Leob Moderator Username: Leob
Post Number: 2 Registered: 04-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 9:56 am: | |
According to popular belief and the owners, concrete panels and crests were stolen some years ago from the Grande Ballroom. I'll open for public comment recent events: This is an ad I found on a popular classified web site this week.... ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Detroit's Grande Ballroom had 14 windows with this architectural stone crest above each one. You can look in archive photos and see them. They are all sold off to private party except I have the last one. It depicts 2 griffins with a shield in between. It weighs about 300 lbs and can still hang since it has the iron hook piece in back which attached it to the building, or lean on a wall as a garden stone. I am moving out of state and think it should stay in Michigan. It could be valued at much more however I would like $600 or best offer before I leave. If this gets no response I will put it on ebay for local pick up- no shipping.
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Alley Member Username: Alley
Post Number: 271 Registered: 02-2008
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 10:03 am: | |
I would definitely be interested in hearing how this guy acquired these. Hm |
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup
Post Number: 4446 Registered: 06-2004
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 11:02 am: | |
The DPD might be, too. They got back the lion's heads from Lee Plaza. |
Nainrouge Member Username: Nainrouge
Post Number: 1832 Registered: 05-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 11:05 am: | |
He obviously damaged it in taking it off. He should be prosecuted. |
Sciencefair Member Username: Sciencefair
Post Number: 99 Registered: 10-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 11:47 am: | |
Is there contact information on the site? |
Eastsidedame Member Username: Eastsidedame
Post Number: 236 Registered: 12-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 12:21 pm: | |
Please tell the police about this. PLEASE! |
Django Member Username: Django
Post Number: 716 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 12:59 pm: | |
Wouldnt be to hard convince someone that they have something for sale and obtained it legally. Most theives running around dont have computers. Id bet this guy has been had, but who knows. Id be interested in finding out.. Its pretty stupid to go steal something then put it on the net. |
Registeredguest Member Username: Registeredguest
Post Number: 369 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 1:01 pm: | |
Looks like he also salvaged some bricks and a nice wrought iron railing. It's great that he's protecting our treasurers for all those future generations who have the desire to decorate their drywall palaces with little remnants of how great Detroit used to be... |
Rhymeswithrawk Member Username: Rhymeswithrawk
Post Number: 1231 Registered: 11-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 2:35 pm: | |
Yes, those were on the Grande: http://www.thegrandeballroom.c om/marquee_50s.jpg |
Rax Member Username: Rax
Post Number: 349 Registered: 11-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 2:42 pm: | |
Maybe someone should buy them for $600 and return them to the rightful owner? |
Diehard Member Username: Diehard
Post Number: 510 Registered: 03-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 3:19 pm: | |
"They are all sold off to private party..." Who, if this was legit, should have asked some questions. The building's still standing; that should be a big red flag. Wonder who did the selling and if it was done from the trunk of a car? |
Rax Member Username: Rax
Post Number: 353 Registered: 11-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 3:22 pm: | |
I just contacted the seller. Very interesting. |
Django Member Username: Django
Post Number: 721 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 4:24 pm: | |
Well, what did they say? |
Dianeinaustin Member Username: Dianeinaustin
Post Number: 38 Registered: 02-2008
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 4:37 pm: | |
Yeah, don't act like that. |
Eastsidedame Member Username: Eastsidedame
Post Number: 240 Registered: 12-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 6:01 pm: | |
Sounds like the "private party" is in receipt of stolen goods. The laws need to be changed regarding architectural theft in Detroit. Heavy, heavy fines. |
Django Member Username: Django
Post Number: 727 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 6:13 pm: | |
Theres a place almost on the corner of McDougall just on the north side of Forest (or it could be Warren, whichever is a one way heading East) This guy buys all kinds of stripped out stuff. Main sellers are addicts, main buyers seem to come with trucks and trailers from the burbs. Never a name on any of the trucks Ive seen. |
