Discuss Detroit » Archives - January 2008 » Article: "Destroying Detroit" « Previous Next »
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Cman710
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Username: Cman710

Post Number: 418
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:07 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.realclearpolitics.c om/articles/2008/04/destroying _detroit.html

"Detroit suffers from every possible malady except a plague of locusts, and that’s only because they find urban living uncongenial. The city has a revitalized downtown, but all around it, the city rots. Forbes magazine declared Detroit “America’s Most Miserable City,” on the basis of its unemployment and crime rates, among other things. The unemployment rate of 8.2 percent is the highest of any major urban area in the nation, and its homicide rate is higher than New York’s in the bad old days of the early 1990s."

I read this morning, and thought it might provoke some discussion on the Forum. The article takes an approach that, while Detroit would have suffered from many problems regardless, poor governance (personified by Coleman Young's time as mayor) has prevented the city from improving its lot.
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 7252
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:17 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Segregation, xenophobia and demarcation stabbed Detroit in the back and behold, our city is an example of American racism.
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Rooms222
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Username: Rooms222

Post Number: 98
Registered: 04-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:20 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

On another site, this column was titled "The City that Liberalism Ruined"

I almost posted it, and thought, Should it go in the Megathread or not? About half of it is about Kwame, but it concludes he is just a sideshow to the general decline of the city.
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English
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Username: English

Post Number: 684
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:26 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've been reading articles like this about Detroit all my life. I think journalism like this loses its shock value after a while. No one expects better of Detroit, and so we become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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Realitycheck
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Username: Realitycheck

Post Number: 562
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:32 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, what English said ^ in clear English.

Nothing to see here, folks. Move along now to something fresher.
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 7254
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:33 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Liberism didn't ruin Detroit. People from various generations did.
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_sj_
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Username: _sj_

Post Number: 2176
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:37 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ignoring the truth is no way to fix it.
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Realitycheck
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Username: Realitycheck

Post Number: 563
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:44 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Recognizing and reinforcing strengths is a more productive approach to civic improvement than wallowing in whines.

Just sayin'
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Cman710
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Username: Cman710

Post Number: 420
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:48 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree that this sort of negative journalism isn't helpful to the city. At the same time, it remains important to stay abreast of people's perceptions. Unfortunately, this article's view is the typical view. (It actually may be more favorable than typical, since it acknowledged the renaissance downtown).

We do need to recognize the problem to have a shot at fixing it.
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Karl
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Username: Karl

Post Number: 10247
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 10:56 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cman710 said:

"....this sort of negative journalism isn't helpful to the city."

Uh, forget negative journalism. THE FACTS aren't helpful to the city, even if no one bothered to report on it. It would be exactly the same city.

Unfortunately, no one ever studies the real problem:

The homes, and the attitudes taught/contained therein.

Bill Cosby gets it.

The majority of Detroiters don't.

Too bad - from the wealthiest city on earth - twice in history to a box of used kitty litter.
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Ongowwah
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Username: Ongowwah

Post Number: 27
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 11:24 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well stated Karl!
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Mrsjdaniels
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Username: Mrsjdaniels

Post Number: 767
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 11:45 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I hate to agree but this all very true. I love Detroit but it hurts me to see the city hurt.
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Illwill
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Username: Illwill

Post Number: 110
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 12:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For every negative article or comment that I read about the city, I read about 5 positive articles at the same time.

Don't believe the hype!
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Karl
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Username: Karl

Post Number: 10252
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 12:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Don't believe the hype!"

Yup, just drink the KoolAid, skip the flu shots and/or any warning signs.

What's going on inside Detroit homes is great, always has been, and hasn't hurt the city -

nor will it.

See you in Oz.
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 65
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 12:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I like when people say stuff like "don't believe the hype". I'm sorry but horrible city services, extremely high taxes, horrible high school graduation rates, teacher walk outs over the charter school offer, etc. are all facts... they are not hype... they are the facts and until we acknowledge the facts we can't get past them.
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Barnesfoto
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Username: Barnesfoto

Post Number: 4917
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

But who is Rich Lowry? Did he ever live in or even visit Detroit?

http://www.sadlyno.com/archive s/6585.html
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Spacemonkey
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Username: Spacemonkey

Post Number: 320
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't believe the hype. I believe my eyes. I was in Downtown Detroit just yesterday, drove down Woodward from the burbs for a job interview in the Ren Cen. The city is depressing and ugly; same as when I lived downtown in the early 90's, except maybe now there's a new building or two. Big deal. A little improvement is a start, but the city has a hell of a long way to go to be anything but third rate.
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Rb336
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Username: Rb336

Post Number: 5613
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

^my guess is you find strip malls - oh, excuse me, "lifestyle centers" and the bland Troy-style architecture "attractive"
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Detroitbill
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Username: Detroitbill

Post Number: 578
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well I have been in this city for 18 years ( with the exception of 3 in between) and have seen more negative descriptions of Detroit that I care to mention. I have also lived in three other major cities in my lifetime, all for at least 3 years. There is no doubt there are many negative things about Detroit but I am constantly seeing many positives, which re affirms my faith. The Downtown alone has made enormous progress in the last 5 years. I only wish many on here could have seen what living downtown was like in 1992. There is no comparison in the quality of life. Unfortunately many neighborhoods have gone in the opposite direction. I will continue to look for the positives, I only wish the media would recognize more.. Believe me , many , many of our problems exist in abundance in many "successful" cities, yet its citizens dont get worked up over it the way we do..They dwell on the positives, you really create your own image in certain respects.
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Realitycheck
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Username: Realitycheck

Post Number: 570
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Agreed: Detroit's glass isn't full of champagne.

