Discuss Detroit » Archives - July 2008 » New DDOT signage on Grand River « Previous Next »
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Parkguy
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Username: Parkguy

Post Number: 284
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 8:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I spotted new route information signs at some bus stops on the Grand River route today, at least on the eastbound side. I saw signs at Telegraph, Lahser, McNichols, and Evergreen. I didn't pull over, but it appears that the signs list the route and major stops. Nice to see-- people on this board have been screaming about it for months (at least). Any other info on this?
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Parkguy
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Username: Parkguy

Post Number: 286
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 8:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I looked at the DDoT site, and the signs are part of the new express service on Grand River. That's something else we've all said was needed.
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Toog05
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Username: Toog05

Post Number: 189
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 8:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here are some links discussing the details of this new express routes...

http://www.clickondetroit.com/ news/16621879/detail.html

http://www.ci.detroit.mi.us/De partments/DetroitDepartmentofT ransportation/BusInformation/E xpressService/tabid/2071/Defau lt.aspx
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Michigansheik
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Username: Michigansheik

Post Number: 312
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 9:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

useful signs, woah!
hope these routes take off, and they add E. Jefferson too.
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Living_in_the_d
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Username: Living_in_the_d

Post Number: 270
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 10:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, D.D.O.T. Is On The Move.
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Mayor_sekou
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Username: Mayor_sekou

Post Number: 2453
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 1:21 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I didn't even know they had fare cards. Shows how long its been since I rode the bus.
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Peter
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Username: Peter

Post Number: 157
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 1:49 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The DDOT website looks like it was designed by a 3rd grader.
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Sean_of_detroit
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Username: Sean_of_detroit

Post Number: 793
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 1:52 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So, it's looking more and more like anywhere along the spokes are safe bets on public transit? Is it still to soon to make a prediction like that?

Or

Maybe that is common sense and the timetable is what is questionable?
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1372
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 10:08 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sean, there's excellent transit (as far as a bus-only system goes) along Woodward and Gratiot, pretty good along Fort Street and Michigan, and good along Grand River (if you're in Detroit).

Off the spokes, if you're in the 'burbs count on once-per-hour at best in most cases, but in Detroit there are several good lines with 20 minute or better service most of the day: Greenfield, Seven Mile, Dexter, Fenkell just to name a few.
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Living_in_the_d
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Username: Living_in_the_d

Post Number: 272
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 10:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, Well Said Professor S., And Well Put.
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Parkguy
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Username: Parkguy

Post Number: 288
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 10:29 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wonder if they've considered express runs in and out on game nights?
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 6710
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 12:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ah, the DSR is rising from the dead. Funny what a market will do for service.

jjaba, on The Dexter crossing Fullerton.
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Mdoyle
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Username: Mdoyle

Post Number: 449
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 2:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There are plenty of little and inexpensive things that DDOT can do to make riding the bus easier and more accessible. Short list...

1.Updated website with more accurate trip planner and more user friendly layout and option of reading the site in Spanish.

2. More places to purchase fare cards (automated). They should be as easy to find as an ATM (at ofice building downtown, gas stations etc.) and should accept cash and credit.

3. Every bus shelter should have a map inside it detailing routes and times.

4. Color coded routes. This would be especially helpful to the elderly, illiterate and non english speakers.

A less useful and fairly expensive option would also be a re branding. New colors, new logo. As it is the DDOT logo colors are hard to see from a distance as they blend in with the surroundings (green and yellow on white). Also there is a bad stigma associated with DDOT and it may benefit to market the NEW DDOT to boost confidence, especially during the current fuel crunch. This would be the most costly of changes (new signage,repainting of buses, new letterhead etc.)
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1375
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 2:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mdoyle, a couple of things are happening. Taking your very good points in order:

1. The web site is quite up to date (not the "ridedetroittransit" one which appears semi-abandoned, but the one through the City's web portal), and the trip planner appears to work fairly well in most cases. I would like to see a combined DDOT/SMART/PeopleMover trip planner, but that's just me dreaming.

