  Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 844 Registered: 11-2006 |
Ever encounter any blatant racial hostility in Detroit or its suburbs? Where do you feel the most-least welcome? How have you overcome youre own racial fears and predjudice? Most of the hostility I have encountered has come from dating across racial lines. Had an incident on the bus back in 98. | ||
Jams Member Username: Jams Post Number: 9243 Registered: 10-2003 |
10 years ago? Just keep stirring the pot! | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2679 Registered: 09-2007 |
Hey, it's not any better having pointless transit discussions everyday. I never really encountered any prejudice or had any racial fears. However, I do know of people who have. | ||
Jrvass Member Username: Jrvass Post Number: 784 Registered: 01-2007 |
Only 1. 14th St. near I-75 by a high school. A car behind me and in front of me at a red light when school had let out. The lovable little children tried to tip over my S-10 Blazer at the light. The light turned green and I didn't look back to see how many feet I ran over. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 1907 Registered: 02-2006 |
I've only heard "something something something white boy!" yelled at me while driving. It doesn't really get to me too much. I'm always thinking "wow...yup...you caught me...totally white." | ||
Rid0617 Member Username: Rid0617 Post Number: 208 Registered: 03-2008 |
"A car behind me and in front of me at a red light when school had let out. The lovable little children tried to tip over my S-10 Blazer at the light." If they succeeded you could have hollered hate crime, they tipped you over because of race. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 6096 Registered: 10-2003 |
In order for something to be labeled a hate crime you have to prove that the crime was explicitly committed against a protected class because of their protected class, which is always a very hard thing to do. Usually, prosecutors don't even take seriously request to prosecute something as a hate crime unless a slur is involved. | ||
Jrvass Member Username: Jrvass Post Number: 786 Registered: 01-2007 |
No. My windows were rolled up. It was March and cold outside. No slurs were exchanged that I recall. Hate crime? Yes, I hate crime. Besides, what could I expect to $get$ from the families of the 20 or so kids, had I known who they were? Nothing but an education. When stopped at a red light behind vehicles, I now leave "ramming room". Kind of like scanning freeway overpasses for street urchins about to toss large rocks or bowling balls into your windshield. That happened to me near the Silverdome when I was picking up a copier from Owens-Corning after they finished re-inflating the roof. I begged security to let me hang out with them until the Pontiac PD arrived to do a report for insurance. The first event after re-inflation was a Jehova's Witness Conference... not a football game! | ||
Rid0617 Member Username: Rid0617 Post Number: 211 Registered: 03-2008 |
Wow, sounds like you folks have a whole bunch more smarts than folks down here. Every time you turn around down here both races are claiming something happened to them because of race and demanding prosecution. But then what do you expect from the state that started the civil war? I have never been involved in something race related but I also have more black friends than white. The whites are leaning real close to inbred hillbillies where I live. The blacks are cool and more the type of people this old coger likes to hang with. | ||
Revaldullton Member Username: Revaldullton Post Number: 1007 Registered: 07-2007 |
""Ever encounter any blatant racial hostility in Detroit or its suburbs? Where do you feel the most-least welcome? "" All my life growing up in Detroit. That whiteboy/cracker shit had gotten pretty old by the time I was married and had kids so we left. Besides, I got tired of actiually having to fight racist fucks physically. Im too old for that. "How have you overcome youre own racial fears and predjudice?" Never had any fears or predjudice. I was always the one discriminated against in the good ol city of Detroit. "Most of the hostility I have encountered has come from dating across racial lines. " Happens all the time now even in NYC. Black men always try me when Im with my wife or they say stupid shit under their breath because they don't want a real confrontation. Where ever you have poor people, racist groups like the klan and Nation of Islam, black panthers etc you will have brainwashed souls that don't know any better but too hate others and retain a bullshit victim mentality. Which is why I am for amending the 1st amendment to ban all hate speech. the good rev (Message edited by revaldullton on July 05, 2008) | ||
