 
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 486
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:03 pm: |    |
I'm trying to figure out why you guys love Quicken so much. Do you all work for them? I understand that it's continually ranked one of Forbes top 100 companies to work for, but I didn't know they gave you all hand jobs on a daily basis to stand up for them so vehemently.
Fine, "let the buyer beware" is your argument. Then you must also believe it's ok to screw the buyer as long as you can get away with it. That's great justification.
You probably agree with Amway / Quixstar's business practices too, simply because they're located in MI. Both of those crooked companies could leave the state and do us all a favor. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 4711
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:10 pm: | |
Hmm, maybe because they are planning a move to Detroit that will be a milestone for downtown redevelopment? I really don't care what they sell or how they sell it.
Amway is bullshit, and it doesn't compare to selling loans. They make random odds and ends, and don't they hire peddlars Mary Kay style? Whatever. Obviously that west Michigan company doesn't really do anything for Detroit, so no, I'm not really into them. If they did, maybe I'd pay attention. I don't know who your other example refers to.
Nobody wants a city built on thievery, but I happen to think that selling money is perfectly legitimate. Modern economies are built on this system. Usury goes back to the 12th century, and even then I'm sure the more stupid people screwed themselves. |
Higgs1634
Member
Username: Higgs1634
Post Number: 395
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:18 pm: | |
quote:Usury goes back to the 12th century, and even then I'm sure the more stupid people screwed themselves.
Yes, but according to Dante there is a special place in hell for usurers. Once Quicken moves downtown, should we replace "Welcome to Detroit" with "Abandon all hope all ye who enter here."? |
Thnk2mch
Member
Username: Thnk2mch
Post Number: 1194
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:19 pm: | |
I am not a fan of Quicken itself, but I am a fan of the man. ( can I do that? )
I believe Quicken is part of the mortgage problems, but there is more to them than that.
"Rock Enterprises" represents a lot of different things, and will be around awhile. IMO, they will move downtown as such. |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1880
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:26 pm: | |
The home loan industry was truly stacked against the borrower. No amount of vigilance, IQ or awareness could head off a loan broker that sees selling you a loan that has ARMS, pre payment penalties and higher interest rates then you should be paying as a means of putting money in his pocket. I interviewed for one of these jobs when the mortgage biz was doing well, and my conscience would not allow me to take such a position where I have to rely on duping people to make money. I guess the solution is to retain a real estate attorney to walk you through the process and make sure you are not getting screwed over. But most people can not afford $5Gs in attorney fees, I know I'd rather put that to my down pmt if I had it. |
Chuckjav
Member
Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 520
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:35 pm: | |
Caveat Emptor....Indeed!
http://www.consumeraffairs.com /finance/quicken_loans_mortgag e.html
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2002/12 /quicken.shtm
Hitch Detroit's wagon to this Donkey? |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 522
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:48 pm: | |
Ok, lets put this into perspective. QL closes somewhere around 10,000 loans/month. Look them up on the Better Business Bureau. There were 590 complaints filed over a 36 month period (all of which it states have been resolved). That averages about 16/month, or about 1/10th of one percent of all loans originated had complaints filed. I don't care what business you are in, that is a pretty good record. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6403
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:54 pm: | |
quote:No amount of vigilance, IQ or awareness could head off a loan broker that sees selling you a loan that has ARMS, pre payment penalties and higher interest rates then you should be paying as a means of putting money in his pocket.
Really? "Sorry, I've had better offers than this." worked just fine for me. |
Scs100
Member
Username: Scs100
Post Number: 1537
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:55 pm: | |
quote:Then you must also believe it's ok to screw the buyer as long as you can get away with it. That's great justification.
It is ok to screw the buyer Spacemonkey, because the buyer shouldn't be stupid enough to walk into a situation without some knowledge. If they walk in completely blind, then screw 'em. It's their fault. The only exception should be is when someone has just moved to this country and can't understand what is happening to them. |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1882
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:58 pm: | |
They do get you over a barrel though, they can tell if you are talking to other banks or not as every time your credit is checked it shows on your credit report. Which by the way lowers your score, the inquiries that is. |
Alan55
Member
Username: Alan55
Post Number: 1618
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:07 pm: | |
Getting back to the subject of the thread, I am very glad that Matt Cullen signed on with Quicken, and is staying in Detroit / Michigan, rather han seeing a headline where he accepted a job with an equivalent Boston / Miami / Houston corporation.
