  Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 7442 Registered: 02-2004 |
With the economy in shambles and rising fuel prices, Lots of families are thinking should I drive to church to worship God or save gas in my car? So far St. Conrad's Catholic Church in Melvindale will be closed. It's members are headed to St. Mary Magdalen's Catholic Church to mass there. Fewer churches around the Metro-Detroit area are cutting expansion and repair plans. Other members are getting laid off, and Sunday services begin to reduce. We Christians must face this kind of stronghold before the gates of Hell comes in. We can't let the Anti-Christ win. We all can find an alternative way to get to church with using up our gas to drive our cars. Keep the faith in Jesus Christ within our Christian Nation and the God work his wonders to every human head. Remember this We Christians walk by faith and not by sight. | ||
Themax Member Username: Themax Post Number: 895 Registered: 09-2005 |
There's your solution. Walk to church. And we are not a xtian nation. Our government is secular and there are many religions in the U.S. | ||
Olddetroiter Member Username: Olddetroiter Post Number: 857 Registered: 04-2008 |
Even if your church is too far away to walk to, there are probably many other areas where you can cut back on driving to compensate for the cost of driving to church. | ||
Thoswolfe Member Username: Thoswolfe Post Number: 66 Registered: 11-2007 |
Ashes to ashes dust to dust..... In mid 60's St Mary Magdalene church and school was so overcrowded (even the gym stage was converted to classroom) that St Conrad was built for expansion/overflow. I was surprised a couple years ago to hear St Mary's only had about 100 students and would close the school. Guess it was only a matter of time that Melvindale would only need one Catholic church again. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 13206 Registered: 12-2003 |
Danny, Great thread! I've always puzzled over why people drive so far to worship, MOST do. I daresay it is due to their needing their ears tickled MORE than worshiping the One Who Made Us. They should be members of their local church anyways, so when needs arise in the neighborhood they will be available to help. This is NOT some attack from the anti-Christ, as you so blatantly accuse...I see it exactly the opposite. God is shaking out bullshit, whiney, weak Xtian behavior that has become entrenched over time. It is just another way the Savior has been largely eliminated from the equation, exactly why I'll call that majority of the faith Xtian instead of CHRISTian. Those in full-flowing relationship with the Spirit know that the building and mere hour or so in ONE day of the week are not the definition of 'fellowship' anyways! True fellowship happens everywhere, and all the time. I just had a wonderful encounter with a neighbor yesterday who I had not yet met. We BOTH left out of the conversation feeling like we'd been through a two-hour praise uplifting! Oh yeah, and the Rapture teaching is false...designed ONLY to keep Xtians weak so they are not ready for the troubles to come. Even Muhammad Ali wouldn't not have trained if he knew he'd be the victor in the ring before the first punch was landed. Cheers! | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 5049 Registered: 02-2005 |
It a legitimate concern for many of the old mainline churches in Detroit whose parishoners now largely live in the suburbs. They already attend occasionally as it is, and the gas prices could adjust the frequency of their visits. If the church you go to is important to you for any number of reasons, odds are you'll still make it there, and find other ways to make up for a couple dollars of gas. | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 1697 Registered: 04-2006 |
It is a bizarre behaviour I've noticed as well. People grow up in a parish then leave it only to come back on Sundays. Many of these folks think they are active in the church, yet their physical separation from the parish does not allow them to be fully engaged in soup kitchens or fundraisers. To go back to your original parish is almost hypocritical. If you like the church so much, why leave it behind? Too many people in the faith community have blinders on or are living in the past. Others will complain that the archdiocese is closing their original parish, yet they don't give it the support that is needed. You can't expect a parish to continue if you just show up on Sundays and throw a buck or two in a basket. Many of these folks don't realize they are even spending more on gas to get to the church than they put into the basket. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 5052 Registered: 02-2005 |
Somehow, just somehow, my favorite Detroit church, St. Joseph, has managed to stay operational because it always meets its CSA goals. I guess people shell out for that, which is good because it's the archdiocese's main barometer, but masses there are so sparse. It is discouraging. The recent priests have tried their darndest to encourage people to be active members of the parish. One, whose now working at Assumption Grotto, started up a weekday catechism class for children. The deacon there runs a food pantry for the local hungry, but it's only open one day a week-- he needs help (and more food to pass out). But you can understand why people travel back to a place like St. Joseph instead of going to their local modern-built church with (in all likelihood) a modern, uninspirational form of worship. | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2638 Registered: 09-2007 |