Plymouthres Member Username: Plymouthres Post Number: 645 Registered: 02-2007 |
Amending the Constitution for that? We have much bigger fish to fry..... Racism will always exist in this city. It is what holds us back, don't you know? | ||
Revaldullton Member Username: Revaldullton Post Number: 1009 Registered: 07-2007 |
I know it holds us back. But, shutting up people like Fat Sharpton et al with a real ban on hate speech will make things all the better. the good rev | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 2321 Registered: 08-2007 |
I've had more friendly exchanges than hostile ones. I like riding around in my convertible on gorgeous days. At first I was a bit nervous sitting at lights in Highland Park or Grand River, but the only comments have been good natured ones about how much fun I'm having. I still am cautious enough, wherever I am, not to get boxed in. As far as my own prejudices, when they rear their ugly heads, I realize how irrational they are, and poof, they're gone. The anthropological explanation for prejudice is that the human species learned to keep itself safe by being cautious of those who were different, so a certain amount of prejudice is normal. It need not rise to the level of irrational hatred or terror that precludes any opportunity to interact positively with others. | ||
Ggores Member Username: Ggores Post Number: 169 Registered: 10-2007 |
How'd the Germans invade Poland? They marched in backwards and said they was leaving. Cha cha. Cha. | ||
Gaz Member Username: Gaz Post Number: 315 Registered: 04-2008 |
When are the people of this country going to realize that other people are not evil just because they don't look like you? It's tearing us all apart, and it's so stupid. | ||
Jcole Member Username: Jcole Post Number: 2231 Registered: 04-2005 |
It doesn't even have to be that they don't look like you. It's that they don't sound like you, or go to church like you, or think like you, or any other perceived difference. It's virtually impossible to escape it. Very wrong and sad. | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 303 Registered: 04-2008 |
I'd have to agree with Rid0617. I've had some great black (as well as other races) friends and find them to be very genuine, humble, and humorous. Every human has an obligation to reach out beyond their "comfort zone" and get to know people that are "different". You can learn a lot. | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2681 Registered: 09-2007 |
Rid0617, take away (what's left of) Detroit and Michigan will simply be a mis-placed southern state (not so much our lifestyle, but our attitude and personality). The southern folks are more down to earth. Georgia is still a southern state, so I would expect the whites to inbred hillbillies. | ||
Gaz Member Username: Gaz Post Number: 316 Registered: 04-2008 |
I have lived in so many places, and met all kinds of people. What I have noticed is that people really aren't that different. What holds them back is pre-conceived notions, i.e.; This guy sucks because he's a Moslem, this guy's white (black) so he's out to get me, just look at that fat ugly pig! (etc.) Ya gotta give people a chance! It's amazing to think about all the potentially great friends people turn away from because of whatever predjuice(s) they may have. | ||
Rid0617 Member Username: Rid0617 Post Number: 212 Registered: 03-2008 |
Detroitrise, I spent most of my life in Georgia and aware of them. I'm in South Carolina now and it's even worse. | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 2325 Registered: 08-2007 |
Being aware that the negative thought comes from prejudging on external features goes a long way toward turning things around. You think: Oh-oh, a black kid, better roll up my window. Then think: Wait, I don't know this kid, how do I know he means harm? He is not doing anything but standing on the corner, now he's crossing the street, no problem. Try smiling and nodding if you catch his eye. Smiling costs nothing and makes the world a better place. | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2682 Registered: 09-2007 |
Gazhekwe, one thing that gets on my nerve are those fake smiles. Please, if you feel a certain way, just speak up and tell the truth. If they do something you dislike, they'll do it. If not, so be it. Go on by your business. (Message edited by DetroitRise on July 05, 2008) | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 2326 Registered: 08-2007 |
