Masterblaster Member Username: Masterblaster
Post Number: 116 Registered: 03-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, January 30, 2008 - 11:52 pm: | |
Does anybody remember this fellow? With so much focus on the mayor of Detroit these days... It looks like Roman Gribbs is still alive. Do any of the old-timers have an opinions/thoughts/memories concerning the last white mayor of Detroit, who served from 1970 to 1973. The wikipedia article states that he resides in the SUBURBS! That's pitiful that we can't even get a former mayor to live in the city. Also, it looks like Detroit has a history of electing young mayors. Gribbs was only 45 when he become mayor, Cavanaugh was 33, and Kilpatrick was 32. Does anybody know why he didn't seek re-election? |
Deteamster Member Username: Deteamster
Post Number: 53 Registered: 07-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 12:01 am: | |
Gribbs narrowly won 257k-250k in 1970. He was Polish. He started STRESS, Stop the Robberies, Enjoy Safe Streets, which involved using police decoys in high crime areas to lure criminals. This was not only highly unpopular in the neighborhoods but led to 17 police killings in 1971 alone. By the time he was done in 1973, the city nearly had a majority African-American population, who especially hated STRESS. No way in hell he could have been re-elected. As one of his first orders of business, Coleman ended STRESS. Interestingly, there wasn't another police killing until the early 1980's. Oh yeah, and Gribbs laid the early planning for the Ren Cen, which most people associate with Coleman (and of course Coleman didn't mind taking credit for it). That's all I know about the guy. (Message edited by DETeamster on January 31, 2008) |
Whithorn11446 Member Username: Whithorn11446
Post Number: 191 Registered: 03-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 12:44 am: | |
"This was not only highly unpopular in the neighborhoods but led to 17 police killings in 1971 alone." It was highly unpopular in black neighborhoods. Many working class whites voted for John Nichols in 1973 because they wanted STRESS continued. Basically, by 1969 Cavanagh was politically dead. A significant number of whites felt he was a "do gooder" who failed to curtail crime and only cared about appeasing black residents. Meanwhile, many black residents were tired of Cavanagh and felt he was not doing enough to promote their interests at the City County building. Former Wayne County Sheriff Ray Gribbs saw an opening to run in 1969 and appealed to white voters that wanted the crime situation in Detroit addressed and to stop the hemorrhaging from the riots. After leaving office in January of 1974 he became a Wayne County Judge. By the way Gribbs never lived at the Manoogian Mansion and only used it for City of Detroit functions. Roman Gribbs lived in Rosedale Park for many years dating back to at least the mid-1960's and probably before then. I heard he moved in the 1990's to Northville. |
Gistok Member Username: Gistok
Post Number: 6235 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 1:32 am: | |
Ummmm, I think you're going to have to qualify that statement about no "police killings until 1980". It doesn't make 100% sense. Do you mean no "undercover police killings of citizens?" |
Thoswolfe Member Username: Thoswolfe
Post Number: 8 Registered: 11-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 2:34 am: | |
Roman Gribbs- Oh I've been blasted before for my opinions on his term as mayor. Detroit was losing too much population after the riots and his focus/solution was on law enforcement. Pity he did not focus on courts/criminal justice instead. Even bigger pity that Detroit failed to elect a man with a civic and accounting background- Richard Austin. And Detroit's loss that Richard Austin was secure as Mich Secretary State by 1973. <<< The wikipedia article states that he resides in the SUBURBS!••• That's pitiful that we can't even get a former mayor to live in the city. <<< Not a big issue, is it? After retirement most city workers also moved outside Detroit. And that's not unique to Detroit- Eventually McNamara left Livonia and moved to the Northville area. |
Deteamster Member Username: Deteamster
Post Number: 54 Registered: 07-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 9:53 am: | |
Sorry, that's from my notes from a long time ago. That's all I have down and can remember. Go to the library or something and qualify it yourself. |
Danny Member Username: Danny
Post Number: 7101 Registered: 02-2004
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 10:22 am: | |
Deteamster, In 1973 Detroit officially did not have a majority black population. It was 44%. Detroit was still majority white 52% while the Hispanic population was a mere 1.9%. Detroit didn't become mostly black until 1975 when it reached 51%. After mayor Gribbs left. Coleman A. Young became the first black mayor of Detroit recieving 88% of the black vote and and 10% of the white vote. The majority white population in Detroit voted for John Nichols. The 10% white vote made Coleman Young Mayor not the growing black Detroit community itself. |
Rb336 Member Username: Rb336
Post Number: 4885 Registered: 02-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 11:14 am: | |