"But you can understand why people travel back to a place like St. Joseph instead of going to their local modern-built church with (in all likelihood) a modern, uninspirational form of worship." Yep, that's it. You can't decide where people feel comfortable worshiping their god because of a minor energy crisis. | ||
Ro_resident Member Username: Ro_resident Post Number: 326 Registered: 11-2003 |
That's why I walk to church. No excuses, eh? Danny, you might want to attribute the source of your first paragraph: http://www.clickondetroit.com/ family/16746276/detail.html | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2640 Registered: 09-2007 |
Well obviously their so called "members" really didn't care for the church if they stopped coming. Only good churches survive the test of time. | ||
Cinderpath Member Username: Cinderpath Post Number: 630 Registered: 05-2006 |
I didn't realize God made it a requirement that worshiping s/he is only valid if it takes place in officially sanctioned houses of worship. | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 1698 Registered: 04-2006 |
"But you can understand why people travel back to a place like St. Joseph instead of going to their local modern-built church with (in all likelihood) a modern, uninspirational form of worship." There is the rub, why move to an area that is uninspiring in the first place? I would disagree that this is a minor energy crisis, but rather one that will influence what we eat, where we live, how we chose to get around, and our entire global economy for years. You are already seeing huge decreases in the number of cars sold, riots over fuel costs on a global scale, and large increases in what it costs to get food to market, as well as the impact of the increased demand for ethanol on our food supply. You will also begin to see a large decrease in imports/exports as the cost of shipping internationally is increasing. | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2641 Registered: 09-2007 |
Detroitplanner, to whoever god you're worshipping (in my case, The Lord Jesus Christ), things like gasoline are minor when it comes to praising him and doing right in your life. We will get beyond this problem eventually (like the Great Depression, the Dust Bowl, etc.) Besides, one of the reasons you can't trust & attend just ANY church is because of situations like this. Either way, you could be losing money (under false pretenses) no matter which way you flip the burger. It's easier now just to stay home and find your inspiration while giving your praise to "god". (Message edited by DetroitRise on June 30, 2008) | ||
Thoswolfe Member Username: Thoswolfe Post Number: 67 Registered: 11-2007 |
When neighborhood demographics change, so will the types of churches and businesses. My parents' church in Redford closed 3 years ago. It was annoying to hear the "where is everyone and why did they all go to churches in their new neighborhoods, and abandon us?" comments from those who chose to travel there once a week to 'feel good'. Um most of the houses in Redford were occupied at the time, and many by original owners, senior citizens whose children moved to other suburbs. Historic and beautiful they may be, but some of the old mega churches in Detroit are not practical- even just the utilities costs would choke a budget, let alone the maintenance and upkeep. The Pagans sacrificed gold and other cherished possessions for their gods, and were criticized by early Christians. Later it became a sign of how pious one was building the Christian churches with 'the finest materials' and adorning with gold. I was more comfortable in those newer more practical 'hall churches' built around Detroit suburbs during the 60's. Start modestly, expand later if need be... Around 1990, when the roof was near collapse at St Christine, the pastor convinced the diocese to loan $250,000 + to 'rebuild. And that church closed within 15 years anyways. During construction we held mass at the Soup Kitchen hall,and parish growth was not likely. Noone wanted to hear that we should save the $ and continue in 'temporary 1/4 s' Another favorite- in KY one parish I attended started out 40 years ago with outdoor mass at a picnic pavillion. Later they enclosed that pavillion. ( a 'pole barn' ) And eventually added a few stained glass windows and covered the steel siding with stucco. Modest, yet impressive- no multi million loans to pay off. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 5053 Registered: 02-2005 |
Dplanner, your comment about not living in uninspiring places is a credo [no pun intended] for some of us, but apparently many people don't prefer stimulation/beauty/inspiration in their everyday life. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 4878 Registered: 10-2003 |
No problem for Detroit's Orthodox Jewish community. G_d and no gas | ||
Melody Member Username: Melody Post Number: 210 Registered: 11-2007 |
Don't they show church on TV now? It's usually on right after the 90-minute Magic Bullet commercial. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 13214 Registered: 12-2003 |
Thanks, Lowell. I always loved seeing them walking to their meetings on Saturday morning when I was rushing out to the Gramophone to witness MY clients worshiping their g_ds. Mackinaw, that was pretty good. Beauty, truth, inspiration...dammit, you've got me going now. I'd run down to the Plaza again, but they've still got the Spirit in covered detention until this whole Kwhyme thing is finished. | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 1699 Registered: 04-2006 |