Leob Moderator Username: Leob
Post Number: 3 Registered: 04-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 6:29 pm: | |
Remember though folks, innocent until proven guilty. I corresponded with the owner on behalf of the Church that currently owns the building. We made the "no questions asked offer" that she donate it back in exchange for a write off receipt. She declined. After notifying the church of the outcome and cc'ng the appropriate parties the item was removed from sale and is no longer "available".... |
Wood Member Username: Wood
Post Number: 67 Registered: 05-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 6:51 pm: | |
I wish someone who corresponded with her would post her address so that a private party could go there and acquire the piece from her backyard and return it to the church. |
Lefty2 Member Username: Lefty2
Post Number: 1373 Registered: 07-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 7:18 pm: | |
99% She is moving it from her house after you called her. You should of said It would great on my backyard wall, When can I check it out to buy it. Then you go to her place and have the cops come in shortly after. |
Django Member Username: Django
Post Number: 729 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 7:28 pm: | |
Was she asked who she bought it from? Like Diehard said above about the sellers working out of a car trunk, or similar. |
Dianeinaustin Member Username: Dianeinaustin
Post Number: 39 Registered: 02-2008
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 10:34 am: | |
I tried to look on EBay but am not very familiar with it at all. Anyone who is good at searching their site should look for the piece since she said she would post it there. Can EBay be advised of the potential sale of stolen property? |
Retroit Member Username: Retroit
Post Number: 178 Registered: 04-2008
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 11:05 am: | |
The Church that owns the building has a duty to press charges. There is more than enough incriminating evidence of possession of stolen property in the ad. It is a crime to not report a crime, by the way. |
Chuckjav Member Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 586 Registered: 09-2007
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 11:50 am: | |
Salvage or Theft; in this case, what's the difference? |
Eastsidedame Member Username: Eastsidedame
Post Number: 246 Registered: 12-2006
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 12:11 pm: | |
The difference is: legal or illegal. |
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul
Post Number: 2545 Registered: 10-2006
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 12:43 pm: | |
Receiving stolen property could be a possible charge from the prosecutor. Works well when the police don't have evidence that a person stole something, but they do have a person in possession something stolen. |
Chuckjav Member Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 587 Registered: 09-2007
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 1:47 pm: | |
Regarding the question: salvage or theft? Please....the two go hand-in-hand; like peanut butter & jelly. Without all the disreputable salvage operators, thieves would be out of business. That's all. |
Sstashmoo Member Username: Sstashmoo
Post Number: 1589 Registered: 02-2007
| Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 1:53 pm: | |
Please....the two go hand-in-hand; How so? Thats like saying Walmart and shoplifting are responsible for one another. This person knew this was stolen some years back, thinking the heat was off and nobody gave a shit about Detroit, they figured they'd turn a fast buck on the way out. Scumbag. |
Eastsidedame Member Username: Eastsidedame
Post Number: 285 Registered: 12-2006
| Posted on Monday, June 09, 2008 - 12:57 am: | |
Seems like the police chief could use some good publicity. This case would get national coverage if solved, I promise. |
Detroitteacher Member Username: Detroitteacher
Post Number: 1293 Registered: 06-2006
| Posted on Monday, June 09, 2008 - 3:12 pm: | |
I found nothing on Ebay about this item. Will keep looking. |
Miketeevee Member Username: Miketeevee
Post Number: 52 Registered: 07-2005
| Posted on Monday, June 09, 2008 - 3:27 pm: | |
Did you try looking on Craigslist? The original post mentioned a "popular classified web site." Just a thought. |
Makeer Member Username: Makeer
Post Number: 3 Registered: 01-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 7:14 pm: | |
I find it amusing that in a city where the school board, the police department and most of the politicians are criminals you want to make this guy into one also. He has a piece of stone work with some history to this area, he wants to leave it here , but wants a honest busk for it. Whats the big deal? Call the police, check Ebay, Graigs List, stop him at all cost. Give me a break. You want to buy good if not it's not your place to make it the crime of the century. |
