: 84 Registered: 02-2008
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 7:48 pm: | |
Many thanks Detroitplanner. |
Burnsie Member Username: Burnsie
Post Number: 1539 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 9:19 pm: | |
The article incorrectly states that the dealership was torn down in the late '70s. It actually was open at that site at least into 1985. The state bought the land in Jan. 1986 (reference: R/W maps on MDOT website), because part of it was needed for the westbound service drive. Detroitplanner: Of course there isn't a chance of it happening, but the land is plenty big enough for a towering skyscraper, not including parking of course. There are lots of very tall buildings with a ground area the same size or smaller than the vacant R.O. lot. There's enough room there to build a twin of the Penobscot if you really wanted to. It seems that any project these days, though, needs a huge parking ramp or surface lot immediately adjacent. |
Daddeeo Member Username: Daddeeo
Post Number: 299 Registered: 09-2008
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 9:46 pm: | |
That site has been a comedy of errors for years. The city has had $$$ in their eyes and it hasn't paid off. With all the lofts and condos that have clogged the downtown area, it's kind of nice to see that spot still empty. |
Ray Member Username: Ray
Post Number: 1164 Registered: 06-2004
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 10:22 pm: | |
I vote for a green space. |
Smogboy Member Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 9293 Registered: 11-2004
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 10:25 pm: | |
Green space would be great there. And since we're tossing around ideas... would an Aquarium be an interesting thing to toss there with its proximity to the Detroit Zoo right across the street? Again, just a thought without any regards to funding, building it, maintaining it, etc., etc.. Just food for discussion's sake. |
Fishtoes2000 Member Username: Fishtoes2000
Post Number: 730 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Monday, November 17, 2008 - 11:35 pm: | |
A hotel with minor conference space would be ideal, especially once we have light rail up Woodward connecting this property to the rest of the world. The question is which will we have first: a development on this property or light rail cutting through Royal Oak? |
Novine Member Username: Novine
Post Number: 842 Registered: 07-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, November 18, 2008 - 12:07 am: | |
"The parcel is really not that big to do much with. Maybe a small strip mall, an apartment building, but thats really about all you can do with it." This is a joke, right? 4.4 acres in an urban area is plenty big to do a lot of building. Ann Arbor just approved a 14 story development on a similar sized site on South University in Ann Arbor. The development was originally proposed to be 25 stories. http://www.mlive.com/annarborn ews/news/index.ssf/2008/10/sho rter_trimmer_forest_avenue.htm l |
Crew Member Username: Crew
Post Number: 1472 Registered: 02-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, November 18, 2008 - 1:59 am: | |
Douglasm, To answer your question, Jim Fresard Pontiac/Buick considered moving there about three years ago before they built the new buildings in Ferndale. The thought was to have the dealership as part of a parking deck/office building but they couldn't make it work financially. |
Keystone Member Username: Keystone
Post Number: 278 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, November 18, 2008 - 9:51 am: | |
The City of RO shot themselves in the foot when they allowed the prior development of the condos on the north side of that site. It was 'phase 1' of a development that left too little land for the remaining program. Short sighted, and let the developer take the fast $$ portion of the project early on. The land that is left is problematic. Not a very big parcel, and the city has to answer to public expectations (which they created in the first place). Also, consider the voice of the residents of those condos.... they will be looking at a loading dock if the high-rise scenario ever plays out. |
Keystone Member Username: Keystone
Post Number: 279 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, November 18, 2008 - 10:09 am: | |
Regarding the comparison with the A2 project.. the A2 building has very little parking, as it is geared toward student needs. Any business or condominiums have to contend with parking needs. And underground parking is 3-4x the cost of above grade parking. The City of RO had a 'family' night on the gateway site this summer. They set up an inflatable drive in movie screen. Fun for all.. but I'm not sure anyone saw the irony... |
Lferg Member Username: Lferg
Post Number: 47 Registered: 07-2008
| Posted on Tuesday, November 18, 2008 - 1:04 pm: | |
Royal Oak needs a good hotel in the area. |
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner
Post Number: 2010 Registered: 04-2006
| Posted on Tuesday, November 18, 2008 - 2:28 pm: | |
I would be surprised if zoning would allow a tall residential tower on the site. Most Communities have pretty tight FAR regulations and will only deviate from them for the CBD. Even if you could build one, why would you? The market for housing stinks right now. To be honest, Ann Arbor housing market stinks right now and is bound to get worse as more people are priced out of higher education. There can only be so many out of State students allowed at the school before the people of the State realize they are being suckered as the educators for the rest of the country and not getting any benefit from investing in it. |