No one person can claim to be the one force behind Detroit's rejuvenation, but at least Cullen can claim a large share of the credit. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6405
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:08 pm: | |
Cambrian, partially true, but there is more:
Why are you punished for credit inquiries?
quote:Punish may be a somewhat harsh word. A credit inquiry typically lowers your score by five points or less. In addition, credit inquiries stay on your credit report for 24 months, but are only calculated into your score for 12 months.
Fair Isaac Corp. (FICO) does take into account that comparison shopping is a smart thing for consumers to do when obtaining credit for a car loan, mortgage or a credit card with better terms. As a result, credit inquiries are not included in your credit score for the first 30 days from the date of inquiry. So, as long as you secure the credit for which you are shopping within 30 days, none of the inquiries will affect your credit score for that particular loan.
Once the 30 days has expired, the FICO scoring model includes all inquiries for the same type loan within that 30-day period as one inquiry, not multiple inquiries. For example, if you decide to go shopping for a new car and visit four different dealerships and you allow all of the dealerships to pull your credit report, your score will only be reduced by five points not 20. Besides, the inquiries are not included after 12 months. Will you really need more new credit or another new car within a year?
Comparison shopping won't necessarily heard your credit score, and none of it hurts your score long term. So it's far better to shop around as much as possible (since these inquiries are purposefully delayed to allow such), than to end up with a loan that isn't as good as you might have gotten.
http://www.creditcards.com/cre dit-card-news/credit-guy-credi t-inquiries-1272.php |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 523
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:08 pm: | |
"They do get you over a barrel though, they can tell if you are talking to other banks or not as every time your credit is checked it shows on your credit report. Which by the way lowers your score, the inquiries that is."
You are Wrong. Not when the inquiries come from mortgage companies or auto loan companies. Check for you yourself. Scroll down to the section that talks about rate shopping.
http://www.myfico.com/CreditEd ucation/CreditInquiries.aspx
This site is for MyFico.com, a division of Fair Issac. they developed the credit reporting system. |
Chuckjav
Member
Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 521
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:11 pm: | |
Nice...very nice.
Detroit already has a Mayor who screws the people; now several Detroiters are advocating a potential downtown business-anchor with an equally voracious appetite for screwing people.
Good for Detroit? |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1883
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:13 pm: | |
Good website Kid, but it's the other way around, Mortgage and Auto loan inquiries DO affect your FICO score, according to your referenced website:
"Inquiries that count toward your FICO score.
There is only one type of credit inquiry that counts toward your FICO score. When you apply for a mortgage, auto loan or other credit, you authorize the lender to request a copy of your credit report. These types of inquiries, prompted by your own actions, appear on your credit report and are included in your FICO score. " |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 489
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:16 pm: | |
Wow. All of this is good news. I'm learning here that it is socially acceptable to dupe people out of their money, since it's their fault for not being aware to begin with.
I'm going to be a millionaire.
I'm going to start swindling the elderly today. It probably doesn't matter what I sell them, they'll buy. And heck, they had 80 to 90 years on the planet to have learned not to be so darned gullible.
I just need to find some loophole in the laws that will make my scheme legal even if overtly fraudulent. |
Detroitmaybe
Member
Username: Detroitmaybe
Post Number: 103
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:17 pm: | |
I'm sure that all of those that subscribe to the buyer beware theory feel that way until it happens to them!!
When I was in college i worked at Budget Rental Car and it was required for us to review the contract with all of our customers before they would sign. That process was changed and it was no longer required for us to explain all details, and so customers really had little or no idea that in the fine print it said that if they did not except insurance not only were they required to pay double the price of gas at the time if it was not returned back with a full tank....but, that if the car was damaged they were responsible for the full value of the car if they did not the insurance that was offered.
or when I worked for the cell phone company that customers signed that required them to automatically be enrolled in a 2 yr contract every time changed their calling plan.