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 569 Registered: 06-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 7:21 pm: | |
I think we have here a great candidate for Brilliant Post of the Week. |
Downriviera Member Username: Downriviera
Post Number: 650 Registered: 02-2008
| Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 7:34 pm: | |
Makeer, Welcome to the forum. I don't think you understand the passion locals have for this landmark. Ground zero for bands like the MC5 and the Stooges, just to name a couple. Many greats played there. People come from around the world to visit the Grande. Its like the pyramids or Taj Mahal. |
Rjlj Member Username: Rjlj
Post Number: 566 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 - 12:16 am: | |
Well, drove by the Grande last weekend and I believe there is one last crest on the Grande but I bet that will be gone soon. Just goes to show how important of a place it is. Not to mention, this is how Detroiter's make an "honest busk" these days so I guess it is OK to steal. |
Bigglenlake Member Username: Bigglenlake
Post Number: 53 Registered: 05-2008
| Posted on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 - 6:03 am: | |
"Makeer, Welcome to the forum. I don't think you understand the passion locals have for this landmark. Ground zero for bands like the MC5 and the Stooges, just to name a couple. Many greats played there. People come from around the world to visit the Grande. Its like the pyramids or Taj Mahal." And I think we have one for Hyperbole. |
Eastsidedame Member Username: Eastsidedame
Post Number: 334 Registered: 12-2006
| Posted on Sunday, June 15, 2008 - 3:49 am: | |
Does anyone know the penalty if caught scrapping a building? Does a person have the right to shoot someone on their property who's ripping them off...and ask questions later? I am completely serious. I'm just interested in how seriously law makers take this crime. The police can't enforce what our law makers Can't or won't legislate. Discussion is important to solve a problem, but action needs to follow or it's just complaining. I'm looking for ways to make this stop. My dad was a bricklayer in Detroit from the 30s as a kid to retirement in the 70s. He called these rip-off artists, "vultures". Picking at the dead. Urban vultures. Pretty accurate, I'd say. I have to echo Bigglenlake's thoughts. This is a passionate subject for anyone who cares about our music history, as well as our old theaters. The Grande, along with the Eastown are a part of our music history as well. These buildings are to rock as Hitsville USA is to Motown. It was bad enough when they were boarded up and abandoned. Now they're being methodically raped into unrecognizable hulks, bit by bit. I look at it like this: This is our old-school street art on a 3D canvas. The unknown souls who created these are long dead. You just know these buildings weren't just slapped together in a couple of days. Detroit may not have much right now, but these buildings are definitely in the "asset" column. They give us a reminder our former greatness, the talent that lived and worked here, and the inspiration to reinvent ourselves, once again. |
Leob Member Username: Leob
Post Number: 121 Registered: 10-2005
| Posted on Sunday, June 15, 2008 - 1:07 pm: | |
I attempted to work with this individual on behalf of the current building owners. She was offered the opportunity to donate it back in exchange for a tax write off receipt for the perceived value - no questions asked. She declined, removed the item from Craig's list and claims she is no longer in possession of the crest. The owners have not yet made a decision to pursue the issue at this writing. There is some legislation in Lansing pending on metal theft, I'll try to post details of the bill. |
Detroitderek Member Username: Detroitderek
Post Number: 59 Registered: 09-2007
| Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 3:16 pm: | |
I've got to agree with eastsidedame ( and add the Vanity Ballroom to the list ) . What DOES the State do exactly to protect it's historical buildings? What is the penalty for stripping them? How do we as Michiganders protect these sites? |
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul
Post Number: 2590 Registered: 10-2006
| Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 5:36 pm: | |
It's not against the law to tear down a building on a historical the National Register, or State, or City (that is, assuming you have a demo permit). |
Bulletmagnet Member Username: Bulletmagnet
Post Number: 1342 Registered: 01-2007
| Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 6:44 pm: | |
I'm going to run out and buy it before the cops get on the trail. (I'm in no hurry) |