2. You can purchase fare cards at most City CVS stores and several other stores, plus on line.

3. DDOT is in the process of installing route information - but not bus times (because they change pretty frequently) - at shelters at major transfer points. Capitol Park already has them if you want to go take a look.

4. The routes are now color coded, and DDOT has just simplified the color coding.

Also, of course, the new express routes as discussed on this and other threads.

For my money the best thing DDOT could do is run more buses, more frequently, but that would take money which they do not appear to have.
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 305
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 11:53 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yay maps! Although the bus system in Detroit could use a lot of improvements, this is a positive step in the right direction. I’ve used similar rapid ride buses in other cities, and they make getting around much easier.

Next on my wish list: that SMART would post route numbers on the bus stops, so it’d be easier to tell which buses stop where.
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Detroitrise
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Username: Detroitrise

Post Number: 2504
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 11:54 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Evelyn, I believe they started this in downtown Detroit (already).
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 306
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So the length of time it’s been since I lived in Detroit is showing (blushes)

When did SMART start posting this, and is it just for downtown?

I remember one evening when my bike broke down on Michigan Ave near Dearborn, and I tried to catch a SMART bus back downtown. Watched three SMART buses pass me by, then gave up and pushed the bike home. Guess I was at the wrong stop, but I had no way of telling.
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Detroitrise
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Username: Detroitrise

Post Number: 2505
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Evelyn were you IN Dearborn, or in Detroit near the border of Dearborn?
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 307
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was in Detroit, near the border of Dearborn.
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Detroitrise
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Username: Detroitrise

Post Number: 2508
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yep, it's rather petty, but if you're in Detroit (no matter how close to the border you are), they won't pick you up.

They will only pick up in the city if you're headed out to the suburbs.

It's some type of law/agreement that involves DDOT.

(Message edited by DetroitRise on June 19, 2008)
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Islandman
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Username: Islandman

Post Number: 1626
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This thread reminds me of the good old days of catching the Imperial Express to Cass Tech.
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 308
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh. Duh. Thanks, Detroitrise. I’d caught SMART buses leaving Detroit, so I forgot they wouldn’t pick me up in the city. Stupid bus system.
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1376
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

They'll pick up in Detroit weekdays after 6:00 p.m. and weekends. This whole "not pick up in Detroit" only applies, by the way, on streets where both DDOT and SMART have bus service. Normally I'd say "just catch the next DDOT bus" but if you have a bike you're kind of outta luck.
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Dan_the_man
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Username: Dan_the_man

Post Number: 62
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would also really like to see DDOT jump on board with google maps for their trip planning. SMART did it a few months ago and it seems to work really well, but you can't use it for anywhere in Detroit because of a lack of DDOT in the system.
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1377
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree DTM. DDOT uses its own system, which works OK, but it'd be very nice to be able to plan a trip based on where you are and where and when you want to get somewhere, without having to worry about whether you're dealing with the red bus or the green bus.
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 309
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Professor-
So SMART will pick up, in Detroit, streets that DDOT doesn’t serve? (Outbound only, I’m guessing?) And does the after 6 pm thing apply to just streets that DDOT isn’t on, or all of them? (Sorry for all the questions, but I figured this would be good to know...)
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Living_in_the_d
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Username: Living_in_the_d

Post Number: 276
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, Professor S., " The being out of luck", Statement will have to be modified soon, to, Sayy.."Your in luck", Since D.D.O.T. is moving into the future with onboard bike carriers. Superb post as usual B.T.W..
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1378
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

SMART will pick up at any bus stop on all outbound trips except express buses, and drop off inbound at any bus stop. On streets where DDOT and SMART both provide service, SMART will not pick up in Detroit on inbound trips or drop off on outbound trips until 6:00 p.m. on weekdays.

On streets where SMART operates and DDOT does not, such as John R, SMART will make all local stops on all trips. Each SMART schedule has the exact details.