All, I'm saying is that..yes, although it is definitely the buyers responsibilty to review anything that sign their John Hancock on...but, a company knowlingly (as Quicken did) solicits customers, and preys on their naivete and vulnerability, that type of unethical, unscrupulous behavior will come back around in some form or another!!
BTW....I worked for Worldcom around 99-2001, and I knew they were going down at some point...it was just a matter of time!! |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6406
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:19 pm: | |
quote:Good website Kid, but it's the other way around, Mortgage and Auto loan inquiries DO affect your FICO score, according to your referenced website:
Cambrian, read what I posted. Yes, inquires will affect your score (slightly), however for rate shopping purposes, they do not effect your score for 30 days. Which means you have a month to rate shop without any of those inquiries affecting the loan you are shopping for. Then, after the thirty days, all of those inquiries are counted as ONE INQUIRY, which typically is worth only about 5 points. 12 months later, it no longer counts towards your score. |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 524
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:20 pm: | |
Yeah, but 1000 mortgage lenders pulling your credit amount to one total inquiry counted against your score, which is nothing. Read it further down.
"What to know about "rate shopping."
Looking for a mortgage or an auto loan may cause multiple lenders to request your credit report, even though youre only looking for one loan. To compensate for this, the score ignores all mortgage and auto inquiries made in the 30 days prior to scoring. So if you find a loan within 30 days, the inquiries won't affect your score while you're rate shopping. In addition, the score looks on your credit report for auto or mortgage inquiries older than 30 days. If it finds some, it counts all those inquiries that fall in a typical shopping period as just one inquiry when determining your score. For FICO scores calculated from older versions of the scoring formula, this shopping period is any 14 day span. For FICO scores calculated from the newest versions of the scoring formula, this shopping period is any 45 day span. Each lender chooses which version of the FICO scoring formula it wants the credit reporting agency to use to calculate your FICO score." |
Ndavies
Member
Username: Ndavies
Post Number: 2981
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:21 pm: | |
quote:The home loan industry was truly stacked against the borrower. No amount of vigilance, IQ or awareness could head off a loan broker that sees selling you a loan that has ARMS, pre payment penalties and higher interest rates then you should be paying as a means of putting money in his pocket.
Total bullshit. If the consumer is stupid enough to be taking out a no money down adjustable loan, when fixed mortgages are at historic lows, they deserve what they get.
No down payment, balloon arms have valid uses. Purchasing the monster house you plan to live in for an extended period when interest rates are incredibly low is not one of them.
If you don't understand what you're buying don't buy it. The problem is these people are too stupid to know they don't understand what they're buying. If they had done even a few minutes worth of research they would have known they were making a mistake.
This is as much about greed on the consumers end, as it is a mortgage industry failure. Why should I, having made reasonable mortgage decisions, have to bail out the fools on both ends of the mortgage crises. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 4712
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:23 pm: | |
Spacemonkey and Chuckjav, stop dealing in generalities and pay attention to the numbers kid_dynamite posted regarding complaints. Ya'll are acting like Livernoisyard or something, trying to take away from the huge positive gains the city will be making (but at least he makes some statements that might be grounded in facts). Also, let's not turn this into moralizing. QL shares similarities with the lending industry as a whole. If you don't like them, I guess you don't like our system. That's your prerogative, but don't turn this thread into a sounding board for your complaints about our economy, and try to take away from Detroit's big catch in QL in so doing. |
Chuckjav
Member
Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 522
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:31 pm: | |
Mackinaw....my point is - Quicken Loans Inc. is not a Big Catch; nothing but smoke & mirrors.
