  Urbanoutdoors Member Username: Urbanoutdoors Post Number: 622 Registered: 11-2005 |
http://www.worldchanging.com/a rchives/007598.html This article seems to concentrate on the scenarios from a spending perspective. I see this also as a way to improve roads, create jobs, and encourage mass transit use in metro detroit to make that system much more profitable and more functional. | ||
Mikeg Member Username: Mikeg Post Number: 1286 Registered: 12-2005 |
Then you would agree that all fuel taxes should be spent on our roads and expressways and not diverted to other uses? | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 2819 Registered: 06-2006 |
I have lived in SE MI all my life and have never met anyone who doesn't use the roads and highways, nor who doesn't directly benefit from the commerce that the roads and highways make possible Seems like taxing all the residents of the state is the way to go... | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1653 Registered: 11-2003 |
our not are. I think we should find a way to make the roads more cost effective. Isn't the main argument against mass transit that it doesn't pay for itself? | ||
Aiw Member Username: Aiw Post Number: 6444 Registered: 10-2003 |
Thanks Gumby, I spent a few minutes trying to make sense of the title... | ||
Fmstack Member Username: Fmstack Post Number: 12 Registered: 06-2007 |
It seems to be pretty much the settled opinion among transportation planners that making a road toll causes more problems than it solves. The only type of road charging that I've ever heard good things about is congestion charging, like London has, and there's just nowhere in the area that gets remotely like the level of traffic needed for that to make sense. | ||
Ray Member Username: Ray Post Number: 1046 Registered: 06-2004 |
The Jesus, I agree with you but some people and business consume more road than others and therein lies the subsidy. Here's my favorite quote from a local Congressman: Trains are very romantic but they don't pay for themselves and we can't afford to subsidize them." | ||
Urbanoutdoors Member Username: Urbanoutdoors Post Number: 623 Registered: 11-2005 |
my fault on the spelling of our, I always check and make sure but I must have just woke up thanks gumby. I do see positives and negatives with tolls, but it would reduce congestion on freeways, increase urban density, increase the market for retail, increase the market for mass transit, and decrease dependence on on oil. I know it would never happen but its a nice thought. | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 1459 Registered: 04-2006 |
Mike G has made an astute comment. One of the main reasons that the roads are in as bad of shape as they are is that money is pulled out of gasoline taxes to be used for public libraries, pay Secretary of State employees, and transit. It is not a true user fee tax. Trainman, page 15 of the SMART report lists the State of Michigan as the second highest source of funding, double what it received from the federal government. You need to work on your argument, it is based on bad information. http://www.smartbus.org/Smart/ NewsInfo/2006%20Annual%20Repor t.pdf | ||
Trainman Member Username: Trainman Post Number: 574 Registered: 04-2006 |
Detroitplanner, Thanks for the information. I think SMART is very important to southeast Michigan which is why I'm fighting the large freeway projects. It appears that state money does not keep up with health care costs which is likely the primary reason Livonia lost bus service. So, much more needs to be done and if we all contribute and do more such as using SMART to go downtown for example then cities such as Livonia will want to opt. back in. The idea that the loss of local funding alone caused the loss of the SMART middlebelt 285 line is simple as it assumes the false belief that local tax increases alone is the only answer to improve and protect bus service. Revenue sharing is vital and essential to justify tax dollars to best serve the needs of everyone. Otherwise, the ability of SMART would be seriously compromised. This is because some areas need frequent bus service and other areas can not justify the expense. Our roads depend on revenue sharing and mass transit deserves the same respect. Your documents prove my case very well. So, thanks a lot for taking the time to send this and for your good post. It is this kind of information that we need but we also should care and help out both SMART and DDOT because if Detroit fails then Livonia fails too. The SMART opt. out of Livonia is proof of this that can not be disputed by anyone. | ||
Urbanoutdoors Member Username: Urbanoutdoors Post Number: 624 Registered: 11-2005 |
Could we have a multi county mass transit day? Where those that use the bus system could volunteer time to help those that don't learn how to use it? In a way like the national ride your bike to work day, but helping build a capacity for mass transit use. If nothing else it can raise awareness for demand for reliable mass transit in the metro area. | ||
Fmstack Member Username: Fmstack Post Number: 14 Registered: 06-2007 |
As someone new to the area, the idea of a "mass transit day" is appealing, but I think it would be more useful to make the bus system inherently more friendly for newcomers. The big, big, big thing would be to actually post route numbers and times at the stops. The impression I get from the lack of even so much as a route number at the stops is that if you don't already know when the bus is coming and where the bus is going, you've got no business being on it. (and frankly, the stories I hear about the DDOT buses is that it's straight-up true that if you haven't been riding those buses all your life, you're not welcome on them. I know that to a large extent those are just scared-suburbanite stories, but that means that the design of the system has to be just that much more user-friendly to get people to consider riding.) |