Mackinaw, I see it as far more than that. A church needs a mission and that mission requires folks to be active participants, not just in attending a mass or services. Those who are uninspired by their church are not active, and you can see that manifested in the many social programs that the churches in needy areas have. If you are uninspired, you don't participate fully in providing programs. Conversely, if you only attend church somewhere because you like the church, but live too far to participate in other activities, it does no good either. Those churches will eventually whither. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 7445 Registered: 02-2004 |
Great Post Mr Lowell. The Hasidic Jews of Oak Park and Southfield communities to observe Shabbot by walking to their synagogues and worship Yahweh, The God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and Moses and the Christians and Muslims. We Christians can walk to church just like golden days. There always the Church Bus, public transit or some generous person. But most of you all this forum please don't give up Church, synagogue or a mosque simply you don't gas money. The Lord will provided all of your needs. Just wait on him. The closer you all to God, the more like He's going to listen. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 13220 Registered: 12-2003 |
If only most who call themselves Christians would realize they can simply BE the church, and that term has relatively NOTHING to do with any building...I might not have to call the bulk of 'em Xtians! Maybe the Lord is saying this ISN'T a 'need', Danny. Closer you get, you hear Him when He answers. | ||
Little_buddy Member Username: Little_buddy Post Number: 97 Registered: 03-2006 |
It is not the rapture teaching that is false, and it does not weaken christians or give them an escape, but it is the time that the Lord brings his wrath on the earth. The scripture is clear that no christian will escape suffering in this life, but the rapture is not about escaping suffering, but God pouring out his wrath on sinful mankind. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 5056 Registered: 02-2005 |
I'm a big fan of walking to church. Was able to do it during my Ann Arbor days. Puts you in a good, clear state of mind. The Hasidic/Orthodox Jews uphold a great tradition. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 7447 Registered: 02-2004 |
Great Post Little_buddy, Revealed from the Seven Seals of Revelations. Given to mankind by Jesus Christ and told Apostle St. John to write it. Today are living in the beginning of Revelation. It's the ungodly not listening to prophecy or looking at the fake Jesus cults like Heaven's Gate. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 7448 Registered: 02-2004 |
Early Christians those 2,000 years ago didn't have cars, horses or a fancy chariots to get to church. Instead they walk just a couple mile from the homes. The Amish today don't need cars to get to church. They can either walk, take a carriage ride or a church at home. | ||
Onthe405 Member Username: Onthe405 Post Number: 61 Registered: 11-2007 |
Detroitplanner, this is so true. IMO the mission of the church is not simply to provide congregants with the aesthetics of a museum-quality building for an hour or two, offer a couple sacraments/sermons, and let them drop some money in the plate and leave. It's even more than providing yet another soup kitchen. I share the vision of Steve Bancroft, former Dean of St Paul's Cathedral. http://www.episcopalchurch.org /81834_94305_ENG_HTM.htm I was encouraged to hear most Episcopalians in the Detroit diocese agree. Earlier this year, the Bishop announced an intended move of diocese offices from midtown Detroit to Plymouth. The outrage amongst parishioners & clergy within the diocese was so swift & intense; he rescinded these plans within 72 hours | ||
Sludgedaddy Member Username: Sludgedaddy Post Number: 64 Registered: 01-2008 |
Maybe the Vatican can come up with a reverse passing of the collection basket and hand out gas vouchers like the cathouses in Nevada are doing because they are losing business. 30 pieces of silver for no lead. | ||
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936 Post Number: 3340 Registered: 01-2005 |
Not being religious, it's no problem. No, not an athiest, just agnostic. | ||
Newport1128 Member Username: Newport1128 Post Number: 190 Registered: 05-2007 |
If anybody is using a few extra dollars a week as an excuse for not attending church, then that's all it is: an excuse. I doubt if anyone who is truly motivated to attend can't find a closer church. I tend to think that those who say they can't/won't attend church because of high gas prices didn't attended on a regular basis, anyway. I wonder how well their excuses will hold up on Judgment Day? | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 7451 Registered: 02-2004 |
The Lord of Hosts told the Prophet Malachi to tell the people of Israel not to rob from God from its tithes and offerings. Using your money for gas instead of putting it in the storehouse is a theft against God. It's a terrible sin that man didn't even know about it. But they did it. People robbing from the Lord every day, every 10 seconds. | ||
Skylark Member Username: Skylark Post Number: 71 Registered: 08-2007 |
Pray at home, God is everywhere. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 13226 Registered: 12-2003 |