False hope for Detroit. |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1884
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:32 pm: | |
"Total bullshit"
Yeah OK, ndavies how many houses have you had to buy, and when? I'm guessing it's been over fifteen years. I bought a house in 96 and again in 2003, night and day difference. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6408
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:36 pm: | |
I bought mine last year. Shopped around plenty. That's how I learned about the FICO rules I was just explaining. Thorough research. Shopped around quite a bit, Quicken was one place I called (actually talked to two different people there, because I knew somebody who worked there and gave them a shot after the first person). They couldn't give me what I wanted. Turned out my bank was the best bet. I refused any sort of adjustable mortgage from the get go. I know if I can't afford something now, it would be foolish to assume I could magically afford it five years from now. |
El_jimbo
Member
Username: El_jimbo
Post Number: 655
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:39 pm: | |
Chuckjav,
I couldn't disagree more. At a bare minimum, Quicken Loans represents 5,000 new downtown employees who will be frequenting and supporting city businesses and paying city income taxes.
Assuming an average income of $50,000 a year (Kid Dynamite will be better positioned to say how close that number is to the real average) Quicken employees alone will be paying a combined $3.125 Million in city income taxes. That isn't much in the grand scheme of things, but that is still $3 million the city wouldn't have without them. |
Chuckjav
Member
Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 523
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:47 pm: | |
Here is my offer: If Quicken Loans Inc. ever does come to Detroit....and...if Quicken Loans Inc. manages to stay in business (as Quicken Loans Inc.) - employing untold thousands of Detroiters; I will start a thread (on January 01, 2013) entitled - Chuckjav is Full of Shit. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6409
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:47 pm: | |
I'm curious...
When I'm watching commercials and I see some window company or furniture company offering NO PAYMENTS UNTIL 2012! NO DOWN PAYMENT! BLAH BLAH BLAH! I think, who are these people who think they will afford later what they can't afford now?
I'm wondering if those of you who are anti-Quicken are blaming the company instead, for offering these things? The exact opposite of what I am thinking.
Everybody is looking for ways to take your money. It has always been that way. Be on guard. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 4713
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:48 pm: | |
Agreed, EL_Jimbo. Not only will one parcel receive a new building, but several parcels are poised to see some type of development related to QL. Additionally, now-abandoned buildings like the Whitney and Stott have a better chance to be re-used again with more potential workers looking for downtown housing.
Downtown is also at a tipping point. It's reasonably busy, and perceptions about it are reasonably good, but it needs an extra push to fill in all the vacant storefronts, and to really bear witness to the idea that its a great place to work, and that downtown is a smart place to work or live in today's landscape (of high fuel prices, etc.). You can't lose.
Certain neighborhoods will still languish, but at least the odds won't be stacked as high against them, because there will be more to go around. People downtown pay taxes that go across the city.
(Message edited by mackinaw on April 29, 2008) |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 525
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:48 pm: | |
Right on, El jimbo. Keep in mind, we are talking about about a lot more employees than just QL. Potentially some to all of the other entities Dan has ownership in will come, too. I am baffled how some of LivernoisYard proteges here don't realize that this is one of the biggest pieces of positive news for the city in while. |
Ndavies
Member
Username: Ndavies
Post Number: 2982
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:48 pm: | |
Cambrian, LOL, You're kidding right. I suppose that's why you believe what you do. A complete lack of experience.
I currently own more homes than you've bought in you entire life. I'm currently working on financing my latest project. (Notice I say project and not home.) It's a great time to buy.
(Message edited by ndavies on April 29, 2008) |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 526
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:53 pm: | |
"Here is my offer: If Quicken Loans Inc. ever does come to Detroit....and...if Quicken Loans Inc. manages to stay in business (as Quicken Loans Inc.) - employing untold thousands of Detroiters; I will start a thread (on January 01, 2013) entitled - Chuckjav is Full of Shit."
So, hiring Matt Cullen was just a move to figure out how to downsize all of the QL offices back to the headquarters in Livonia? |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1885
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:54 pm: | |
"I currently own more homes than you've bought in you entire life. "
That tells me a lot, thanks. Money is indeed a great insulator against reality. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6411
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 2:58 pm: | |
Already on this thread, some good information has been given. Why argue and fight? Ndavies has experience, that makes him a potential resource. It does not insulate him from reality. Others here could ask those who have experience for tips, when considering their own purchase. I would be happy to share what I know from my LIMITED experience with fellow forumers. But I did as much research as I could, so if it can help, great. |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 491
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:02 pm: | |
I'm tired of paying on my high mortgage and have been thinking about letting my home go into foreclosure. But my conscience wouldn't let me do so until now; even though I'm presently laid off and struggling.