Gribbs was my dad's tennis partner, still around last I heard. don't know when he retired as a judge. I know he did an interview with Jack Lessenbery a couple years ago |
Fury13 Member Username: Fury13
Post Number: 3737 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 11:24 am: | |
Basically, by 1969 Cavanagh was politically dead. A significant number of whites felt he was a "do gooder" who failed to curtail crime and only cared about appeasing black residents. Meanwhile, many black residents were tired of Cavanagh and felt he was not doing enough to promote their interests at the City County building. I'd say that Cavanagh also became the scapegoat for the '67 riot. That was an albatross around his neck. Too bad, because his term of office began with so much promise. I believe he died while still a fairly young man. |
Paulmcall Member Username: Paulmcall
Post Number: 552 Registered: 05-2004
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 11:38 am: | |
Gribbs became head of Probate Court. He got out of Detroit while the getting was good. I remember when he was in Rosedale Park. I also saw Cavanaugh go to St. Mary Redford Church in the morning when he was Mayor. |
Omaha Member Username: Omaha
Post Number: 96 Registered: 12-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 2:55 pm: | |
Two people who went to court to stop STRESS were Ken Cockrel Sr. and Justin “Chuck” Ravitz. They were able to document instances of some of the 20 people eventually shot and killed by STRESS. Some deaths resulted from running from police. But in some instances, the coroner’s report showed bullets entering the chest and exiting through the back. As I remember it, John Nichols and the police were at a loss as to how to explain those results. |
Thoswolfe Member Username: Thoswolfe
Post Number: 9 Registered: 11-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 7:58 pm: | |
Omaha: Was STRESS stopped by court order or Executive Order(CAY?)I remember all the court cases, but can't recall what stopped the program. They're a little short on manpower these days, but I bet the city of Omaha would consider doing the same in NE Omaha. Depends on who they appoint chief, I guess. (Yep, Aksarben area,moved here last April) |
Omaha Member Username: Omaha
Post Number: 97 Registered: 12-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 11:44 pm: | |
Thoswolfe – Welcome to the forum. And welcome to Detroit. The blue sky, fluffy white clouds, and hills of Omaha are all part of your past. Cold crisp winters that you can actually put on enough clothes to enjoy the outdoors, also gone. Welcome to grey overcast nearly all winter long. Say so long from being able to drive from one end of the city to the other at rush hour in 35 minutes. In my adult years, I have never been through a colder winter in Nebraska than a week of 15-20 degree days with enormous humidity I experienced in the Motor City. I could rarely put on enough clothes to stop the humidity from cutting through them and chilling me to the bone as I walked around Wayne State in grad school. As a youth the cold must not have been so problematic. I remember enjoying skating around the inland water way on Belle Isle on the coldest day of the year. My opinion changed as an adult. Anyway, the story of STRESS is, in my opinion, the story of an “extra-legal” solution to a real crime problem. I hope that such a thing is never repeated anywhere in the U.S. Having said that, let me add that all history is told and written with a bias. The bias is found in what is included and excluded. And in what is emphasized and deemphasized in the telling. Unfortunately not all tellers of history are clear about their bias up front. There are many pieces describing STRESS. I am impressed that you were able to keep up with the stories of over 30 years ago from Omaha. I can’t remember how it ended. The publicity associated with the work of Cockrel Sr. and Ravitz did a great job of exposing injustice. There was also something about some Cop vs. Cop shootings associated with STRESS if memory serves me. Google it and read the many versions of the program and decide for yourself. BTW, Justin Ravitz was also a native Nebraskan who was transplanted to Detroit. |
Silas Member Username: Silas
Post Number: 172 Registered: 12-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 11:47 pm: | |
From what I remember of stress, the cops sent out a vulnerable looking person as a decoy in areas where there were reports of several muggings in the past. They surrounded the decoy with plain clothed police officers and waited for someone to mug the decoy. When the decoy was mugged, the police came out of hiding and confronted the mugger. Sometimes the mugger surrendered, nothing happened. Sometimes the mugger ran and was ran down and apprehended. Sometimes the mugger pointed his weapon at the cops and was shot. Muggings in those areas of the city fell during stress, and went back up to previous levels after Coleman Young took office and suspended stress. |
Thoswolfe Member Username: Thoswolfe
Post Number: 10 Registered: 11-2007
| Posted on Friday, February 01, 2008 - 12:51 am: | |