Nothing fake about my smile, DetroitRise. Maybe it just takes practice being glad to see people. I guess I've had a lot of practice. My point is, the rejecting feelings are a normal human reaction, an automatic feeling of caution that has its roots in our distant past, and therefore not necessarily a rational reaction to the immediate situation. If we know that and give it its due, and then assess the situation rationally, we can override that instinctive fear. We see the extremes all the time, and we see the ones who manage to bridge the gap just fine. | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 309 Registered: 04-2008 |
Detroitrise, I hope you were being sarcastic! I mean, you don't actually judge people by their smiles, do you? | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2684 Registered: 09-2007 |
Ok, obviously you guys missed my point again. Let's say you don't like me for whatever reason. Something negative is going through your head about me. If I approached you for something (humans can feel bad vibes from someone), and you said something crazy and gave me a big cheesy grin, that would annoy me especially. The situation would be worse if you talked about me behind your back, like Gazhewke said Oh-oh, a black kid, better roll up my window. | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 311 Registered: 04-2008 |
Detroitrise, I think the smile that Gazhekwe was referring to is the smile that says "I mean you no harm, I accept you as an equal, have a nice day." | ||
Revaldullton Member Username: Revaldullton Post Number: 1018 Registered: 07-2007 |
"The southern folks are more down to earth. Georgia is still a southern state, so I would expect the whites to inbred hillbillies." Nice, very nice indeed. the good rev | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 2327 Registered: 08-2007 |
Detroitrise, negative thoughts sneak up all the time from the miasma of the Id, but that doesn't mean I let them rule my life. It happens to most people. It's a biological thing, as I explained earlier. If you catch my eye, I smile because I am happy, I hope you are too and I do hope you have a nice day. Thanks, Retroit, you got it. | ||
Pythonmaster Member Username: Pythonmaster Post Number: 188 Registered: 12-2006 |
Read " Arc of Justice" by Kevin Boyle. http://www.flickr.com/photos/j ustbeamensch/2159484934/sizes/ m/in/set-72157594143593544/ | ||
Rampartstreetnorth Member Username: Rampartstreetnorth Post Number: 92 Registered: 07-2006 |
I lived most of my life within 50 miles of the Gulf of Mexico, but also lived in Northern California for seven years. For the past 3 years I've lived in metro Detroit. In the South, racial prejudice is frequently openly expressed, but...there is also a relatively high frequency of day to day interaction between people of different races, at least in White/Black terms. And it is a mistake to assume that the South is monolithic in its racial attitudes. Louisiana in particular has the highest proportion of people of interracial background that I've ever encountered...very different than S. Carolina or Georgia. During the 50's and 60's the South was forced to confront its racist culture in ways that other sections of the country haven't been, and some of that has stuck. The battle is still being fought, but a least there is some engagement with it. http://www.nola.com/news/index .ssf/2008/07/interfaith_tolera nce_event_dra.html In terms of its racial attitudes the SF Bay Area is probably the least uptight area I've ever lived in, at least among younger people. But there are still huge areas of ethnic concentration which are essentially impenetrable to outsiders, at least on anything other than a casual basis. But outright expressions of racial hostility were rare, in my experience, maybe because the area is so ethnically varied. WRT Metro Detroit...in terms of race this is the most highly segregated place I've ever lived, not just in physical terms but in psychological terms. It is my impression that most White people here live in an all-White bubble, which is broken by interaction w/non-White people only in specific settings, like at a Tiger's game or going to the doctor's office. Through work my wife and have become friends with some Black Detroiters, and while our White neighbors have never said anything about our interracial dinner parties (we live in Oakland County) they tend to look at us funny if they notice Black people coming to visit...we are definitely the oddities on the block in that regard. Years ago Dick Gregory, who was from Mississippi but lived in Chicago, said; "In the South, White people didn't care how close I got, as long as I didn't get too big. In Chicago, White people didn't care how big I got, as long as didn't get too close." I think that both the South and midwestern cities like Detroit are still dealing with that racial construct. | ||