But you've all convinced me that it's ok and acceptable to say f-- it and let the bank deal with the loss. Heck, they knew what they were getting into in the deal. They new the risk. Plus I paid PMI to cover them anyway. I feel cool with this new revelation.
My credit is spotless, like 780, this hit won't make a bit of difference. Wells Fargo bank just got their house back minus 75 grand of it's value. Serves em right for being so gullible to think I'd do my best as an American to help another American. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6415
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:07 pm: | |
quote:My credit is spotless, like 780, this hit won't make a bit of difference.
How do you figure this? |
Chuckjav
Member
Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 524
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:15 pm: | |
Johnlodge, you are a good man.
I'm not solving any problems by betting against the longevity of Quicken Loans Inc - like some sort of myopic commodities broker.
That said.....
I'll hold to my 01-01-13 bet; lest I come across as a welcher. |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 493
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:19 pm: | |
Sadly, I'm not kidding this time. My wife and I have been discussing short selling or foreclosing with our realtor. I've been using my 401(k) $ to make my mortgage.
But this thread has convinced me that it's ok to screw the other guy in today's America. And you're right; why should I try to do the right thing for the bank when mortgage companies and banks don't care to do right by me?
I will foreclose. My credit rating will be knocked like 30 points according to the last mortgage guy I talked to (was he lying? Maybe.) I will rent for the next two years, then my record will be clean and I will buy. But probably in Florida. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6418
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:24 pm: | |
Spacemonkey, if you have to forclose because you can't make your payment, that is that. Don't put yourself into ruin to "do right" by the mortgage company. They are a company, and perhaps they gave you a loan they shouldn't have, or purchased your mortgage from whoever sold your loan when it was not a good investment. Their investment is a risk, much like yours is. So while I think you are saying what you are saying as a statement that there are no more morals left in the world, I would say morals should not be guiding your investment decision in the first place, at least in this instance.
On the other hand, perhaps they would rather work with you right now than end up with another house they can't sell. I'm sure you've looked into that though. |
Bobceng
Member
Username: Bobceng
Post Number: 94
Registered: 04-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:26 pm: | |
I wouldn't take ANY advice from a mortgage guy. Can you qualify for Legal Aid or pay for an hour with a decent lawyer? (never thought I'd use those two words next to each other!) It sounds like you've been doing the research, but I'd be real sure before making any moves. Do you know anyone else who has actually gone through this? |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1887
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:29 pm: | |
"Sadly, I'm not kidding this time. My wife and I have been discussing short selling or foreclosing with our realtor. I've been using my 401(k) $ to make my mortgage"
This is going on all the time. My neighbors' just walked away from thier house for something smaller in Sterling Heights. You line up the loan for the cheaper place before you start missing payments on the original house. Once you secure the loan, you bail on the more expensive house. By this time you're all ready in your new place, so what to do you care that your credit is bruised for a couple of years? This gets the home owner out of a bind, but fucks everyone in the neighborhood by lowering the property values even more when the bank unloads it for next to nothing at a real estate auction. |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 529
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 3:33 pm: | |
Spacemonkey, ahhh the truth comes out. You voluntarily signed on to a mortgage that you couldn't afford. Times are getting very scary for you right now, and you can't bring yourself to believe that you could have possibly have been stupid enough to share any of the responsibility of your current mess. Someone else has to be entirely to blame. It can't be you, right? No way, you are a victim. I am sorry I was so rough on you, tiger. Now I understand. |
Ndavies
Member
Username: Ndavies
Post Number: 2983
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 4:41 pm: | |
Cambrian Spewed quote:That tells me a lot, thanks. Money is indeed a great insulator against reality.
First of all you have no Idea where I came from. I have money now, but that wasn't always the case. My family emigrated from Europe with two small crates. Every object we owned were in those two crates. 4 of us lived in a 1 bedroom 500 Sq Ft apartment for 18 months waiting for our Visas to be approved.
Why would anyone putting that much capital on the line not research what they are buying? I suppose that's why people pay 20% interest on the food they just picked up at McDonalds with that credit card.