Suggested: Rather than dwelling on some of the sad facts all (or even most) of the time, we can each try to see, support and spread the word about the not-so-sad facts about our city and region.

No, don't ignore or stop trying to fix what's busted. And no, optimism doesn't mean being a Pollyanna who thinks a miracle turnaround is right around the next corner -- yes, a corner that may have a broken streetlight.

A Chicago Sun-Times writer spent a few days here recently and spread the word Sunday about why "Detroit is no longer marginal," as noted in another thread today.

Crain'sDetBiz publisher Mary Kramer blogged yesterday, under the headline Not everybody is bailing on Detroit, about:
quote:

". . . the opinions of more than 150 under-30 people who want to be here and have suggestions for attracting more young adults.
If we ignore what they're telling us, it's at our own peril.
Besides, wouldn't you rather read comments from 20-somethings who feel good about living and working here than the latest chapter in the mayoral saga?


And in Feb., a young DetRegionalChamber staff member named Jacquie Trost blogged at MetroMode:
quote:

The only hope the City has is for us "cheerleaders" to talk about Detroit. Maybe then more people will come downtown, pumping more money into the local economy, creating more City jobs, justifying more reliable city services and amenities, ultimately attracting more people to move downtown.
In fact, I think an endorsement by a non-Detroit resident is a positive thing -- especially if that person has had negative experiences in the City. I’ve taken relatives and friends to areas downtown they never knew existed, to eat at restaurant they’ve never heard about, and to see new developments being built. Every time, those same people are surprised at what’s going on downtown, mentioning how they are now going to promote the positive changes in Detroit.
The only way to combat Detroit’s perception is through education.


I'm confident I'm not the only one here and throughout our region who'd also rather read or hear those kind of comments than unproductive, unconstructive suggestions that we acknowledge "horrible city services, extremely high taxes, horrible high school graduation rates, teacher walkouts over the charter school offer, etc." as a repetitive exercise in self-flaggelation that somehow will help us "get past them."

I acknowledge, OK? I'll also condemn or denounce or reject, if that's what it takes.

Enough.
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Iheartthed
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Username: Iheartthed

Post Number: 2934
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, when you have a city that is primarily inhabited by poor residents don't be surprised when you get a poor city!

No region in this country has fixed that. Other regions have only shifted the problem away from the city. The Detroit area did the opposite; they shifted the focus away from the city.
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Crumbled_pavement
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Username: Crumbled_pavement

Post Number: 310
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 1:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Realitycheck, you can't do both on this site. Either you only see the good or you only see the bad. A balanced view around here is not appreciated or respected.
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Spacemonkey
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Username: Spacemonkey

Post Number: 322
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 2:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Rb336, yes. Yes indeed I do find new construction, be it strip mall or other more attractive than dirty, busted out decaying structures. Who wouldn't?

I understand and appreciate the fact that some of the old Detroit buildings have beautiful designs, but whoop-dee-do. That doesn't mean much when the building are in ill repair and surround by filth. Give me a new strip mall over garbage any day.
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Cman710
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Username: Cman710

Post Number: 421
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 2:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think Crumbled_pavement made a fair point. Clearly, there are good things and bad about the city. Only by acknowledging both are we taking a realistic view of things.
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Dtowncitylover
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Username: Dtowncitylover

Post Number: 11
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Whoever wrote the article needs to get his dates correct. The riots happened in 1967 not 1968.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5692
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 4:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Remember when Compuware moved downtown? The newspapers churned out articles (probably written by Compuware...) stating that downtown would be resettled by Compuware and other CBD firm's employees, requiring academic DPS schools downtown to be built to handle all that influx. What happened?
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Viziondetroit
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Username: Viziondetroit

Post Number: 1596
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 4:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"I think Crumbled_pavement made a fair point. Clearly, there are good things and bad about the city. Only by acknowledging both are we taking a realistic view of things.

^^^That may be true but how many ways can one or does one want to bruise morale? We all know the facts... we get it! BUT, shouldn't we be solution oriented and also action oriented?
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Paulmcall
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Username: Paulmcall

Post Number: 843
Registered: 05-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 4:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'd like to see those five positive articles.
I'm all for good news.
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Illwill
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Username: Illwill

Post Number: 111
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 5:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think DetroitBill made a very valid point. Most big cities (including the 2 big ones) have many of the same issues that Detroit has, but you never hear the outside media taking swipes at them. One reason is because the surrounding areas support these other cities regardless of their ills. We need a more supportive region.
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Realitycheck
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Username: Realitycheck

Post Number: 572
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 5:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

. . . how many ways can one or does one want to bruise morale? . . . we get it!
Thanks for the echo, VizionDetroit. Solutions + actions trump wailing + whining -- anywhere, anytime.

Enough morale-bruising. More vision. (Or vizion
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Pam
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Username: Pam

Post Number: 3809
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Posted on Tuesday, April 01, 2008 - 5:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

I'd like to see those five positive articles. I'm all for good news.



Check this site regularly:

http://www.modeldmedia.com/

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