PRAISE and worship at home...it is amazing what happens through honest and open praise to the One Who Made All Things. We are resonant beings, designed to sing...there is no mistake in our structure, only our understanding of our abilities, talents, and gifts. Without understanding, there can be no proper usage and action. Heck, most times when I'm running, I'm in a state of silent praise and prayer...running nearly always gets me to that point...and I can stay there for the entire run. Amazing the responses I get when I cross paths with people then, too! (I mention this because I just got back from a jaunt to the river and back...seems I forgot how great it is to run again, and haven't been out in over a month! too much biking, which is not nearly the same sort of locomotion as having my feet on the ground) Far as I'm concerned, those folk who think they can only get with the Maker in some official setting have been sold a bill of goods. They have been lied to, and have chosen to believe the lie. It is MUCH worse when they only think they can have access through some other individual human, and/or only some specific collective activity...when scripture specifically says no such thing is necessary, not even to call ANY man 'father', except your own! They've been duped into ineffectiveness or worse, and can only utter platitudes that may actually hardly mean anything to themselves, and act in the reverse with those they meet. But they sure do SOUND religious...and often act like hypocrites...even before they leave the damn parking lot on Sunday! | ||
Alan55 Member Username: Alan55 Post Number: 1906 Registered: 09-2005 |
Carpool, Danny - carpool. | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 269 Registered: 04-2008 |
"Give to God what is God's, give to Speedway what is Speedway's" | ||
Sludgedaddy Member Username: Sludgedaddy Post Number: 65 Registered: 01-2008 |
What would Jesus drive? | ||
Little_buddy Member Username: Little_buddy Post Number: 98 Registered: 03-2006 |
Well, Jesus Father drove a Fury, it says so right in the bible. God drove Adam and Eve out of the Garden of Eden in a fury. | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2648 Registered: 09-2007 |
"What would Jesus drive?" All of us right into heaven or hell.  | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 593 Registered: 06-2007 |
I'm pretty sure Jesus would ride a Harley. | ||
Warrenite84 Member Username: Warrenite84 Post Number: 324 Registered: 01-2007 |
There's some things you have missed on this subject; of which driving to your church plays a minimal part. Those who are followers of Christ, are the "Body of Christ". Just as God has appointed some to be preachers, teachers, missionaries, etc., those of us in the Body of Christ are called to our service. (You cannot expect a hand to do what a foot does, or an eye to do the work of an ear.) God places us where we feel fed.( That is where we receive instruction to do God's will and to nurture the talents God gave us.) Churches are for Christians to come together to strengthen each others' faith. If you feel that gas costs too much to go where you are fed, you may need to look at where God fits in your priorities. Otherwise, ask him to lead you to another place where your needs can be met. PS. IMHO the Rapture is a REAL EVENT. The wild weather, earthquakes, disease, corporate and government corruption, and greater dis-harmony with your fellow man, are allowed to happen by God to shake our false faith in them. Jesus Christ is the ONLY rock in which we can cling to. | ||
Warrenite84 Member Username: Warrenite84 Post Number: 325 Registered: 01-2007 |
I have to add that churches are certainly not ONLY for Christians; all are welcome. All areas of Metro Detroit are in need of charity help, even if you live in the burbs and commute to a church in Detroit. | ||
Digitalvision Member Username: Digitalvision Post Number: 932 Registered: 11-2003 |
Why wouldn't people drive to church? They drive ung_dly distances everywhere else around here anyway, and almost every time I say I don't want a commute larger than 20-25 minutes people think I'm crazy and odd because "it's part of the price you pay to have a good life" to commute 35-50 minutes each way (unless, of course, I'm dodging fallen power lines with Gannon). I believe in piety and sacrifice, but not the sadomasochism of taking time away every day from my friends, family, dog, and myself for some "ideal" when there are plenty of "idyllic" houses within a preferably 25 minute radius (with traffic, no traffic 20 minute) of work. Is it g_dly to have a 40 minute each-way commute when perfectly good houses are 20 minutes away? Imagine the good works one could do if instead of a commute they made the choice to serve G_d(s) of their choice or their community during that time? Not only would they save money but gain spiritually, too, even if they don't believe in God. One could meditate, for instance. Not to get on the judgmental soapbox, but maybe I just did - I apologize. Am in rant-y mood today. | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 270 Registered: 04-2008 |
The Apostles all met in one [Honda] Accord. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 5710 Registered: 12-2005 |
Telecommute? I Googled "online church" and found 199,000 hits. It may seem cheesy but hey, there it is. | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 832 Registered: 11-2006 |
Im not superstitious, live in a walkable community and will soon be buying a bike. If you want to do the right thing and help fellow human beings donate money to medical research. |