I didn't realize having money invalidated someone's opinion on how to preserve that money. |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 494
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 4:49 pm: | |
I got laid off from my job with Chrysler. Is that my fault? I think not.
Plus I don't expect our housing prices or economy here in Detroit to improve for the next 10 to 20 years, so I need to take a desperate measure now.
My 30 year fixed loan at 5.5% is fine. But I can't pay it if I don't have a job, right? |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1890
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 4:51 pm: | |
"First of all you have no Idea where I came from"
Sure, but it's ok for you to remark on why I hold my opinions or venture a guess to what I've owned or not owned in my life. If things are going well for you, congratulations, but don't sit there and wonder why every one is not as charmed as yourself, it really is hard to stomach. |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 495
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 5:02 pm: | |
Dude you came all the way from Europe packed inside a small crate and you settled in Detroit? What a mistake. You're better off in Europe. This is not quite the land of opportunity. |
Mwilbert
Member
Username: Mwilbert
Post Number: 208
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 5:13 pm: | |
I would have a hard time telling you to keep to keep paying on your house if you are under water; this is strictly a business issue, and if the bank doesn't have recourse on your loan, that's a legitimate out for you. You may even be able to stay there for some time before you get tossed--I've seen stories of people staying for years.
However, I would be surprised if it only dropped your credit score 30 points. I've read numbers more like 100. After 12 months, based upon what I have read, your history becomes less important and your score would probably go back up some. |
Kid_dynamite
Member
Username: Kid_dynamite
Post Number: 531
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 5:17 pm: | |
30 points? Not a chance. You will sink down to near 500 or below immediatly. It will take a minimum of 2 years to recover to the mid six hundreds with reestablished credit and a spotless payment history, and that is a best case scenario. I say this as a matter of fact. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 4714
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 5:34 pm: | |
Spacemonkey, I don't really want to get involved here, but if you got laid off and now can't make your mortgage payments, wouldn't that be the fault of neither you nor your lender? That's just bad luck.
I don't understand why you're yelling at Ndavies like that. Are you so discontented that your questioning his/her family for coming to America? |
Rugbyman
Member
Username: Rugbyman
Post Number: 322
Registered: 06-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 7:10 pm: | |
Not to tack one more thing onto a circular argument here, but I think some people are confusing a sales pitch with fraud. Predatory lending- outright fraud or half truths. Violating disclosure statutes. I don't think anyone's arguing for caveat emptor for true cases of fraud and "swindling."
But if someone just doesn't know any better and doesn't ask pertinent questions, well that's on them. There are resources all over the place for borrowers- not using them if you are new to the process is inexcusable.
Not trying to come down on you, spacemonkey, but I have to say that 5.5% fixed is actually a very good mortgage compared to what some people on the balloon or ARMs are dealing with. It really stinks that you were laid off, but that's not on you or the lender. Talk to Chrysler on that one.
Before walking away from the house, contact your lender and try to work something out. It's definitely in their interest to cut you a deal rather than get even further into the real estate business. If that fails, contact a bankruptcy attorney for a consultation. It'll likely only cost a nominal amount for the advice, but will pay off in money you save. If nothing else they can likely point you in a solid direction of free or low-cost legal aid. Anything's better than just folding the tent. Good luck. |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 497
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 7:45 pm: | |
Maybe I will short sell instead of foreclosure. |
Gistok
Member
Username: Gistok
Post Number: 6742
Registered: 08-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 8:39 pm: | |
Spacemonkey,
Have you talked to your mortgage company about other options? The banks do NOT want your house back. There are other options available... some banks will let you just pay the interest on your mortgage for a set period. Now granted that extends the life of your mortgage, but it might make the difference between foreclosure or not. |
Warrenite84
Member
Username: Warrenite84
Post Number: 309
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 8:55 pm: | |
Just a quick note to mention that some degree of government regulation is very likely in an attempt to instill faith in mortgage lenders. Those of you who sell securities, annuities, or insurance know what I mean. Selling these items requires many bonding/testing/licensing hurdles to jump through.
The mortgage industry can use this action to weed out bad actors and companies from unethical loan practices.