Roadmaster49 Member Username: Roadmaster49 Post Number: 63 Registered: 01-2008 |
Hhmm. Many interesting comments. I didn't see a lot of racist stuff in Houston. It's been a long time since we had a racist news headline in Des Moines, so I'm not one with a good example. I enjoy the interaction with every person up to the point where they want to harm me, my family or my stuff. If someone yelled Cracker to me in Detroit as I was going through an older neighborhood I wanted to check architecture on on a visit, I would assess the situation for danger, and MIGHT pull over to ask him/her why that was said and I am pretty sure I could talk that person into a friendly ending. I'm no expert again, but I have got "stopped" at a four way in the Houston Ghetto where I quickly got surrounded. They assumed I was there to buy drugs. The problem is, in those neighborhoods, a gun could get whipped out in a hurry, boom your dead, and your social experiment turned ary in a hurry. We are back to the "protection of me, my family and stuff". I will go on the side of less caution. I will always believe sidewalks, streets and parks belong to the citizens. Private property is private property but in the old days, that was just a conduit to get to the ice cream guy. Now, a Rottweiler might chew your leg off. | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 2328 Registered: 08-2007 |
Some quotations on prejudice from some wise folk, showing how many generations have grappled with it: If a person is capable of rectifying his erroneous judgments in the light of new evidence he is not prejudiced. Prejudgments become prejudices only if they are reversible when exposed to new knowledge. A prejudice, unlike a simple misconception, is actively resistant to all evidence that would unseat it. We tend to grow emotional when a prejudice is threatened with contradiction. Thus the difference between ordinary prejudgments and prejudice is that one can discuss and rectify a prejudgment without emotional resistance. (Gordon W. Allport (1897-1967), U.S. psychologist, educator. The Nature of Prejudice, ch. 1, Beacon Press (1954).) The arrogance of race prejudice is an arrogance which defies what is scientifically known of human races. (Ruth Benedict (1887-1948), U.S. anthropologist. "Recognition of Cultural Diversities in the Postwar World." Annals of the American Academy of Political and Social Science (July 1943). An Anthropologist at Work, part 5 (1959).) Prejudice. A vagrant opinion without visible means of support. (Ambrose Bierce (1842-1914), U.S. author. The Devil's Dictionary (1881-1906), repr. In Collected Works of Ambrose Bierce, vol. 7 (1911).) ...all Americans are the prisoners of racial prejudice. (Shirley Chisholm (b. 1924), African American politician. Unbought and Unbossed, ch. 13 (1970). Chisholm was a Congresswoman from a poor African American district in Brooklyn.) That which corrodes the souls of the persecuted is the monstrous inner agreement with the prevailing prejudice against them. (Eric Hoffer (1902-1983), U.S. philosopher. The Passionate State of Mind, aph. 127 (1955).) The very ink in which history is written is merely fluid prejudice. (Mark Twain [Samuel Langhorne Clemens] (1835-1910), U.S. author. "Pudd'nhead Wilson's New Calendar," ch. 69, Following the Equator (1897).) Absolute power can only be supported by error, ignorance and prejudice. (Philip Dormer Stanhope, 4th Earl Chesterfield (1694-1773), British statesman, man of letters. letter, Nov. 25, 1751, Chesterfield's Letters to his Son and Others, p. 312, London, Dent (1796). Despite Chesterfield's comment, Francis Hastings, 10th Earl of Huntingdon (1729-1789), to whom this letter was addressed, continued to be a believer in arbitrary power.) Respect—not tolerance—must be our goal if we would diminish prejudice in our time. For tolerance is often but a gentle disguise for prejudice: the tolerant often behave as self-appointed connoisseurs of weaknesses in others, or self-appointed protectors of those whom they deem to be their inferiors. Psychologically, there is a strong resemblance between the stridently "tolerant" and the prejudiced. For while the one may descend to attacking whole groups of men and the other may rise to a passionate defense of them, both are equally indiscriminate in their attack or defense; and neither has any concern whatsoever for individual character. (Selma G. Hirsch, U.S. social scientist ??.. The Fears Men Live By, ch. 9, Harper & Brothers (1955).) The discovery of truth is prevented more effectively, not by the false appearance things present and which mislead into error, not directly by weakness of the reasoning powers, but by preconceived opinion, by prejudice. (Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860), German philosopher. Parerga and Paralipomena, vol. 2, ch. 1, sct. 17 (1851).) Superstition, bigotry and prejudice, ghosts though they are, cling tenaciously to life; they are shades armed with tooth and claw. They must be grappled with unceasingly, for it is a fateful part of human destiny that it is condemned to wage perpetual war against ghosts. A shade is not easily taken by the throat and destroyed. (Victor Hugo (1802-1885), French poet, dramatist, novelist. Les Misérables, pt. 2, bk. 7, ch. 3 (1862).) The horror of class stratification, racism, and prejudice is that some people begin to believe that the security of their families and communities depends on the oppression of others, that for some to have good lives there must be others whose lives are truncated and brutal. (Dorothy Allison (b. 1949), U.S. author and lesbian feminist. Skin, ch. 2 (1994). Allison had grown up in a very poor and dysfunctional South Carolina family.) Race prejudice is not only a shadow over the colored—it is a shadow over all of us, and the shadow is darkest over those who feel it least and allow its evil effects to go on. (Pearl S. Buck (1892-1973), U.S. author. What America Means to Me, ch. 1 (1943).) If people are informed they will do the right thing. It's when they are not informed that they become hostages to prejudice. (Charlayne Hunter-Gault (b. 1942), African American journalist. As quoted in I Dream a World, by Brian Lanker (1989). In 1961, Hunter-Gault (then Hunter) had been one of two African American students to integrate the University of Georgia. She went on to become a journalist and television news correspondent, covering, among other issues, apartheid in South Africa.) ...I am ... one of the wretched and miserable daughters of the descendants of fallen Africa. Do you ask, why are you wretched and miserable? I reply, look at many of the most worthy and interesting of us doomed to spen our lives in gentlemen's kitchens. Look at our young men, smark, active and energetic, with souls filled with ambitious fire; if they can look forward, alas! what are their prospects? they can be nothing but the humblest laborers, on account of their dark complexions; hence many of them lose their ambition, and become worthless. Look at our middle-aged men, clad in their rusty plaids and coats; in winter, every cent they earn goes to buy their wood and pay their rents; their poor wives also toil beyond their strength, to help support their families. Look at our aged sires, whose heads are whitened with the frosts of seventy winters, with their old wood-saws on their backs. Alas, what keeps us so? Prejudice, ignorance, and poverty. (Maria Stewart (1803-1879), African American abolitionist and schoolteacher. As quoted in Black Women in Nineteenth-Century American Life, part 3, by Bert James Loewenberg and Ruth Bogin (1976). Stewart, a free black, said this in a September 21, 1832 speech delivered at Franklin Hall in Boston. She was speaking of the miserable, albeit "free," condition of Northern blacks.) http://www.poemhunter.com/quot ations/prejudice/page-1/ | ||
Themax Member Username: Themax Post Number: 897 Registered: 09-2005 |
I just finished working at a charter school. Any kid who is fair-complected can expect to be called "white boy" when in a confrontation. And confrontations were frequent among all the kids. "White boy" was mild compared to what some of the kids said to other dark-complected kids. | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 316 Registered: 04-2008 |
Themax, have you ever seen this extraordinary documentary about Jane Elliot: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/ frontline/shows/divided/etc/vi ew.html Did the school you were working at have any type of diversity training? Something must be done to stop racism from being passed down to the future generations! | ||
Rid0617 Member Username: Rid0617 Post Number: 213 Registered: 03-2008 |
"Did the school you were working at have any type of diversity training? Something must be done to stop racism from being passed down to the future generations!" Exactly!•••• Enough is enough of it already. We're all in the same pot getting screwed over. | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 847 Registered: 11-2006 |