Living, I hadn't heard about bike carriers on DDOT buses. You have any idea when that's coming?
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Living_in_the_d
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Username: Living_in_the_d

Post Number: 277
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 12:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, This is hot off the presses, Professor S., Details still have to be worked out, But I think it would be safe to say this season.
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 311
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 1:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Professor-
Thanks a lot for the info! It'll be very helpful the next time I’m trying to get around in Detroit. I was probably just at the wrong bus stop at the wrong time, then.
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1379
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 1:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Evelyn,

The easternmost SMART bus stop on Michigan Avenue, in both directions, is on the west side of the intersection of Wyoming. It's got a SMART bus stop sign.

Living,

Great news! Looking forward to it. Being able to use the bike would shorten my commute a bit.

Prof. Scott
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Living_in_the_d
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Username: Living_in_the_d

Post Number: 278
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 1:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, Mine too Professor S., Enjoy!
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Miketoronto
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Username: Miketoronto

Post Number: 888
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2008 - 11:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The SMART policy of not stopping within Detroit to for local service makes sense though in many ways. By not stopping at DDOT stops to provide local service, SMART can offer a more rapid transit style ride for people going and coming from the suburbs. If they stopped everywhere it would be very slow.
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1381
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2008 - 11:21 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, Mike, in fact that's SMART's official explanation of why they do it. Unfortunately, it still doesn't work out to be very rapid. I think DDOT averages something like 18 MPH on its routes, and SMART averages something like 21 MPH. But if SMART made all the local stops on every trip in Detroit it would be even marginally worse.

If only someone could figure out how to put in trains like everybody else in the world has...
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Evelyn
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Username: Evelyn

Post Number: 317
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2008 - 12:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It makes sense that SMART wouldn’t make the same stops that DDOT does. But unless you plan your route in advance, or have access to the internet on your phone, trying to figure out what the buses do from the street is a bit of a lost cause. The new signs should help, though! And I’m keeping my fingers crossed for bike racks on Detroit buses. Both positive signs...
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Bearinabox
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Username: Bearinabox

Post Number: 699
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2008 - 2:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

I would also really like to see DDOT jump on board with google maps for their trip planning.

They're working on it.
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Bjl7997
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Username: Bjl7997

Post Number: 122
Registered: 03-2005
Posted on Monday, June 23, 2008 - 10:33 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

They forgot about 1 more route Michigan Express (route #75)
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 1385
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Monday, June 23, 2008 - 12:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Michigan is not a major DDOT bus route, if you look at ridership or service frequency. They picked the top five routes for the express service, and Michigan isn't even close to the top five.

The five routes on which DDOT is trying out express service - Woodward, Gratiot, Dexter, Crosstown and Grand River - all have 5 to 12 minute frequency at peak hours (for the regular, local bus). DDOT's Michigan Avenue bus never comes more often than every 25 minutes. Fenkell, Fort, Jefferson and Greenfield (just to name a few) all have more frequent service and more riders than Michigan, and they didn't get express buses.
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Busterwmu
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Username: Busterwmu

Post Number: 500
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2008 - 11:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Some of the new signage is up on Woodward below Campus Martius now, too. Makes me wonder how long it will last given those sheets are only helps to signposts and streetlights with zip-ties.

I do wonder why Michigan isn't a busier DDOT route... maybe everyone is just taking the SMARTbus in. Personally, I'd rather be on a safe and reliable RTS coach than a Gillig, but whatever.

I was on the Woodward #53 route yesterday from Wayne State into Downtown and back again. The inbound bus I waited over 15 minutes for and was standing room only. The first outbound coach blew past me at the Grand Circus Park stop, but the next coach came about 3 minutes later and was mostly empty.
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Ladia
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Username: Ladia

Post Number: 39
Registered: 05-2008
Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2008 - 6:07 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

grandriver always had a fast bus service, ddot should have improved speed and service on other streets.grandriver and woodward already had good service,some streets eliminated bus service,some streets like 6 mile have always had slow bus service.another problem detroit has is that theirs not much public transit connecting the city with the suburbs, most city buses only go to city limits,or to malls.as far as it goes into the suburbs is to the malls.if you dont work at the malls,then you have to have a car.

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