As far as QL goes, I am cautiously optimistic that they will fully follow through with their plans. I am rooting for their Statler/Tuller site for their headquarters. |
Sean_of_detroit
Member
Username: Sean_of_detroit
Post Number: 181
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 10:41 pm: | |
I can see that happening too Warren.
Their are so many ways to make money, soooo many FUN ways! Why lower yourself to cheating?
That being said, every one of us should know that the sea is full of sharks. The question is can you spot and swim with them, or are you going to be eaten? They are all playing a game, really! You have to learn the rules and the levels! It'll get easier once you do that. Keep trying to figure it out if you haven't.
So much emotion in this board on this topic.
Calm down, take a step back...and look at yourselfs. It's clear that some of you are posting out of clear emotion....right? Regain your level head...please.
Space,
It's a tough time for all of us right now. I have a sister who lost her house right now. I myself am having some financial problems too. I made mistakes... I did, I made some whoppers, let me tell you! I made my bed and I have to lay in it. But it's not a grave, and it's not my coffin. It's just an uncomfortable bed.
Bankruptcy is a way to handle it, maybe a good way, there is no shame in handling your business. If you have to, then get it over with.
There are some rough times ahead for all of us, even those of us who are convinced Detroit is going to pick up and do a 180. Handle it guys, come on, handle it! Figure out your strategy and get out of your messes. Their is a big mountain in our collective horizon, but we will climb it... together... and get past it quicker then we can ever imagine. WE ARE DETROIT DAMN IT! This is what we live for. We can make it through any challenge, we always have and always will. We all just need to keep our head up, and keep treading water. It's true, there will be some things that are going to make it hard to smile in the future, but we will all get through it.
You have to believe that...
If you don't...
You'll drown.
We sure do get dealt some crazy hands around here, don't we? You've got this! The storm won't last forever. That is the only thing I can say I KNOW!
Do me a favor this week. If your having one of these problems (if your not, then your gonna laugh at me, but whatever), think about it, maybe wright it down, tell yourself it before you go to sleep. Then sleep on it. If you do that long enough, you'll have your answer. You'll come up with it on your own. You will, you might not believe me, but you will. You will find the answer if you do this. Every hands a winner and a loser, like that song says. You just have to learn to play the cards right.
Of course, I'm just another nut in Detroit...right? Good luck!
Just my two cents. Please keep swimming guys! Maybe it was three cents. Maybe not?
I don't even know what I'm talking about anymore...god, I sound like a dang insperational disney charecter in this one...
It's a good day in Detroit...the Tigers Won, the Pistons Won, and the Red Wings are ahead!
Edited For Spelling
(Message edited by Sean_Of_Detroit on April 29, 2008) |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 500
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 9:19 am: | |
Good post, Sean. I like your insight.
Yeah, guess I was in a bad mood yesterday. I apologize to the group. |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1893
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 11:10 am: | |
Well, IMO those that ignore facts, statistics, News Headlines, and general common sense and proceed to tell some one who is getting tossed out of their house that the whole thing is really their own fault is asking for it. I mean what's next? Volunteering time at a rape crisis center just to tell victims if they would not dress so provocatively, or flirt too much this terrible thing would not have happened to them? |
Sean_of_detroit
Member
Username: Sean_of_detroit
Post Number: 188
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 4:20 pm: | |
Your right Cambrian, but everybody plays the fool sometimes...lol.
Spacemonkey, don't even sweat it, we all go through that shite around here. Some just hide it better.
There are so many good quotes from songs. I don't mean to annoy anyone. It's just nothing short of amazing that so much of that music comes from right here (Detroit/Michigan...same thing). I guess we need it more than anyone, and we listen to our own more than anyone else. LOL, we Detroiters can be so stubborn sometimes.
Only in Detroit... |
Bragaboutme
Member
Username: Bragaboutme
Post Number: 211
Registered: 02-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, May 01, 2008 - 4:17 pm: | |
good post Sean, if I was down and out that would've reminded me why there's reason enough to stay in the fight.
It isn't a poker song either to me, but you gotta know when to hold'em, and know when to walkaway.... |
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