A kid on a porch catcalled white boy a year or so ago. Several months ago I stopped by Clark lofts to visit a friend and one of two women standing by the door asked in a nasally tone, the type of which black comedians often use to mimick how some whites speak,if I was at the right place,the younger lady mumbled something else in the same tone.In most circumstances I totally ignore those behaviours, half expecting them, but on this occurance I flirted by looking them both up and down and replying "I know Im in the right place with the sexy ladies", the younger woman gave me a dirty look, turned away, the other one smiled and told me to have a great night, with a seemingly complete mood change. I diffused a potentially potent situation with my reaction and response. Perhaps we tend to focus on negative experiences and forget all the positive. Good Rev I think it is cool you are in an interacial relationship and I wish you and youre other half the best. Ive noticed over the years that most dont seem to care or offer their tacit support with excessive courtesy or a smile. Not the fake uncomfortable smiles, the genuine, I like seeing you two together youre a nice looking couple smile. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 1914 Registered: 02-2006 |
Terryh, you got lucky. Your reaction could get you a smile or a fight, depending on the recipient. | ||
Lefty2 Member Username: Lefty2 Post Number: 1488 Registered: 07-2007 |
Racial antagonism in Detroit? Never, Everyone loves everyone else, are you kidding me. | ||
Revaldullton Member Username: Revaldullton Post Number: 1020 Registered: 07-2007 |
Thanx Terry ,,,,,,,,she is the bestest ever. the good rev | ||
Themax Member Username: Themax Post Number: 914 Registered: 09-2005 |
I don't know if they had ever had diversity training. But I only worked there for a year. I saw a bit of verbal confrontations and just outrighting fighting in the elementary grades. I didn't always know what happened after I wrote the students up and sent them to the office. Quite a few kids would not go to the office when I told them to. Fortunately, the lunch ladies, who had much bigger voices than I, had my back. The middle school would put a kid in detention for language. I don't know what happened to the kid who called a girl a "shim". The middle school had pretty good discipline and a lot of kids were in detention, in-school suspension or suspension. | ||
Gnome Member Username: Gnome Post Number: 1419 Registered: 08-2007 |
Last week while making a left lane merge I inadvertantly failed to check my blind spot and cut off a local driver. She blared her horn and I waved an apology. Certainly my fault, but we didn't bump and I thought all was fine given my abject apology. When Shaniqua pulled along side, she loudly expressed her feelings as to my driving skills and whether or not I was qualified to drive on our city's streets. She also was kind enough to point out that I was white. Being bolstered by that knowledge, I thanked her for her kind reminder, and she sped ahead in a huff. As she sped away, two tiny hands extended from the rear windows, both giving me the finger. Ahh, youth. The real promise for our future. | ||
Zrx_doug Member Username: Zrx_doug Post Number: 323 Registered: 03-2008 |
LMAO at Gnome! Been there, done that, didn't catch the young ladies name..my personal fave is when I get the same treatment for almost getting hit by her & her kids when SHE was the one making the driving error.. Luckily, getting called a "stupid WHITE M-F'er" doesn't seem to break any more bones than just being called a plain old "stupid M-F'er" without the racial identification.  | ||
Rid0617 Member Username: Rid0617 Post Number: 215 Registered: 03-2008 |
And you would think according to the media and good ole Al Sharpton only whites are racist. | ||
Themax Member Username: Themax Post Number: 920 Registered: 09-2005 |
When my daughter who is black was learning to drive and I was co-pilot, she got hit by a young black girl who blew a stop sign near our home. Her car got the worst of it, and she proceeded to get out of her car and holler about her new birthday car. She called up a large female friend who arrived quickly. I told my daughter just to stay in the car and not talk to her because she was crazy. Fortunately, the person behind us offered to stay until the police came. The girl got a second ticket for her attitude which the police didn't appreciate. I could have done without the locals setting up their lawn chairs and watching it all as though we were the latest TV show. | ||
Revaldullton Member Username: Revaldullton Post Number: 1024 Registered: 07-2007 |
^^^^^JERRY! JERRY! JERRY! THE GOOD REV |