Hey Omaha- maybe I didn't 'clarify'. I'm a Detroit 'expatriot'. Left 4 years ago when times got hard.(Was I ahead of the curve?) I was in Detroit from 65- 2004, parents still there.I am in Nebraska now. Diverse state, huh? Gee Nebraska claims Gerald Ford (shouldn't it say birthplace of Leslie King?) , Malcom X AND Justin Ravitz, huh? Back on topic, I thought I recalled reading long ago Roman Gribbs had moved somewhere around Ann Arbor. His 'ancestral home' was the thumb of Michigan,Huron County, Gryzb family I believe. (It was mentioned from time to time around Bad Axe when I lived there in 90's) |
Eastsiderules Member Username: Eastsiderules
Post Number: 16 Registered: 01-2008
| Posted on Friday, February 01, 2008 - 1:05 am: | |
Bring back STRESS! |
3rdworldcity Member Username: 3rdworldcity
Post Number: 1005 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, February 02, 2008 - 4:59 pm: | |
Silas is correct. Stress was established as a crack- down on Black - on - Black crime. It was very effective. The WCCT ruled it was not entrapment as I recall. Street crime went way down. Then, the do-gooders got involved and CAY pandered to the vocal minority and stopped the program. Crime escalated rapidly back to its former level. As usual, Detroiters got what they wanted and what they deserved. And they'll keep KK in office and get more of the same. Gribbs moved to Brighton and lived on am area lake, where I last saw him in about 1987 |
The_rock Member Username: The_rock
Post Number: 2119 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Saturday, February 02, 2008 - 5:18 pm: | |
I sat with Roman Gribbs ( whom we call Ray) at the Mediation hearing dinner two years ago. He looked fine, and appeared in good health.. I thought he was a good mayor, a good sheriff, a good Circuit Judge and a good appellate jurist, too. I always felt I had a fair shake when I appeared before him. I did not see him at the dinner last October. His good buddy, Judge Cynar, passed away last year. That's all I can tell you. |
Paulmcall Member Username: Paulmcall
Post Number: 558 Registered: 05-2004
| Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2008 - 11:41 am: | |
The worst thing about STRESS was a rogue cop named Peterson. He shot a guy on a freeway and placed a gun (or knife) next to him when he discovered his victim wasn't armed. STRESS cops unfortunately did their jobs too well. Too many brothers were getting killed and that raised eyebrows. The white cop history of bashing blacks heads in the city worked against them when Coleman took over. I remember talking to a cop and they used to follow old folks on check day and caught many a mugger who stalked them on the way to the bank. This was before direct deposit. |
Chuckjav Member Username: Chuckjav
Post Number: 347 Registered: 09-2007
| Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2008 - 12:05 pm: | |
What I remember most about the Roman Gribbs administration was the election itself; a young Detroit civil servant (name escapes me) had just introduced an "innovative" punch card balloting system. Sure enough, a "hanging chad" controversy ensued; some thirty years prior to the debacle in Florida, during the 2000 Presidential election. |
Docmo Member Username: Docmo
Post Number: 329 Registered: 10-2005
| Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2008 - 5:16 pm: | |
I dated his daughter a couple of times. They lived in Rosedale Park. Met him once. He was quite pleasant to the young guy taking his daughter out for a date. |
Detroitej72 Member Username: Detroitej72
Post Number: 646 Registered: 05-2006
| Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2008 - 11:21 pm: | |
Roman Gribbs was also the first and only Polish mayor in Detroit's history. As I recall, he kind of "fell" into the nomination for mayor, as he was well known in the community. I read an interview him a few years back, and he said he had no intention of ever running for a second term. He was in essence, a caretaker mayor. John Nichols was his chief of police, who was picked by the powers to be to succeed Gribbs, however the voters had other ideas. As a side note, I read that after the 67 riots, Nichols was one of the few city officials whose reputation was enhanced because of his calls for a strong police presence to crush the rioters. |
Hagglerock Member Username: Hagglerock
Post Number: 483 Registered: 03-2005
| Posted on Monday, February 04, 2008 - 3:13 am: | |
Would courts uphold a program like STRESS today? It sounds similar to the "Dateline" program that catches all those sick pedophiles. The first-hand Detroit connections here are fascinating. Keep it up! |
Sumas Member Username: Sumas
Post Number: 17 Registered: 01-2008
| Posted on Monday, February 04, 2008 - 6:02 am: | |
went to wsu with his kid, paula. she lives in poland now. her husband's name is roman too. the family lived in rosedale park before and during his tenure as mayor. there was a cute news blurp about the sisters coming back into town and remembering manogian memories, not too long ago in the freep. gribb's lived in northville in the 90's. he was divorced from his 1st wife. no clue, where he lives now. |
The_rock Member Username: The_rock
Post Number: 2125 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Monday, February 04, 2008 - 9:24 am: | |
The current State Bar Directory lists Ray Gribbs residing on Waterweheel Court in Northville. |
Detourdetroit Member Username: Detourdetroit
Post Number: 366 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Monday, February 04, 2008 - 9:36 am: | |
any good photos of mayor gribbs? |